General AFL thread 2016

[Joffaboy]

Why? Does it make losing two grand finals less painful. It doesn't for me. Strange.

OK

 

[sauce_head]

So a coach that has won a flag is crap but one that hasnt is a genius. Interesting.

FYI I do think Ross is a bad coach, just apparent he is limited

He only got it because bomber Thompson decided not to coach on.

It's like saying the coach of the dream team was the best coach at the olympics because they won gold.

As I said. Absolute.

 

[Joffaboy]

He only got it because bomber Thompson decided not to coach on.

It's like saying the coach of the dream team was the best coach at the olympics because they won gold.

As I said. Absolute.

OK mate settle down. Ross is a good coach but can win a flag.
As for absolute. Just because you post it doesnt make it true.
Absolutes are always a bit OTT.

 

[Diehard Saint]

He inherited one when he took over at geelong. He said "chase in the back line" and they did. I'm not sure how many he has got his team to. One?

As for the north one, they are mentally fragile and he has wasted a great list. Maybe this season he will punch the table in the right spot and it will magically go right.

As for Ross, anybody who thinks he is a Sh!t coach is an absolute moron. Yes absolute.

Yes he can coach. But can he rebuild? Because that's what he's looking at now.

 

[NarklesHelmet]

He inherited one when he took over at geelong. He said "chase in the back line" and they did. I'm not sure how many he has got his team to. One?

As for the north one, they are mentally fragile and he has wasted a great list. Maybe this season he will punch the table in the right spot and it will magically go right.

As for Ross, anybody who thinks he is a Sh!t coach is an absolute moron. Yes absolute.

Ross is a fantastic motivator and an excellent coach setting up a team defensively. He is a limited tactician offensively and seems limited with development. He was a really good coach for a span of a few years when he was ahead of the curve tactically but once others caught up and developed further he's been a bit left behind.

The cap on rotations may well be the final nail in the coffin for him as he can't execute his pressure style that demands so much of players physically and mentally.

 

[sauce_head]

Yes he can coach. But can he rebuild? Because that's what he's looking at now.

Agree. I'm not sure he can rebuild.

I just find it strange and a little bit juvenile that people are pretending he can't coach because they are angry he protected his family and financial position when the saints were stuffing his contract around. But don't let one dimension get in the way of you screaming at cars you didn't see coming (not necessarily you).

 

[plugger66]

Amen. How is the super coach going? A real 'genius'? He is a one trick pony still obsessing over the 2005 'Bloods' game plan who has been found out. He was in the right place at the right time at the Saints with a good mature list with about 8 AA players running around. He got another good mature list at Freo. Just lucky both times. Now he has been found out as the fraud he truly is.

Didn't we have less aa than both sides we played. Didn't he get abused for playing guys not up to it. Didn't he get in 3 gf doing that?

 

[Joffaboy]

Apparently Freo have 8 players over 30. North have 7.

Freo are 0-4 but North are the opposite.

Can Ross rebuild and develop? Can a young developing team handle Ross's gameplan?

Will be interesting

 

[sauce_head]

Ross is a fantastic motivator and an excellent coach setting up a team defensively. He is a limited tactician offensively and seems limited with development. He was a really good coach for a span of a few years when he was ahead of the curve tactically but once others caught up and developed further he's been a bit left behind.

The cap on rotations may well be the final nail in the coffin for him as he can't execute his pressure style that demands so much of players physically and mentally.

Fair comments. I think I agree with most of it. Except I think that had we had the cap in our era it would have been to our advantage given the presence of people like riewoldt in our team and allowing our stars to "rest" on the field.

 

[Joffaboy]

Agree. I'm not sure he can rebuild.

I just find it strange and a little bit juvenile that people are pretending he can't coach because they are angry he protected his family and financial position when the saints were stuffing his contract around. But don't let one dimension get in the way of you screaming at cars you didn't see coming (not necessarily you).

Who posted that?I think many dislike the way he left our list.

FWIW I loved Ross coaching us. It meant we were winning and we made two GF and almost won a flag. Who couldnt be happy?

 

[sauce_head]

Amen. How is the super coach going? A real 'genius'? He is a one trick pony still obsessing over the 2005 'Bloods' game plan who has been found out. He was in the right place at the right time at the Saints with a good mature list with about 8 AA players running around. He got another good mature list at Freo. Just lucky both times. Now he has been found out as the fraud he truly is.

This is what I was responding to.
Or at least thought I was.

 

[sauce_head]

Who posted that?I think many dislike the way he left our list.

FWIW I loved Ross coaching us. It meant we were winning and we made two GF and almost won a flag. Who couldnt be happy?

Above

 

[Joffaboy]

This is what I was responding to.
Or at least thought I was.

OK.

 

[VDS66]

One has a flag. How many has Ross won?

Scott was to Geelong what Joyce was to Hawthorn. Right place, right time, gun list.

 

[Rors]

Funny that Ross only coached us for 5 years & during that 5th year (2011), it did become pretty clear that the senior players were beginning to burn out under the pressure of such an intense game style/plan & the younger guys were frustrated at not getting a decent crack to reward good reserves form....

It's Ross's 5th year at Fremantle this year, the similarities are both uncanny & scarily familiar IMHO

 

[Joffaboy]

Scott was to Geelong what Joyce was to Hawthorn. Right place, right time, gun list.

Premiership winning coach. No asterix

 

[Highlander35]

Freo is gonna pick up a win next week with the Blues (only other winless team so far) in Perth.

But they then go Crows in Adelaide, Giants at home, Hawks in Tassie.

Likely to be 2 and 6, possibly 1 and 7. Ross will be under pressure.

 

[Joffaboy]

Funny that Ross only coached us for 5 years & during that 5th year (2011), it did become pretty clear that the senior players were beginning to burn out under the pressure of such an intense game style/plan & the younger guys were frustrated at not getting a decent crack to reward good reserves form....

It's Ross's 5th year at Fremantle this year, the similarities are both uncanny & scarily familiar IMHO

Its OK, he has a contract

 

[FlyingSledghamer]

FWIW Ross did the best job he could with our list and the reason we lost those gfs was because the admin stuffed up our tpp. We low balled Luke Ball and couldnt afford to buy a Darren Jolly.

 

[Diehard Saint]

Funny that Ross only coached us for 5 years & during that 5th year (2011), it did become pretty clear that the senior players were beginning to burn out under the pressure of such an intense game style/plan & the younger guys were frustrated at not getting a decent crack to reward good reserves form....

It's Ross's 5th year at Fremantle this year, the similarities are both uncanny & scarily familiar IMHO

But they've signed him for another 5.....I'm not sure it's going to end well.

 

[Rors]

Its OK, he has a contract

But they've signed him for another 5.....I'm not sure it's going to end well.

Oh I know. As I said in an earlier post above, he's got 4yrs & 18rounds to prove he can do a rebuild..... But I'm not sure Fremantle has 4yrs & 18rounds to wait for that to happen

 

[Barrels]

Bottom four deadset makes me moist...

 

[NarklesHelmet]

Fair comments. I think I agree with most of it. Except I think that had we had the cap in our era it would have been to our advantage given the presence of people like riewoldt in our team and allowing our stars to "rest" on the field.

Ross is a pretty interesting personality in our game and has done a lot to develop our code tactically, especially defensively. His teams set the benchmark and so many have followed suit.

I have always watched him with special interest as, besides the fact that he coached us, I did a pre-coaching soccer course at Ajax in Amsterdam 10 years ago as I have a background in psychology and was looking at the time to go into coaching. Anyway, to cut a long story short, out of the 2 week course we had about 3 whole days discussing pressure as a concept. The one thing that really stuck out for me was how much they emphasised that there was a huge psychological component to pressure in that, even if you are fit (as pretty much all pro footballers are), a player is likely to be able to exert effective pressure if they feel that it will have a positive outcome. Otherwise, it becomes laborious and taxing mentally. Basically that if the players are "hunting" as a team they all feed off it and it makes their pressure even more effective as they are getting rewarded often for it.

In light of the above, I really believe the mentally draining nature of his pressure style is why Lyon's teams do well for a few years and then fade. Without the reward from this constant pressure, the players become cooked mentally. To freshen all this up, Lyon would need to develop a gameplan that was more like the Hawks based on possession. Possession is great mentally for players because, again, it is more rewarding mentally to do hard running for a positive outcome. The problem for Lyon is it is not that easy to develop this type of positive, possession based teams. It takes years of list-building and an ability to teach in a different way than teaching defensive structures. It takes a Clarkson type basically and they don't grow on trees.

Seeing how Ross adapts to the challenges he has with Freo now is going to be fascinating. Watching from afar, I don't think he has the skill-set to create a different gameplan but i might be wrong. For Freo's sake I'd better be because they have invested heavily in him.

 

[Rors]

Ross is a pretty interesting personality in our game and has done a lot to develop our code tactically, especially defensively. His teams set the benchmark and so many have followed suit.

I have always watched him with special interest as, besides the fact that he coached us, I did a pre-coaching soccer course at Ajax in Amsterdam 10 years ago as I have a background in psychology and was looking at the time to go into coaching. Anyway, to cut a long story short, out of the 2 week course we had about 3 whole days discussing pressure as a concept. The one thing that really stuck out for me was how much they emphasised that there was a huge psychological component to pressure in that, even if you are fit (as pretty much all pro footballers are), a player is likely to be able to exert effective pressure if they feel that it will have a positive outcome. Otherwise, it becomes laborious and taxing mentally. Basically that if the players are "hunting" as a team they all feed off it and it makes their pressure even more effective as they are getting rewarded often for it.

In light of the above, I really believe the mentally draining nature of his pressure style is why Lyon's teams do well for a few years and then fade. Without the reward from this constant pressure, the players become cooked mentally. To freshen all this up, Lyon would need to develop a gameplan that was more like the Hawks based on possession. Possession is great mentally for players because, again, it is more rewarding mentally to do hard running for a positive outcome. The problem for Lyon is it is not that easy to develop this type of positive, possession based teams. It takes years of list-building and an ability to teach in a different way than teaching defensive structures. It takes a Clarkson type basically and they don't grow on trees.

Seeing how Ross adapts to the challenges he has with Freo now is going to be fascinating. Watching from afar, I don't think he has the skill-set to create a different gameplan but i might be wrong. For Freo's sake I'd better be because they have invested heavily in him.

That was a great read. Nice work

 

[sonnywalters]

Agree. I'm not sure he can rebuild.

I just find it strange and a little bit juvenile that people are pretending he can't coach because they are angry he protected his family and financial position when the saints were stuffing his contract around. But don't let one dimension get in the way of you screaming at cars you didn't see coming (not necessarily you).

On the flipside people who like to believe the BS about how 'great' he is wont face the facts they he inherited good mature lists at the Saints and Freo. He had AA talent on his books and was in the right place at the right time. Hayes, Roo, Fisher, NDS, Goddard, Pavlich, Sandilands, Fyfe, Mundy, McPharlin AA talents at their peak. He currently has 0 flags next to his name and lets see how his w:l % holds up in the next few years. He was a decent coach for a short window - he mastered the 2005 'Bloods' game plan of winning games scoring 60-70 points but those days are long gone. This plan no longer works for a variety of reasons and he hasn't adapted. A 'great' coach adapts as the game changes. Obvious.