Updated George Pell * Dead at 81yo

[MSB ROYS]

Is that a fact?

No, an opinion.

 

[Opine]

Anyway, best I leave this thread so that discussion can continue without feeling that someone is looking over each comment.
Thanks for the chat.

 

[Slartibartfast]

That may be because it is now an Administrative Law matter.

He stated he was too angry to be useful but I believe he was somewhat made redundant after his Vanilla sex comment made him a little toxic moving forward.

 

[Slartibartfast]

You have a mental health problem because you have not read anything I said.

The problem is, your political agenda is so obvious, you are doing it harm.

Non one has appeased the churches actions. You are doing more harm than good.

I have read your posts but dont see how that would effect my mental health if i did not.
NO political agenda , i seek JUSTICE, something you dont care about.
You have made it clear where you stand by your lack of posts or thoughts concerning the victims here, the kids who were sexually abused. But you continually add links that question the courts decision , citing Bolt arguments with total ignorance of the victims and what they have been through . Your posts have all been about the support of Pell.
Think you should stop the abusive comments if you cant add anything to the discussion dont post. Throughout this thread you have ignored reasonable questions and anytime you dont like how the conversation is going you throw abuse. You never offer anything to support your arguments.

Can you see the difference between a political agenda and some one truly interested in justice against a vile creature who prayed, whops preyed on kiddies???
You keep screaming political agenda but not once have you said what it is????
Answer some questions for a change !

 

[Melsy]

I have read your posts but dont see how that would effect my mental health if i did not.
NO political agenda , i seek JUSTICE, something you dont care about.
You have made it clear where you stand by your lack of posts or thoughts concerning the victims here, the kids who were sexually abused. But you continually add links that question the courts decision , citing Bolt arguments with total ignorance of the victims and what they have been through . Your posts have all been about the support of Pell.
Think you should stop the abusive comments if you cant add anything to the discussion dont post. Throughout this thread you have ignored reasonable questions and anytime you dont like how the conversation is going you throw abuse. You never offer anything to support your arguments.

Can you see the difference between a political agenda and some one truly interested in justice against a vile creature who prayed, whops preyed on kiddies???
You keep screaming political agenda but not once have you said what it is????
Answer some questions for a change !

Absolute rubbish. Absolute rubbish. All presumption and contradiction.

 

[Slartibartfast]

Absolute rubbish. Absolute rubbish. All presumption and contradiction.

Thats right yell loud , that a great argument.
What is rubbish???
What are contradictions???
You cannot keep commenting and yet still be evasive, you are going to have to commit to a comment sooner or later .
What do you think has happened ???

Just explain why you think pell has been hard done by and stop abusing people when your being asked to account for what you are saying.
Answer some questions and have a discussion??

Tell us why you you choose not to comment on the plight of the victims yet put all your focus into trying to show how Pell was hard done by??
You have offered nothing constructive in this thread other than to abuse people who support Pells conviction.

Please, your abusive comments only shows you have nothing to offer.

 

[Melsy]

Thats right yell loud , that a great argument.
What is rubbish???
What are contradictions???
You cannot keep commenting and yet still be evasive, you are going to have to commit to a comment sooner or later .
What do you think has happened ???

Just explain why you think pell has been hard done by and stop abusing people when your being asked to account for what you are saying.
Answer some questions and have a discussion??

Tell us why you you choose not to comment on the plight of the victims yet put all your focus into trying to show how Pell was hard done by??
You have offered nothing constructive in this thread other than to abuse people who support Pells conviction.

Please, your abusive comments only shows you have nothing to offer.

A man with a pitchfork. Wow.

 

[Slartibartfast]

A man with a pitchfork. Wow.

A man with a pitchfork. Wow.

Still nothing to offer, ha.
Why a pitchfork???
Answer some questions, make a statement , offer something???

Very weak approach to supporting a peodophile , you must sleep well at night.

 

[Kurve]

QC Robert Richter off his curly wig. Shamed himself with a "terrible choice of phrase" which is a gross understatement.

Mr Richter made a number of arguments following the guilty verdict of his client, referring to the abused victims as “naughty boys” for drinking church wine in the lead up to being attacked.

He referred to the sexual penetration of the young teenager as “plain” and “vanilla”.

Mr Richter went on to suggest that Pell should get a slap on the wrist because his sex crimes against two boys lasted “less than six minutes”, there was “no ejaculation” and “no use of any implement”.

His comments drew national outcry and Mr Richter was chased from the courtroom through the streets to his office.

https://www.news.com.au/national/vi...s/news-story/4cfa8039c4ae19720c1f890310b04cd3

 

[Slartibartfast]

QC Robert Richter off his curly wig. Shamed himself with a "terrible choice of phrase" which is a gross understatement.

Mr Richter made a number of arguments following the guilty verdict of his client, referring to the abused victims as “naughty boys” for drinking church wine in the lead up to being attacked.

He referred to the sexual penetration of the young teenager as “plain” and “vanilla”.

Mr Richter went on to suggest that Pell should get a slap on the wrist because his sex crimes against two boys lasted “less than six minutes”, there was “no ejaculation” and “no use of any implement”.

His comments drew national outcry and Mr Richter was chased from the courtroom through the streets to his office.

https://www.news.com.au/national/vi...s/news-story/4cfa8039c4ae19720c1f890310b04cd3

Said he was standing down.
Garbage, he is soiled goods after that vanilla comment and this was his easy out to say he was to angry with the decision.
Would have been hard for him to represent pell in the appeal.

 

[Kurve]

Does the sexual abuse issue remove ones responsibility to remain respectful to those who are part of the Catholic community? Be hard on the issue by all means, but please try and maintain some objectivity.

Godmother to two Irish Catholic girls who are in Catholic schools, that isn't going to change and I speak to their mum often. She isn't taking it personally, the shame isn't theirs to bear. Perhaps she doesn't identify with her religion as closely as someone else I was talking to over the phone, a Sicilian Catholic whose voice broke he's taking it very badly. And he doesn't even go to church.

 

[Opine]

Godmother to two Irish Catholic girls who are in Catholic schools, that isn't going to change and I speak to their mum often. She isn't taking it personally, the shame isn't theirs to bear. Perhaps she doesn't identify with her religion as closely as someone else I was talking to over the phone, a Sicilian Catholic whose voice broke he's taking it very badly. And he doesn't even go to church.

who are you referring to?

 

[Opine]

Said he was standing down.
Garbage, he is soiled goods after that vanilla comment and this was his easy out to say he was to angry with the decision.
Would have been hard for him to represent pell in the appeal.

What utter nonsense.

 

[Slartibartfast]

Godmother to two Irish Catholic girls who are in Catholic schools, that isn't going to change and I speak to their mum often. She isn't taking it personally, the shame isn't theirs to bear. Perhaps she doesn't identify with her religion as closely as someone else I was talking to over the phone, a Sicilian Catholic whose voice broke he's taking it very badly. And he doesn't even go to church.

The fact is those Catholics who despise this behaviour are victims too.
The people who they look to for guidance have betrayed them. Pell as an individual and also the church as a whole for decades of tolerance of this behaviour.

I hope reasonable posters like Opine who are here to discuss this understand that as much as I believe he is a victim this does not impair the way I discuss this as the victims of the abuse are in the front of my mind.
This is not a one off event, this is a abhorrent culture that needs changing.
Time for diplomatic words have long gone, the church i abhor but i do have sympathy for Catholics who feel confused and betrayed at this time.
I believe they need to be a part of the change and that will only happen with their involvement in the church and its policies.
It must be hard to have this thrust on them though.

 

[Slartibartfast]

What utter nonsense.

Richter would not throw away a blank cheque for no reason .

It would have been hard to represent Pell in any appeal.

 

[Kurve]

who are you referring to?

Pell's conviction and the affect it has had on the Catholic Community, each seems to feel it differently.

 

[Opine]

Richter would not throw away a blank cheque for no reason .

It would have been hard to represent Pell in any appeal.

You know for the most part, your posts are on point. But you would do better to refrain from the personal attacks on character.

 

[Opine]

Pell's conviction and the affect it has had on the Catholic Community, each seems to feel it differently.

Yes that would be true.

 

[Slartibartfast]

You know for the most part, your posts are on point. But you would do better to refrain from the personal attacks on character.

Not sure if that relates to my comment on Richter or this forum in general.
When posters play the man i will defend myself and highlight the hypocrisy .
I am quite happy to discuss the issues alone , when posters just cry out political agenda, mental problems i fell obliged to put them in thier place to demonstrate the shallowness of their hollow defence.

 

[bigfarter]

Does the sexual abuse issue remove ones responsibility to remain respectful to those who are part of the Catholic community? Be hard on the issue by all means, but please try and maintain some objectivity.

It becomes VERY hard to separate the two. I respect people's right to their faith but I would strongly question why they would still be part of an organisation that has so much (and continuing) abuse under it's belt. I'd question why people couldn't celebrate their faith outside the bounds of this poisonous organisation. I liken it to Jimmy Saville: he did lots of charity work - doesn't change the evil he did and it doesn't excuse it. Any good the Catholic Church does for society, including scholarships, pales in comparison when they still operate as protectors of paedophiles, in my opinion. I realise this is a very hot-button topic due to religion being involved but I think that is how they get away with so much. Take religion out of the equation and nobody would still be supporting the church. You wouldn't go to work, find out a substantial amount of your co-workers are child abusers AND the bosses know about it and just shrug and say "Yeah, well, the business does good things too."

This isn't aimed squarely at you, Opine, just using your post as a leaping-off point because I do find it fascinating how the Church continues to have supporters. The fact we're seeing some in the media play out the exact same arguments that saw paedophile priests remain unpunished for decades is staggering to me.

 

[Opine]

It becomes VERY hard to separate the two. I respect people's right to their faith but I would strongly question why they would still be part of an organisation that has so much (and continuing) abuse under it's belt. I'd question why people couldn't celebrate their faith outside the bounds of this poisonous organisation. I liken it to Jimmy Saville: he did lots of charity work - doesn't change the evil he did and it doesn't excuse it. Any good the Catholic Church does for society, including scholarships, pales in comparison when they still operate as protectors of paedophiles, in my opinion. I realise this is a very hot-button topic due to religion being involved but I think that is how they get away with so much. Take religion out of the equation and nobody would still be supporting the church. You wouldn't go to work, find out a substantial amount of your co-workers are child abusers AND the bosses know about it and just shrug and say "Yeah, well, the business does good things too."

This isn't aimed squarely at you, Opine, just using your post as a leaping-off point because I do find it fascinating how the Church continues to have supporters. The fact we're seeing some in the media play out the exact same arguments that saw paedophile priests remain unpunished for decades is staggering to me.

i don't need or desire to justify my faith choice. Is that clear?

 

[bigfarter]

i don't need or desire to justify my faith choice. Is that clear?

As I said, Opine, I respect everyone's right to their chosen faith. I personally just don't understand why it has to be bound specifically to the church, in light of all their crimes. You don't need to go into it if you don't wish to - I'm just trying to respectfully put my position forward because it's something I'm passionate about and perpetually confused by. And I think it ties into the discussion of this case because people in Pell's position (and similar positions) have escaped justice and still escape justice because they have religion and power on their side. Not having a go at you personally at all. My ire is firmly aimed at the organisation.

 

[Opine]

As I said, Opine, I respect everyone's right to their chosen faith. I personally just don't understand why it has to be bound specifically to the church, in light of all their crimes. You don't need to go into it if you don't wish to - I'm just trying to respectfully put my position forward because it's something I'm passionate about and perpetually confused by. And I think it ties into the discussion of this case because people in Pell's position (and similar positions) have escaped justice and still escape justice because they have religion and power on their side. Not having a go at you personally at all. My ire is firmly aimed at the organisation.

To what end are you attempting to lead this conversation?
What is your point; precisely?

 

[Opine]

What is it that you are passionate about?

 

[bigfarter]

I'm passionate about justice for those who abuse children - which is something the Church has avoided at all costs for decades. This case plays into that.

To what end are you attempting to lead this conversation?
What is your point; precisely?

No agenda. I replied to a post you made with my own thoughts on the matter - and replied once more to your reply to my post and have now replied to your latest message. Happy to end it there, mate. This isn't about you.