No Opposition Supporters General AFL and other clubs discussion thread. **Opposition fans not welcome** Part 4

Changa10

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I hardly get to games these days . Was out our game against Geelong this year and really couldn’t believe how bad the abuse towards the umps , players and other supporters was .
Both sides too. Maybe I was just in a bad part of the ground.
I don’t think I’m easily shocked . I’m pretty competitive. Have had some pretty ordinary stuff directed at me on a cricket field and a few seasons supporting the local Soccer side in the Uk well , refs there are lucky to get out of the 5-7k capacity ground alive .

But this was really bad , non stop abuse. My 3 year old is bugging me to go to a game . No way I can take the chance and have her being in that type of environment.

Some people might see it as a whinge but as a society aren’t we just better then having to abuse people ?
Maybe I’m just getting old !
Bring her to a game in Launceston. The 'atmosphere' there is probably close to what the AFL are looking for (with the odd idiot of course!) and that is 'dead'. All very much a polite clapping of hands.

She should be pretty safe, just steer clear of the wet areas.

I love getting involved in games, by yelling at players etc. I try my hardest to just barrack, but emotions are tough to control at times. In Launceston if you do this, you stand out like a very sore thumb!

New York is a very safe place to visit but mind you so is the rest of America. Crime rates have declined dramatically in the last 50 years, despite their ludicrous gun laws.
Try arguing this with an American, or even an ex-pat Australian relative like my brother. I tried to discuss it with them, after one of the horrific school massacres when the surviving school kids were calling for changes to their gun laws, and you know what I got in return;

- More teenagers die because they drive and use their phone at the same time.
- It's our 'right' to bear arms, it's in the constitution. You 'Australians' don't understand.

They were posting derogatory memes having a go at these poor school kids.

And the above are just two of the main points of their argument.

Because, only kids drive while using their phones, and you clearly need an AK-47 to 'defend' yourself!! Seriously, I live in Tasmania, the home of Martin Bryant F.F.S. I grew up on a farm. My Grandfather and father took me shooting from the age of about 5. I have shot to provide food all my life (don't judge me!). I had guns that had to be handed in under the new laws here, such as a 5 shot semi-automatic 12 gauge shotgun (Hardly an AK-47). This is the same place my Brother grew up. Pretty sure I understand the difference in damage that an AK-47 or high powered automatic rifle can do compared to 6 shot pistol....What they don't get is that like Australia they don't have to ban guns totally, they just need to remove the ones that can do this sort of ridiculous damage.

Sorry for sidetracking....I could go on for hours on this subject.

Back to the Green Maggott umpiring discussion.
 

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Brishawk

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Do you really think that the employer tells new starters in any of these jobs that abuse is just part of the job?
I can imagine the interview...

Afl: now how do you feel about being compared to fly larvae? And what about been mistaken for being vision impaired?
 
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Sure, maybe in some areas. But please explain to me how ejecting people from a stadium (private property) who verbally abuse other people (whether that be staff, players, umpires or other patrons) often in front of young children is regressive.
Look not wanting to get into an online ****fight.

It all comes down to peoples sensitivity levels, some are extremely sensitive borderline soft.

I for one have no problem chucking out turds that make people feel threatened or unsafe.

I also think if someone is just being a tool and looking the fool for behaving like a dick then let them go for a good while, let them show the world how foolish they are and more so film it, post it and embarrass the feck out of them. Most of the time its funny to watch.

As like a lot of areas in life when addressing a problem with rules and sanctions, we let the pendulum swing too far to one side before letting it rest in the sensible middle ground.

FWIW, I don't go to footy game with the intention to offend others and I don't tend to let others offend me by what they say for the most part. One would just about be spitting in my face to get a rise out of me, then I would say something smart or funny to get all those around me to laugh at them.

The art of crowd banter isn't a sharp as it once was I do concede. I do remember having a stack of steel cans kicked out from under me one afternoon at Victoria Park after some banter with the Collingwood masses, stacked them back up and told the crowd that the next one to do the same would have to admit that I was winning, I was nine at the footy with my younger brother and cousins alone.
 
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But this was really bad , non stop abuse. My 3 year old is bugging me to go to a game . No way I can take the chance and have her being in that type of environment.
I missed the 2013 4th quarter comeback against Geelong because the Hawthorn supporters around me made me feel uncomfortable with my eight year old sitting in amongst it. I remember telling him "I don't think we are going to win and these people are getting really angry, let's go home cause I don't wnat you to be in the middle of it". We had a great time on the train home checking the scores sporadically and then refreshing every 10 secs.
 

grumbleguts

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Haha, I could umpire better than most of the current flogs with my glasses off...….
This is a topic for another discussion, but I don't think it's the vision impairment that's ever been the problem. It's SELECTIVE vision impairment that is the problem. Seeing Sicily for example push a guy in the chest from 3.4 km away while looking in the other direction but not seeing him getting pushed first from 12 cm away while staring at the two players.
 

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Dewnior

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Do you really think that the employer tells new starters in any of these jobs that abuse is just part of the job?
It's implied and I can guarantee you that if any of those individuals complained to their employer about it they would be reminded what they signed up for
 

Rushed_Behind

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It’s not the umpires. The poor buggers get orders every week to be more strict on a particular rule, slight change in interpretation or the introduction of a fourth umpire to just add a differing interpretation to rules during the same game.

Add to this the guarantee of a new rule or 2 being introduced every off season and it would be virtually impossible to get any rhythm or consistency not only week to week but season to season. It would be like umpiring a different game.

The AFL administration harp on so much about integrity but the product they’re dishing up has none.

They will cite TV audiences are up, attendances are up but IMO it’s not because of the changes it’s because for the majority of us fans it’s ingrained in us, a tribal belonging and in Melbourne the game is part of the fabric of this city.
 
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Wasnt New Yorks problem urban decay? like a lot of big cities post industrial but one of the most publicised examples.

I visited around 1980 and the graffiti and worse, trash and litter everywhere especially suburbs. Shops only letting 2 people in at a time
It was truly a **** hole (apart form the posh bits of course including Helicopter taxis flying everywhere)

Also visited some other very poor countries in that era, at least they picked up their trash.
 

Brishawk

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Wasnt New Yorks problem urban decay? like a lot of big cities post industrial but one of the most publicised examples.

I visited around 1980 and the graffiti and worse, trash and litter everywhere especially suburbs. Shops only letting 2 people in at a time
It was truly a **** hole (apart form the posh bits of course including Helicopter taxis flying everywhere)

Also visited some other very poor countries in that era, at least they picked up their trash.
crack epidemic.
 
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Do you really think that the employer tells new starters in any of these jobs that abuse is just part of the job?
This is true. The employer has a duty of care, and to not ensure the safety of their workers exposes them. Not that they may give a rat's, but they will feel it in their bottom line, which they do respond to. It's non negotiable.

BUT, would you not also concede that the AFL creates or compounds the issue for the umpires with their rules of the week, playing favourites etc. This frustrates all footy watchers, and I would argue is the root cause of a lot of the anger and abuse.
Obvious flogs aside (i.e. dickheads, and every team has them), people are generally accepting of umpiring decisions IF they are consistent. Consistently **** even, but consistent.
The umps unfairly bear the brunt of the public for the game being mismanaged at the higher level. I'd argue a case could be made that the AFL is the instigator in all this with the confusion and frustration they introduce into the game.

It's a sad state, but I am thankful there is so much dissent within the game at present. To me it suggests something within the game is going to break, there will be a re-assessment/ review of the game, and the pendulum (as someone mentioned above) swings back to some middle ground.

For my money. That is Captain Flogtastic, serial loser, chief MRO and AFL apologist who once played with the handbags, having his head roll at the end of the season. That would be token. Then it needs to be followed by chief smug bastard, Gilligan.
 
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Look not wanting to get into an online ****fight.

It all comes down to peoples sensitivity levels, some are extremely sensitive borderline soft.

I for one have no problem chucking out turds that make people feel threatened or unsafe.

I also think if someone is just being a tool and looking the fool for behaving like a dick then let them go for a good while, let them show the world how foolish they are and more so film it, post it and embarrass the feck out of them. Most of the time its funny to watch.

As like a lot of areas in life when addressing a problem with rules and sanctions, we let the pendulum swing too far to one side before letting it rest in the sensible middle ground.

FWIW, I don't go to footy game with the intention to offend others and I don't tend to let others offend me by what they say for the most part. One would just about be spitting in my face to get a rise out of me, then I would say something smart or funny to get all those around me to laugh at them.

The art of crowd banter isn't a sharp as it once was I do concede. I do remember having a stack of steel cans kicked out from under me one afternoon at Victoria Park after some banter with the Collingwood masses, stacked them back up and told the crowd that the next one to do the same would have to admit that I was winning, I was nine at the footy with my younger brother and cousins alone.
Nor am I. I think we've been having a fairly productive and amicable discussion to be honest.

I'm also not easily offended and I'm not one to be offended on behalf of others either. What I am (or at least try to be) is empathetic towards others. This means considering the effects on an individual who is a target of personal insults about their character/appearance/etc (ie. Things that they are) that are without a doubt intended to disparage and offend them. Particularly when that target is so clearly affected that they take action to stand up for themselves (eg. Mr. Umpire pointing out the cheer squad member, or Adam Goodes pointing at a person who called him an ape).

The umpires are there to perform the job of officiating a game using the rules/laws of the game as they currently stand. Currently the rules as they stand are full of grey area and are open to a lot of interpretation. That isn't the umpires fault. Yes, sometimes (maybe even often) the umpires will make bad decisions. They're only human and the amount of things they have to constantly consider and look out for while also running 10km+ a match is mind boggling difficult. But if you want to let them know they've made a poor decision then by all means do so. There's no need to make it personal or swear loudly in front of kids in the process though.

As I mentioned in my previous post, stadiums are private property and your condition of entry involves being subject to a certain code of conduct. You actually have no rights in that environment to yell out what any reasonable person would consider a personal insult or foul language. Now like I said, I'm not one to be easily offended or to be offended on behalf of others, so if you feel compelled to yell out to an umpire that he is a "bald headed flog" and "a green maggot" then by all means do so. All I'm saying is that you shouldn't be shocked when you're reported and/or ejected for doing so. If you can't deal with that and you think the AFL have gone too far then your best course of action is to deny them your money and attendance figure.
 

Brant

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Personally if I was Geelong, I would be seeing what the best deals from the eagles and dockers are

Does that kinda read like he's happy to consider staying, so long as they're flag favourites?

Pretty hard to build a medium to long-term list strategy around a guy that may/may not be there next year.

It's rumoured that we spoke to Tom Lynch & Cogs at least 18 months out. I appreciate that you're always gonna want classy mids & so you'd be chasing them regardless, but it surely makes it a harder vision to sell if a guy won't commit to more than 12 months at a time & adds a bunch of work to be done each trade period.

I'd be chasing the best possible deal from those 2x clubs & considering that as an option just as much as I would considering any deal that left his staying in limbo each of the next 4+ years.
 
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Joffa...

One of my oldest and closest friends, and his family are life long Collingwood supporters who used to spend a lot of time in the Pies cheer squad in the 90s.
1 day they were positioned right behind Joffa, and he was swearing like a lunatic. My friends mother asked Joffa to tone the language down because of the 3 young boys she had with her. He spun around, said **** off campaigner and spat at her.

That was the last time they ever sat there, and to this day when Joffa's name is mentioned, my mate sees red.

His mother passed away in 2010 and we had to listen to the Pies theme song at the funeral. She was born in 1956. Mate put 10 on for the pies to win by 56...

2nd bit doesn't really matter for the story, but a pretty neat story in its own right.
 

Sixpence

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Joffa...

One of my oldest and closest friends, and his family are life long Collingwood supporters who used to spend a lot of time in the Pies cheer squad in the 90s.
1 day they were positioned right behind Joffa, and he was swearing like a lunatic. My friends mother asked Joffa to tone the language down because of the 3 young boys she had with her. He spun around, said **** off campaigner and spat at her.

That was the last time they ever sat there, and to this day when Joffa's name is mentioned, my mate sees red.

His mother passed away in 2010 and we had to listen to the Pies theme song at the funeral. She was born in 1956. Mate put 10 on for the pies to win by 56...

2nd bit doesn't really matter for the story, but a pretty neat story in its own right.
I think I read this wrong at first. Thought you meant that Joffa was one of your oldest and closest mates, rather than your mate's story about Joffa?
 
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