Religion Getting myself un-baptised.

[Chief]

C'mon Chief, both you and I know that answer is bullshit. According to Urban dictionary; 1. troll



One who posts a deliberately provocative message to a newsgroup or message board with the intention of causing maximum disruption and argument
http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=troll

And yeah, nah, you didn't answer the question directly at all. You've just skirted around it, politician style.

Good work.

Urban Dictionary. OK.

Being "deliberately provocative" of discord wasn't my aim. It was to be deliberately provocative of discussion. That this discussion contains elements of discord is not surprising.

Would we prefer people posted deliberately non-provocative threads to which nobody responded?

As for the priest post, it had an element of clumsily trolling Corp in response to his ridiculous challenge. But can you blame me?

He was basically challenging me to create artificial conditions in which I could not help but accept God's existence. Just as ridiculous as asking anyone to create artificial conditions in which they could not help but accept, say, paedophilia as normal or at most something to be dealt with by giving the abuser fresh targets - a position we know has been taken by many parts of the Catholic clergy for many centuries.

Once you get people to stop thinking you can get them to accept just about anything.

That's unarguably dangerous.

 

[Caesar]

Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?

Just to be clear, I wasn't defending Corpuscles' argument. I just think the rockthrowing over paedophilia in any discussion to do with the Catholic Church has been a little overdone recently. Carry on.

 

[Frodo]

This must be a candidate for the most stupid thread ever.

Your parents decide on baptism in the hope that you continue their faith.

Once you have a mind of your own it is your choice whether to practice the religion.

If you can't accept that religion just ignore it and get on with life.

ps
Your infatuation with the existence of god suggests you are really agnostic. A person who was a real atheist (if possible) would simply ignore religious discussion.

 

[Caesar]

That's not very fair. Militant atheists generally are so because they think that the idea of god and the belief systems surrounding the concept are genuinely harmful to society, and thus need to be eradicated. Not because they're covering for their own insecurities.

 

[Richo83]

Your infatuation with the existence of god suggests you are really agnostic. A person who was a real atheist (if possible) would simply ignore religious discussion.

Right, because atheists don't write books about god at all, do they?

 

[Frodo]

Right, because atheists don't write books about god at all, do they?

Well it would indeed be an oxymoron

 

[Chief]

If you can't accept that religion just ignore it and get on with life.

At the risk of turning this thread down the path of so many before it, if that religion was harmless and kept to itself there would be no need to take notice of it.

However religions don't operate that way.

Your infatuation with the existence of god suggests you are really agnostic.

Technically, yes I am agnostic in the strict sense of the word.

However I give the chance of the existence of a God as described in any of the religious texts that of a hair's breadth compared to the distance from the Sun to Pluto. To call myself agnostic or atheist is just splitting hairs. (*chortle*)

See other threads for argument on these points.

 

[Chief]

Of course Chief.

Over the years your posting about religion has grown from a mere discussion point to being a troll and now a full blown obsession.

This opinion is due to your own unwillingness to see the harm caused by religions and the type of thinking they demand of their followers.

Therefore any adverse commentary on religion is, in your mind, indicative of bad intentions - "troll", "obsession" and so on.

In fact, your religion requires that negative comment be seen as wrong to the point of being evil.

Who is the obsessive here??

But this is, again, going down the path of discussing issues that have been covered before in many other threads.

 

[Chief]

Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?

Just to be clear, I wasn't defending Corpuscles' argument. I just think the rockthrowing over paedophilia in any discussion to do with the Catholic Church has been a little overdone recently. Carry on.

Yes, probably a fair point. Unfortunately it is hard to separate the institution from its own documented history. If it were a business it would have changed its name and logo by now, not elevated a guilty party to the big chair.

 

[skipper kelly]

Therefore any adverse commentary on religion is, in your mind, indicative of bad intentions - "troll", "obsession" and so on.

The worst trolls are those that when called on it make up some rubbish excuse that they aren't.

This thread isn't a troll though. Its actually quite weird considering its most likely true.

Good luck with your new found freedom.

 

[Chief]

Getting very Life of Brian on us, skip.

"Only the true messiah would deny his divinity!"

 

[Chief]

Got my certificate and a letter from the Bishop, no less! He knows my name *sigh*...

But seriously - The letter was full of sincere respect for me as a person, wishes of luck in my path to find truth etc. I'll post a copy when I get the chance, for those interested, and those looking to be personally affronted or what not.

 

[Catch 22]

Got my certificate and a letter from the Bishop, no less! He knows my name *sigh*...

But seriously - The letter was full of sincere respect for me as a person, wishes of luck in my path to find truth etc. I'll post a copy when I get the chance, for those interested, and those looking to be personally affronted or what not.

Hey Chief.

Did you partake of the holy sacrament and get confirmed? Tl,dr the whole thread.

Serious question from someone who thinks you're a joke.

Cheers

 

[Chief]

Oh noes! An internet guy thinks I'm a joke!

I think I was confirmed around 10 or 11 years old?

 

[Catch 22]

Oh noes! An internet guy thinks I'm a joke!

I think I was confirmed around 10 or 11 years old?

So you did both?

 

[Catch 22]

So you were baptised, confirmed, partook of holy communion, more than likely went to confession and I'm assuming some stupid woman would have married you (probably in a church).

Based on that, you have participated in five of the seven holy sacraments.

All you have to do now is get ordained and anoint the sick.

You really are a better cattle tick than I am Chief. Difference being I love my folks.

This whole thread is an absolute disgrace and should be deleted forthwith.

 

[Catch 22]

I think I was confirmed around 10 or 11 years old?

I'm calling shenanagins here.

This is plain and simple bulldust.

Unless your heathen parents wanted to rush you through the system.

 

[skipper kelly]

and those looking to be personally affronted or what not.

Why would anyone be personally affronted by what you did? You hoped that people would be upset by what you did but basically most people in this thread seem to be laughing at you. Its all in your mind.

 

[Chief]

As I said earlier, some people cannot handle the very idea that someone would not want to be part of their club.


As for the sacraments I don't recall the exact details but it had all happened by the time I was 11 or maybe 12 at the very latest - baptism, first communion, first confession, confirmation. I guess my parents wanted to rush me through the system.

Funnily enough they forgot to baptise my brother and I as babies so we copped that when I was about 6, on the tail end of a baby cousin's baptism. I do remember my brother trying to convince me they were going to dunk my head in a bucket.

 

[Caesar]

I'm calling shenanagins here.

This is plain and simple bulldust.

Unless your heathen parents wanted to rush you through the system.

Why? Maybe it was different when you were a kid, but when I was going through you were baptised at birth, Year 2 was confession, Year 3 was communion, and Year 6 was confirmation. So I was the same age as Chief when I was confirmed.

I actually think they confirm kids at the same time that they take communion these days, so the whole process is over by the time you're 7 or 8.

As I said earlier, some people cannot handle the very idea that someone would not want to be part of their club.

Oh come on, that's not it at all and you know it. Nobody can understand why you've gone to such great lengths for such negligible payoff, that's all.

 

[cartwright]

As I said earlier, some people cannot handle the very idea that someone would not want to be part of their club.


As for the sacraments I don't recall the exact details but it had all happened by the time I was 11 or maybe 12 at the very latest - baptism, first communion, first confession, confirmation. I guess my parents wanted to rush me through the system.

Funnily enough they forgot to baptise my brother and I as babies so we copped that when I was about 6, on the tail end of a baby cousin's baptism. I do remember my brother trying to convince me they were going to dunk my head in a bucket.

Thats how it was at my catholic primary school/church

Baptism = around 6 months
Confession /Communion= around grade 3, so 8 or 9
Confirmation = grade 6. I was 11.

I thought that was standard.

Although it had changed its name to "Reconciliation" no longer confession.

I remember lying to the priest, as an 7 year old I couldn't think of anything "bad" I had done.

 

[Chief]

Why would anyone be personally affronted by what you did?

That's what I'm wondering. The "those looking to be personally affronted" part was a bit facetious. As in, you'd have to be looking around for something to get upset about to actually be upset.

You hoped that people would be upset

No Skip. That's all in your mind.

 

[Chief]

Oh come on, that's not it at all and you know it. Nobody can understand why you've gone to such great lengths for such negligible payoff, that's all.

Couple of emails aren't such great lengths to satisfy curiosity. The whole process is over - talking about it in here has been the most time consuming part.

And as you've seen, any explanation I've given has been rejected. As I said:

Many here seem to have a pet theory why I'm doing this. If I reject the theory, I'm hiding something or deceiving myself; if I accept there could be a shade or element of their theory in there somewhere most seem to think that is proof of their wise insight into the apparent sole motivator of the decision and of my lack of self-knowledge (or my deception of others; or my evil trolling ways).

I didn't think it would get that much of a reaction. Maybe a few people curious to know the process and that's about it.

 

[Chief]

I remember lying to the priest, as an 7 year old I couldn't think of anything "bad" I had done.

I think I said I'd fought with my brothers and sisters and not done as my parents had told me. I remember being a bit miserable about it, in case I hadn't done ENOUGH wrong for the priest to find it a satisfactory first confession. Turned out to be about my last confession as well, as I recall. Or did they usually make you do another one at confirmation time? Can't remember. Too old.

 

[Caesar]

And as you've seen, any explanation I've given has been rejected. As I said:


I didn't think it would get that much of a reaction. Maybe a few people curious to know the process and that's about it.

Just people skeptical that there's really much more to it than ideology and the added benefit of annoying a few people while you're at it.

I mean, there's a reason why there's thousands upon thousands of lapsed Catholics in this country and yet basically nobody bothers with annotating their baptismal record. It's because it's so completely irrelevant in every practical facet of their lives that it never even occurs to anybody to bother.

Given the context, surely you can understand how it comes off to people as a little attention-seeking? Particularly given the slightly supercilious tone of the email in the OP, and your history of ragging on the RCC.