Autopsy Geelong Loses to Swans by 2 points - Rd 7, 2021

Dec 10, 2003
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On the Couch:

All the numbers tell you Geelong had a comfortable win but there’s something to be said for accuracy.”

“We deal with absolutes in footy and Geelong lost the game so there can tend to be a bit of a knee jerk. But their game stood up. So the way they actually went about playing and setting up a victory they did everything right bar the execution in front of goal. So +35 expected score, it’s never looked so good and losing the game.”

“Sixty six times we’ve seen a team have this much of a domination and 66 times they’ve won.”

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Cataholic
you pick one
Turbocat

yep saw ..still the same stats, and were still out scored in 3 out of the 4 quarters.

What did Brown say that Leigh Matthews tell him about stats. Something like there is only one stat that counts
 

BotsMaster

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Wow - just watched on 360, the vision of the ‘not 15’ call - that ump really was insistent about it. Called it very early in the trajectory. ( at 9 metre mark of the 21.8 kick). Fair dinkum.
Scott -haircut looks better and he’s calm and looking more at ease. Good to see. Go Chris.
 
Dec 10, 2003
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Wow - just watched on 360, the vision of the ‘not 15’ call - that ump really was insistent about it. Called it very early in the trajectory. ( at 9 metre mark of the 21.8 kick). Fair dinkum.
Scott -haircut looks better and he’s calm and looking more at ease. Good to see. Go Chris.

Id like to see them do the same thing for the not 15 calls thru the game. My bet there were 3 or 4 and they were all 15... and some passes paid were not 15... including one pass to a geelong player inside the i50. To me it was obvious that the umpires had been encouraged to call not 15 for any kick that was questionable. The umpire just made an error in the heat of the moment. Id love to see Geelong show some vision of Cameron at training kicking goals from where the mark would have been taken.

Umpires have a very difficult task. So many players around the ball all the time.
 
yep saw ..still the same stats, and were still out scored in 3 out of the 4 quarters.

What did Brown say that Leigh Matthews tell him about stats. Something like there is only one stat that counts
... due to our inaccuracy.

He said Matthews used to bang on about accuracy and Scott would be doing the same as his old coach.
 
Dec 10, 2003
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He said Matthews used to bang on about accuracy and Scott would be doing the same as his old coach.

I have not got the exact quote ..but Brown gave the impression that LM minimise all the other stats. I wonder if he would say Geelong was dominate in a game where they lost 3 out of the 4 quarters.

I think most of what Scott said on 360 last night was a better description of how I feel. Rather than just say dominated the game, he mentioned dominated the stats and he talked about where they broke down. That they allowed those easy unopposed marks inside 50 and 3 kick in goals.
 

Romeoh1

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Id like to see them do the same thing for the not 15 calls thru the game. My bet there were 3 or 4 and they were all 15... and some passes paid were not 15... including one pass to a geelong player inside the i50. To me it was obvious that the umpires had been encouraged to call not 15 for any kick that was questionable. The umpire just made an error in the heat of the moment. Id love to see Geelong show some vision of Cameron at training kicking goals from where the mark would have been taken.

Umpires have a very difficult task. So many players around the ball all the time.
Yep, agree it’s really hard being an ump and having to make crucial calls in the heat of the moment isn’t easy. Nonetheless, you have to keep your head, especially in a close game nearing the siren time. I get they call them quickly for ones that go and up and down in the air etc, but this one was pretty clearly, I’d have thought, on a trajectory where he simply had to wait and see how far it went. If that sort of mistake decided a crucial final it would be unacceptable. Same for the brissy one.
And yep, they let through a few in that game that were dodgier than the Cameron one.
Anyway, am just glad the footy karma is off our backs already!
 
Aug 17, 2006
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As usual Whateley and his impeccable logic nailed it - the umpire needs to make the call as the ball lands - not midway through its trajectory 👍
Agreed. However I wouldn't be surprised if the AFL instruct the umpires to call 'not 15' as early as possible so as to encourage players to keep the ball moving (e.g. punch) rather than have a player go for a mark, but because they didn't hear the call end up in a stoppage or having to pay an unfair free kick.
 
So I presume when an umpire makes such a poor call that directly impacts on the result, he is relegated to a lower level to hone his umpiring skills?
Simon Overland will be working this week no doubt.

GO Catters
 

Drunkcat

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A game i can not get out my head vs Swans at home Robert Scott with shot after siren in the pocket river end he hit the post and we lost by couple points, dont know what year anyone remember that game?
 

00VicWard001

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yep saw ..still the same stats, and were still out scored in 3 out of the 4 quarters.

What did Brown say that Leigh Matthews tell him about stats. Something like there is only one stat that counts
That was literally his point and statement. Inaccuracy = outscored and therefore losing the game.
 

00VicWard001

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Mostly against us...rarely notice it in other games i watch.

Geelong may just have had a history of very close to 15 kicks in the last few seasons and the umpires pay special attention to us. It is likely similar to Selwood not receiving that many free kicks for high contact over the last 5 years, even if he's smashed around the neck and head.

Overall, good on umpires for paying attention to stats, but it's pretty stupid/unfair if you are pre-judging something because it is a player or team that is doing it.
 
A game i can not get out my head vs Swans at home Robert Scott with shot after siren in the pocket river end he hit the post and we lost by couple points, dont know what year anyone remember that game?

1988.
 

zyzzbruh

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Not trying to step on any toes here, but can anyone here honestly convince me or themselves that a poor or non decision in the last 10 seconds, is any different to one during the course of the game?

There were multiple poor decisions in that game as there is in every game. Specific ones that stick out to me include the 'chopping the arms' that lead to Close's goal despite the fact there wasn't even the slightest contact. Another is the first goal of the game when Henderson kicked the ball all but 7 metres to Miers. If you nullify every bad decision then you probably lose a couple of goals as well. Can't just pick and choose pointing out the last one.

I would even argue the same point in favour of you guys in the Brisbane game.
 
Feb 12, 2017
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Not trying to step on any toes here, but can anyone here honestly convince me or themselves that a poor or non decision in the last 10 seconds, is any different to one during the course of the game?

There were multiple poor decisions in that game as there is in every game. Specific ones that stick out to me include the 'chopping the arms' that lead to Close's goal despite the fact there wasn't even the slightest contact. Another is the first goal of the game when Henderson kicked the ball all but 7 metres to Miers. If you nullify every bad decision then you probably lose a couple of goals as well. Can't just pick and choose pointing out the last one.

I would even argue the same point in favour of you guys in the Brisbane game.
The ball travelled 22 metres and the umpire called 'not 15 play on'. What kind of response are you expecting?
 

zyzzbruh

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The ball travelled 22 metres and the umpire called 'not 15 play on'. What kind of response are you expecting?
If it was the only dubious call of the game then yes you would have been robbed. But when you were on the receiving end of a few yourselves that produced goals, I don't see how you can think you were. You can't focus on just that last call and ignore the others just because it was in the last second.
 
Not trying to step on any toes here, but can anyone here honestly convince me or themselves that a poor or non decision in the last 10 seconds, is any different to one during the course of the game?

There were multiple poor decisions in that game as there is in every game. Specific ones that stick out to me include the 'chopping the arms' that lead to Close's goal despite the fact there wasn't even the slightest contact. Another is the first goal of the game when Henderson kicked the ball all but 7 metres to Miers. If you nullify every bad decision then you probably lose a couple of goals as well. Can't just pick and choose pointing out the last one.

I would even argue the same point in favour of you guys in the Brisbane game.
There’s no fault in your broad logic. People will quibble about specific examples. You and I might differ on the mark paid 20m out directly in front to the Swans, for example.
 
Feb 12, 2017
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If it was the only dubious call of the game then yes you would have been robbed. But when you were on the receiving end of a few yourselves that produced goals, I don't see how you can think you were. You can't focus on just that last call and ignore the others just because it was in the last second.
We didn't lose because of the umpires, Cameron could still have missed even, but it's literally one of the few rules that is black and white. There's so many factors that determine 'holding the ball' these days that depending on the day the rule seems different, but a ball that travels 22 metres being called 'not 15' is beyond stupid and indefensible.
 

Drunkcat

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If it was the only dubious call of the game then yes you would have been robbed. But when you were on the receiving end of a few yourselves that produced goals, I don't see how you can think you were. You can't focus on just that last call and ignore the others just because it was in the last second.
I get you i don't know why people sook about umpires you just take the good with the bad
 

zyzzbruh

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We didn't lose because of the umpires, Cameron could still have missed even, but it's literally one of the few rules that is black and white. There's so many factors that determine 'holding the ball' these days that depending on the day the rule seems different, but a ball that travels 22 metres being called 'not 15' is beyond stupid and indefensible.
I get that it was very blatant. But I'm sure if horse pointed out for example Close's freekick and asked for a please explain, the AFL would probably declare it a mistake too. It's just that no one bats an eye to it and gets glossed over because it happened in the middle of the game. Same goes in every game in general when there's a dubious call in the last second
 
Not trying to step on any toes here, but can anyone here honestly convince me or themselves that a poor or non decision in the last 10 seconds, is any different to one during the course of the game?

There were multiple poor decisions in that game as there is in every game. Specific ones that stick out to me include the 'chopping the arms' that lead to Close's goal despite the fact there wasn't even the slightest contact. Another is the first goal of the game when Henderson kicked the ball all but 7 metres to Miers. If you nullify every bad decision then you probably lose a couple of goals as well. Can't just pick and choose pointing out the last one.

I would even argue the same point in favour of you guys in the Brisbane game.

One thing that's been pretty common reading throughout this thread is that fans are frustrated by the umpires decisions in the dying stages of the match, but the vast majority have acknowledged our inability to convert our chances especially in the last quarter, is what ultimately cost us and that's on the guys out on the field
 
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