No Oppo Supporters General AFL Discussion #12 - Carlton Posters ONLY!

[Jabba73]

You know, this is the first time I've ever seen this pitched, and I ******* love it. Especially if the penalty can only be applied to their next game at AFL level.

A suspension sucks, sure, but the team replaces the player with another player, and depending on who that player is they may not really lose all that much in the process. A half game suspension in their next game penalises the player, but also their club who then have to decide if they want to be down a man for the first two quarters.

It's almost like a hybrid of the suspension and red card systems. The team who is infringed against doesn't benefit like they would in a red card scenario, but the infringing team get a more impactful penalty (in my view) than a standard one match suspension.

Wouldn't use it for all reportable offences, but I could definitely see it being a major deterrent for the cheap off the ball crap. For a key position player like Lynch, he puts his club in a really crappy position where they're playing without one of their key talls for a half, while for role player types they run the risk of losing their spot in the senior side entirely if their club decide that it's not worth playing a man down any time soon and just drop the player to the ressies.

It seems any fine under $5k has no impact on the player behaviour, it is almost considered part of the cost of playing, some clubs probably find ways to help cover the added expense for the player. If it helps win a game, the cost is probably worth it, like substituting an injured player for someone not on the emergency list prior to a game.

The only way to stop the cheap shots is to make the clubs police it themselves, this only works if the punishment is a deterrent for the team itself. If the team is happy to take the advantage from a cheap shot that might help them win a game, then the team should also be disadvantaged by the punishment.

This kind of team punishment should be reserved for the cheap shots, particularly off the ball incidents.

 

[Arr0w]

Been saying similar for a few seasons, the MRO and tribunal have a lot to answer for here. Rating something that is off the ball and floors a player as ‘low impact’ is a ******* disgrace.

The faux tough guy punches to the stomach etc should be an automatic $10k fine for a first offence. Second time gets you a suspension for the first half of the next match you play in. Third and any subsequent offence is $20k and a full match on the bench.

Punish the team as well as the player and that sh*t stops overnight.

Better still, suspend the player and his side can't replace him for the following week

1 player down for the whole game

 

[Jabba73]

Better still, suspend the player and his side can't replace him for the following week

1 player down for the whole game

The point of making/letting them sit on the bench is everyone knows the player is there and why, might make the message sink in.

By having them on the bench, they cannot be replaced by another player.

 

[Metalcrusher]

The point of making/letting them sit on the bench is everyone knows the player is there and why, might make the message sink in.

By having them on the bench, they cannot be replaced by another player.

a public shaming ... I like it

 

[JustaBattler]

Introduce a sin bin and a send off - it isnt rocket science- every other football code and contact sport in teh world has these two things in place-...

 

[Jabba73]

Introduce a sin bin and a send off - it isnt rocket science- every other football code and contact sport in teh world has these two things in place-...

Would be more comfortable if it is reviewed by another official. The umpires controlling play make enough mistakes due to ‘interpretation’ already, imagine the consequences of sending someone off and costing a team the game from a blindsided umpire.

Rugby has players running at each other from one direction, much easier to police than AFL players that hit from all directions.

 

[JustaBattler]

Would be more comfortable if it is reviewed by another official. The umpires controlling play make enough mistakes due to ‘interpretation’ already, imagine the consequences of sending someone off and costing a team the game from a blindsided umpire.

Rugby has players running at each other from one direction, much easier to police than AFL players that hit from all directions.

oh well - it is what it is then.

 

[MrsEddieBetts]

I reckon we should make them wear the Stone of Shame

 

[CJMB]

Would be more comfortable if it is reviewed by another official. The umpires controlling play make enough mistakes due to ‘interpretation’ already, imagine the consequences of sending someone off and costing a team the game from a blindsided umpire.

Rugby has players running at each other from one direction, much easier to police than AFL players that hit from all directions.

They still get it wrong plenty of times though.

Rugby has a real issue in the card system, not the intent around harshly policing high contact and foul play which I commend, but rather that the gulf between a yellow (player sent to the 'naughty chair', 1 man down for 10 mins) versus a red (naughty chair & 1 down for the remainder of the game) is monumental and that red card, provided it's not issued right at the death, usually spells the end of a teams chance at winning if it's a fairly even battle.

It gets hard when there's zero tolerance on certain types of impact where they're attempting to judge intent alongside the actual event, there can be a bee's d*** between a penalty or yellow or a red. Head contact, shoulder charging, neck rolls, any swinging arm, playing the man in the air are the big ones off the top of my head that have players binned the most regularly.

Personally, I think they need maybe a couple of extra cards so it's not such a steep increase in punishment between penalty, yellow & red. It doubly hurts that you've got positions that cannot be filled by those not designated; ie only recognised props can legally pack down at 1 or 3. You might be forced to bench (which is a permanent move) a winger so you can bring on a forward to prevent being smashed & further penaliesd in the scrum or something like that. Plus, being a line based defense, being 1 short really ****s with your system and you've got to work a hell of a lot harder than the other team to compensate for that 1 missing player.

Not sure 1 down on the bench in AFL would have the same kind of impact, then again maybe you've already lost 1 or two to injury and now you're basically running no interchange...

Cards can drastically change the course of game in an instant, as can an injury due to some kind of foul play. It'd be a notable change to the game, but I think if you did your best to have several gradient levels, not just 'free kick'>yellow>red, then it could work. Adopt the 2 yellows = red or similar too, so there's a cumulative effect that would target the serial offenders and get them to clean up their act.

 

[SurreyBlue]

Better still, suspend the player and his side can't replace him for the following week

1 player down for the whole game

The point of making/letting them sit on the bench is everyone knows the player is there and why, might make the message sink in.

By having them on the bench, they cannot be replaced by another player.

I 'love' both of these ideas. The player should be sent off in the current game and made to wear a 'no player' vest and then suspended for the next game and beyond depending on indiscretion, without a replacement. Love it!!!!!

 

[SurreyBlue]

ps. I can see Clarkson & Hardwick's arguments for against such a change already.....

 

[FitzroyBlueBagger]

Would be more comfortable if it is reviewed by another official. The umpires controlling play make enough mistakes due to ‘interpretation’ already, imagine the consequences of sending someone off and costing a team the game from a blindsided umpire.

Rugby has players running at each other from one direction, much easier to police than AFL players that hit from all directions.

Like it...
Having the right officials would be the path to go down most of these acts are off the ball or behind the play so using technology in replays can aid the decision of the official on the sidelines, then with the player benched for whatever amount of time the next process is the tribunal punishment for the act fines and suspension, $10K fine and 1 week first offense then $20K and 2 weeks capped for a second or more offenses...
There will be obvious incidents were the umpire might have clear vision of some incidents so the official having power of attorney in these cases could look over the act and give it the all clear taking away any possible incorrect decisions towards a player...

 

[DangerousD]

I really dont think there is a workable incorrect disposal rule tbh - as long as it is around there are limitations in players ability to actually dispose of the ball in congestion especially. Have a look at the training videos- a lot of coaching and practise goes into grab an arm technique - it is all about getting a free kick by trapping the ball to the carrier or forcing a so called incorrect disposal.

There are also disinsentives to employing a lot of tacklinhg technique these days - I think teh bump should be eradicated totally - but why penalise a perfectly executed between knees and shoulder tackle ? - I ve see both Cripps and Mcgovern penalised for brilliant front on tackles - with umps declaring excessive force...no doubt players are coached to grab an arm if not both to pin a player and take them to the ground ...ther eis too much slingiung of players to teh ground going on far too often - the one arm sling around at the ground is a dangerous thing...

after which a whole bunch of players (from both sides btw) have the time to pile on the player brought to ground for no reason with umpire waiting to blow the whitle whenever they feel like it...

The whole system is cockeyed tbh - I doubt that even umps have a clear idea of what is what.

If you get a chance go rewatch the Judd so called chicken wing incident- perfect example of a pile of players all over each other with no umpiring going -on - dont know what the ump was waiting for - its not like theere are rucks or mauls allowed in AFL ...with on and offside rules to control teh mayhem

I think you have partly expressed a simple solution without specifically saying so, the umpires, take far too long, to blow the whistle, this as you said, leads to pile ons, mauls and forceful slinging to the ground.

We as supporters get frustrated every year because trends and undesirable tactics creep in to the game and are allowed to grow in to issues, because the existing rules are not followed.

The AFL under Gill look to me, like a totally reactive organisation, nothing changes until it’s way too late.

 

[thylacine60]

Yep. If it's likely to affect the bottom line, promulgate too much social dissent or be too difficult to cover up..........rule change.

 

[Jabba73]

Yep. If it's likely to affect the bottom line, promulgate too much social dissent or be too difficult to cover up, or is requested by Hardwick or Clarkson.............rule change.

 

[katmanblue]

oh well - it is what it is then.

Does that rule out what it's not?

 

[katmanblue]

I reckon we should make them wear the Stone of Shame

They have to play the next game with a weighted vest.

 

[Jabba73]

They have to play the next game with a weighted vest.

Works until they fall on you ...

 

[JustaBattler]

Does that rule out what it's not?

now that you mention it...I guess

what is not can always become what (it) is and what it is can become what it was and hence what its not - and it all could be true or not all that the same time

cos that is how it is I guess

 

[Metalcrusher]

now that you mention it...I guess

what is not can always become what (it) is and what it is can become what it was and hence what its not - and it all could be true or not all that the same time

cos that is how it is I guess

 

[Elmer_Judd]

Hawthorn player reportedly considering early retirement from the AFL

The 29-year-old's pre-season is on hold - and he may yet call time on his career.

7news.com.au

Nothing against Scully, who has suffered a rotten run of injuries, but his recruitment was another poor top up recruit by Clarkson and The Hawks.

 

[Metalcrusher]

Hawthorn player reportedly considering early retirement from the AFL

The 29-year-old's pre-season is on hold - and he may yet call time on his career.

7news.com.au

Nothing against Scully, who has suffered a rotten run of injuries, but his recruitment was another poor top up recruit by Clarkson and The Hawks.

Why would they sully the article by bring Patton into the debate? Really journalists?????

 

[Elmer_Judd]

Why would they sully the article by bring Patton into the debate? Really journalists?????

Aussie Media is become more and more like US and UK based Trash Tabloids every day. Thanks Rupert.

 

[BigFrizz36]

Why would they sully the article by bring Patton into the debate? Really journalists?????

To be fair they were both hail Mary's by the hawks. Every fact on offer suggested that both were well past their best and had little chance of getting back there. Media ate it up of course and they were both "steals" and clako knew better than the giants. Might have to have a flutter on the hawks to win the spoon. Why? Because of clarko.

 

[Elmer_Judd]

To be fair they were both hail Mary's by the hawks. Every fact on offer suggested that both were well past their best and had little chance of getting back there. Media ate it up of course and they were both "steals" and clako knew better than the giants. Might have to have a flutter on the hawks to win the spoon. Why? Because of clarko.

Essingtin and Hawfhorn to finish 18th and 17th this season (in any order) would be amazing.