Rumour GFC 2016 Player Trading, Drafting, FA, Rumours, and Wish lists.

[Turbocat]

believe you me his goal kicking ability is the only thing stopping me from 100% endorsing his trading out.
If he was a HBF or a back pocket plumber I'd have cleaned out his locker by now, we however need to be somewhat pragmatic here.

In the short term I believe him to be more valuable to us than what a pick can provide, sure we need to look long term but given what we gave up at the trade table 12 months ago we also need to be wary of what the team resembles in the shortest term.

If we can find a trade that nets us a goal scorer then cya Steven. Otherwise I do think he should stay next season.
Worst case scenario he walks next year then we are a good chance at a Band 2 compo for him.

His goals are tempting ..but I think I can resist it.

 

[Pure_Ownage]

Anyone else have that terrible feeling that we are going to do something extremely silly. Such as agreeing/pushing to trade Motlop for pick 26 (Vickery compo)?

I might just be paranoid but this is the sort of terrible trade I think we will do.

Yes it concerns me a lot. And i dont get it given we would get 19 next year.

 

[Turbocat]

Yes it concerns me a lot. And i dont get it given we would get 19 next year.

Throw in a 2017 pick as well and id be happy with it...
but I think if it somehow doesn't net us Deludio then why do it. He is worth more to us than P26

 

[Pure_Ownage]

Throw in a 2017 pick as well and id be happy with it...
but I think if it somehow doesn't net us Deludio then why do it. He is worth more to us than P26

Not to mention it doesnt fix the 2 firsts over 4 years rule.

 

[Turbocat]

Not to mention it doesnt fix the 2 firsts over 4 years rule.

Yep borderline pointless. Sure we would get an extra handy kid in but really long odds anyone we pick would be ready to contribute in a 1 game let alone 10.
But just like how we got Motlop in the first place.. we do tend to take under and move on. This however is a contracted player and well unders. If it happens , id recommend staying away from an Rich threads for a while.

 

[Mad_Hatter]

I'll say it. I don't think the current list had what it takes to win a flag.
We have too many holes and lack the ruthlessness and determination of a Premiership team.
I don't see us having the ability to trade in ready made players to fill those holes and we have too good of a list to trade out a heap and bank bulk picks (ala 1999, 2001) so I think we are in for some frustrating years of being close enough but never actually taking that step.
Perhaps similar to the dogs circa 2008-2010 or even the Cats sides of the middle 90s.
I almost wish in a way we didn't get the 4 big ins last year.... Almost.

 

[Pure_Ownage]

I'll say it. I don't think the current list had what it takes to win a flag.
We have too many holes and lack the ruthlessness and determination of a Premiership team.
I don't see us having the ability to trade in ready made players to fill those holes and we have too good of a list to trade out a heap and bank bulk picks (ala 1999, 2001) so I think we are in for some frustrating years of being close enough but never actually taking that step.
Perhaps similar to the dogs circa 2008-2010 or even the Cats sides of the middle 90s.
I almost wish in a way we didn't get the 4 big ins last year.... Almost.

You wish we didn't get Danger? You serious?

 

[MelbCat]

With no currency other than motlop i hope we hang on to him. Go into 2017 with 2 first rounders and just try and upgrade the picks we already have and the fringe players we let go. This years draft isnt so strong so they say.

 

[Pure_Ownage]

Yep borderline pointless. Sure we would get an extra handy kid in but really long odds anyone we pick would be ready to contribute in a 1 game let alone 10.
But just like how we got Motlop in the first place.. we do tend to take under and move on. This however is a contracted player and well unders. If it happens , id recommend staying away from an Rich threads for a while.

Mate I will have to contain my dissatisfaction if it happens. Hopefully it won't.

 

[Rosso]

I'll say it. I don't think the current list had what it takes to win a flag.
We have too many holes and lack the ruthlessness and determination of a Premiership team.
I don't see us having the ability to trade in ready made players to fill those holes and we have too good of a list to trade out a heap and bank bulk picks (ala 1999, 2001) so I think we are in for some frustrating years of being close enough but never actually taking that step.
Perhaps similar to the dogs circa 2008-2010 or even the Cats sides of the middle 90s.
I almost wish in a way we didn't get the 4 big ins last year.... Almost.

So in all seriousness at the end of the home and away season did you think the dogs were a premiership winning side? I certainly didn't and the fact that we knocked them off during the year reasonably comfortably gives me a lot more hope.

Our season was inconsistent and that includes our two finals. Playing our best footy in September would certainly go a long way. We have the player's but they need to perform. We had a fair few players down on last year which was a big surprise but improvement can happen. I don't think that removing Stevie J last year and now possibly Mots and Kersten is the right thing to do. Seems to be following Carltons plan to get rid of Kennedy, Bettts & Waite.

 

[WA Cat]

Channel 7 news in Perth is reporting that the Eagles are considering (Geelongs) Mitch Clark as a potential back up ruckman in 2017.

 

[porgy]

I'll say it. I don't think the current list had what it takes to win a flag.
We have too many holes and lack the ruthlessness and determination of a Premiership team.
I don't see us having the ability to trade in ready made players to fill those holes and we have too good of a list to trade out a heap and bank bulk picks (ala 1999, 2001) so I think we are in for some frustrating years of being close enough but never actually taking that step.
Perhaps similar to the dogs circa 2008-2010 or even the Cats sides of the middle 90s.
I almost wish in a way we didn't get the 4 big ins last year.... Almost.

Have to agree, the year started well and the possibility to settle on a balanced structure and build as a team come finals was there. As the year went on massive holes began to appear and the gap between dangerwood and the rest and our complete reliance on them to compete was evident.
Adding to that the lack of talent under 23 is scary.
Sure we make finals and finish 4-6 but so what? What's the point. A few years time we fall off a bigger cliff than last year.
I can see a north melbourne /Brisbane (under voss) situation happening. Top up for years, fail, and leave the cupboard bare.
The team needs youth, speed and more mongrel.
Outside downhill skiers, an ageing slow defensive unit (full of brave warriors taken), and an unsettled dysfunctional forward line. With only dangerwood keeping us above water.
What is the plan B if maybe 2016 we overachieved?

 

[David the Cat]

Channel 7 news in Perth is reporting that the Eagles are considering (Geelongs) Mitch Clark as a potential back up ruckman in 2017.

Well now I'm really confused.....

 

[zb14]

Am I the only one, who's a bit bemused, by the yearly hysteria that seems to emerge regarding GWS fringe players. It seems like opposition clubs, and especially posters on bigfooty, go crazy for GWS off-cuts. It's one thing to nab a genuine player like Treloar, and to a lesser extent Tyson. But this faffing about guys like WHE, Steele, Stewart etc is bemusing to me. In reality, these guys are every bit the same as players in terms of value/development as say a Smedts/GHS/Murdoch. Yet I have seen numerous posters on the D & T board and elsewhere suggesting these guys are worth picks in the 20's or better. I've even seen it suggested more than once that Steele is worth a Top 10!

For mine, there are numerous reasons to be cautious when it comes to GWS guys. But the main one is the quality of the NEAFL. IMO, the jump from the VFL to the top level is a large one, and the longer an AFL draftee spends entrenched at the lower level the harder the gap is to bridge. This is especially amplified for anyone who spends significant development time in the NEAFL you'd think.

Looking at the list of guys GWS have traded out, there have been a number of players and yet no one really jumps out at me (apart from Josh Bruce) as a raging success.

Jack Hombsch (traded 2012), Dom Tyson, Taylor Adams, Kurt Aylett, Shaun Edwards, Josh Bruce, Sam Darley (all 2013) Jonathan O' Rourke, Kristian Jaksch, Mark Whiley, Jonathon Giles, Sam Frost (all 2014), Curtly Hampton, Jacob Townsend, Jed Lamb, Lachie Plowman, Andrew Phillips, Liam Sumner, Adam Treloar, Tomas Bugg (all 2015).

Disregarding Treloar, Adams and Tyson given they were premium trades, the list above is pretty underwhelming. If your looking to find hidden gold GWS isn't the best place to mine I reckon. Furthermore, even the 3 premium trades are currently in GWS favour I'd say. Treloar is a gun but has cost Coll 2 x picks 7. Tyson helped deliver Josh Kelly. Adams delivered Heath Shaw.

Buyer beware.

 

[CharacterFirst]

Have to agree, the year started well and the possibility to settle on a balanced structure and build as a team come finals was there. As the year went on massive holes began to appear and the gap between dangerwood and the rest and our complete reliance on them to compete was evident.
Adding to that the lack of talent under 23 is scary.
Sure we make finals and finish 4-6 but so what? What's the point. A few years time we fall off a bigger cliff than last year.
I can see a north melbourne /Brisbane (under voss) situation happening. Top up for years, fail, and leave the cupboard bare.
The team needs youth, speed and more mongrel.
Outside downhill skiers, an ageing slow defensive unit (full of brave warriors taken), and an unsettled dysfunctional forward line. With only dangerwood keeping us above water.
What is the plan B if maybe 2016 we overachieved?

I just don't understand this viewthat a number of people have expressed lately.

You/they want us to bottom out now, and try and rebuild for a flag.

But you/they seem to totally against the idea of spending 3-4 more years having a shot at the flag, and then bottoming out for a rebuild!

It isn't really very logical.

 

[Mad_Hatter]

You wish we didn't get Danger? You serious?

In my pessimistic state, a little bit. I LOVE danger at Geelong, is easily my favourite player now and I giggle like a love struck teenage girl when he plays however if we don't win a flag with him here then getting him has effectively cost us rebuilding now.

Perhaps (or likely) I'm clouded by how far away we looked against the swans, how in our loses we looked disinterested playing lesser sides (so IMO a lack desire to succeed and a lack of ruthlessness) and that was while we had Danger playing one of the great individual seasons and Selwood being his typical gun self.

We rely far too heavily on those 2 blokes, we lack a mobile, fast and accurate backline (for the most part), a dynamic midfield with blokes willing to give everything to win (looking at messers Duncan, Guthrie and Blicavs) and a forwardline revolving around one giant who has 3 blokes hanging off him and a few inconsistent and injury prone smaller, and slower, forwards.

We desperately lack a CHF (Hawkins to CHF is my choice) and we desperately lack pace and foot skills from the backline.

Can we fix those issues? Almost certainly. Will we? Let's find out.

 

[speedybundy]

R. Henderson as a FA (if we can afford him).... if cost nothing I suppose it feasible.. personally Id prefer us to give the role to younger player on our list , or draft a kid ready to give it a go. Gees , HBF..its not the hardest role to find players for. Henderson is not much better than Murdoch defensively.

Kersten for Fremantles R3 (don't want to do that, but looks like its going to happen).. about all we get ..be happy he just doesn't psd us

Vardy + R3 for Marley Williams + R4. NO , just NO.. no interest in him..at all..none. And why would Collingwood want Vardy..thats a silly trade all around.

Motlop for Deledio + R3.. Cant see it happing.Rich will want more or why do it.

Armfield. ... Enough with the McDonalds food

Sam Ried ... why not give him 30 if Vardy is on the way out , the medial team probably will not notice the difference.

Just what we becoming here. Deludio I can at least understand the logic... but anything less then we are not trusting the players we have. If we don't trust them or doubt them or have made our mind up then ..then clean it out.

Henderson - Think we have enough 'defensive' small defenders, we lack consistent run and carry/quick ball movement which he provides. If its not too hard why do we lack players who can play that role
Williams is a running defender, I'd be more willing to take a punt on him then sell the farm for Hanley. As for Vardy to the pies I'd think they'd have interest in a key forward/ruck to help out Moore and Grundy
The Deledio one is too good for us looking at it again you're right

 

[Mahlepi]

I can only assume they thought he would stay too. I agree he is making a bad call with Freo Lyon doesn't have a great record playing young players and Kersten will get lots of opportunities here. I can only assume Freo are offering more contract years and $ and he has jumped at it.

I can understand why they didn't contract Vardy and Clark longer given their injury histories but not doing so with Kersten was a bad call. It was foreseeable clubs would try and poach him as KPF are the hardest type of commodity to draft outside the top 10 so clubs prefer to poach them off other clubs. I am not blind to Kersten's flaws but it annoys me we will get about pick 40 for him and we have a very small chance of drafting a KPF as good or better than him with that pick. Or we end up having to trade in an inferior version like Aaron Black. I like Horlin Smith but mids like him are a dime a dozen, whoever thought it was a good idea to extend his contract last year rather than Kersten's made a bad call (unless we tried and Kersten refused but that I doubt). Here's hoping we don't lose Stanley too that would be even worse.

Kersten wanted to roll the dice
With all the outs and a Bartel retirement george just might get a go as a permanent forward
Motlop for plus 20 pick is seriously dum trading

 

[Stan The Caddy]

Throw in a 2017 pick as well and id be happy with it...
but I think if it somehow doesn't net us Deludio then why do it. He is worth more to us than P26

Like I've said to other posters, it could be as simple as the fact that we just don't want him any more.

People have chosen to bury their head in the sand regarding Motlop for a long time now. Perhaps we just need to start looking at the situation for what it really is...

 

[manboob]

In reality, these guys are every bit the same as players in terms of value/development as say a Smedts/GHS/Murdoch.

go home - you're drunk.

 

[catstragic]

Obviously its unrealistic to expect to gain anything significant this trade period, so its all about damage mitigation I guess.
It would be a shame to lose Motlop, but more for his potential output than historic output.
If he goes its not the end of the universe. If a Lids for Motlop situation eventuated I would be happy with that.
Slight unders for us, But better than a +20's pick. I think we would need 2 x 20's or a sub 15 to fairly compensate for losing him. it wont happen though .

I think we have the talent to contend again next year. I don't think its reasonable to expect the coaching team to assemble a concentration of talent equivalent to what powered the team through the premiership era. Equally I think that most other teams excepting GWS are also operating under similar constraints. We have a solid spine, solid defence and talented midfield. Given an improved game plan, improvement in out younger players and no injuries to key personal we are capable of winning premierships over the next 2-3 years. I think we need to trade accordingly, maintaining a nucleus of 25 or so, moving on anyone else for the maximum return.

Cant wait to see what happens!

 

[catstragic]

In my pessimistic state, a little bit. I LOVE danger at Geelong, is easily my favourite player now and I giggle like a love struck teenage girl when he plays however if we don't win a flag with him here then getting him has effectively cost us rebuilding now.

I think its a bit strong to suggest that bringing in danger cost us a complete rebuild.
Dean Gore Hasn't really set the world on fire. Ditto Josh walker.
The trades we lost turned into Sam Weidemen, Luke Partington and Bailey rice. They played 3 games combined this season.
We got Dangerfield, S Selwood, Z Smith and Henderson. And didn't tear the salary cap in half. That's literally the greatest trade period of the decade.

 

[SkittleCats]

In my pessimistic state, a little bit. I LOVE danger at Geelong, is easily my favourite player now and I giggle like a love struck teenage girl when he plays however if we don't win a flag with him here then getting him has effectively cost us rebuilding now.

Perhaps (or likely) I'm clouded by how far away we looked against the swans, how in our loses we looked disinterested playing lesser sides (so IMO a lack desire to succeed and a lack of ruthlessness) and that was while we had Danger playing one of the great individual seasons and Selwood being his typical gun self.

We rely far too heavily on those 2 blokes, we lack a mobile, fast and accurate backline (for the most part), a dynamic midfield with blokes willing to give everything to win (looking at messers Duncan, Guthrie and Blicavs) and a forwardline revolving around one giant who has 3 blokes hanging off him and a few inconsistent and injury prone smaller, and slower, forwards.

We desperately lack a CHF (Hawkins to CHF is my choice) and we desperately lack pace and foot skills from the backline.

Can we fix those issues? Almost certainly. Will we? Let's find out.

We looked far away against Sydney but we were the only team this year not to lose to the Dogs. Everything you point out in your post isnt necessarily the players fault alone, but is perhaps more a fault of the coaching and player development. I think it's clear we lack the ability to extract the most from the players, and that failure falls primarily on the coaches shoulders first. You also neglect to point out that next year we will be sans Enright in the backline but will gain Thurlow and a more experienced Ruggles and Bews who immediately inject pace into our defensive group. In the forward line we have Gregson, Cockatoo, McCarthy, Menzel, and even Lang to add (4 of whom didnt play prelim final night). All of those guys will add pace and mongrel to the team, and will change the dynamic of the forward line, as they did at times earlier in the season when they were playing in the seniors.

I grow tired of the calls to "rebuild" as that invariably means heading back to the draft. You could have all the picks in the world and it doesnt guarantee you anything, just look at the Suns. The AFL draft is the biggest exercise in speculative buying the world has ever seen. Sure we could trade a few players out and thus buy back into the first round, we could even sell the farm for picks 1, 2, or 3. But it buys us what? nothing more than a chance at someone with potential. Why would we do that when we know we have a top 4 team now?

Im not advocating for bringing in a bunch of over-the-hill 30+ year olds. Deledio is different as he has been elite when he is fit, and may still have 3-4 good years left in him. But players like Wells and Balantyne, the club would be stupid to bring them in and i dont think we will. But i have no problem with the club taking a "here and now" approach as in the now we are a chance at a flag. And as we are seeing with Hawthorn, it doesnt take much to regenerate a list outside of the draft when the fall is close. What i hope is that we look long and hard at who might be gettable from GWS and the Suns in the next year or two, as both clubs will hemorrhage players as a matter of necessity, and bargains may be had as a result.

 

[Stan The Caddy]

Unless Mots has serious personal issues in Geelong like not being able to buy guitar strings in town then I expect he will be in the blue and white hoops in 2017 and we work from there for 2018 and beyond.

I reckon he's gone mate. If we can get anything that is even close to resembling a fair trade then we'll take it IMO.

 

[Rockford]

I think its a bit strong to suggest that bringing in danger cost us a complete rebuild.
Dean Gore Hasn't really set the world on fire. Ditto Josh walker.
The trades we lost turned into Sam Weidemen, Luke Partington and Bailey rice. They played 3 games combined this season.
We got Dangerfield, S Selwood, Z Smith and Henderson. And didn't tear the salary cap in half. That's literally the greatest trade period of the decade.

I think what he means if we didn't recruit Danger, Henderson etc.. we'd have finished down the ladder and been "primed" for a rebuild because we're shitter and have better draft picks. * that. I hope we're top 4 again next season, we got there this year with 3/4 of our new recruits still finding their feet and a few players that we typically rely on going backwards. If our recruits gel even better next season and we get _the same_ output from the 3-4 that slid this year as we did in 2015 then this list's output can improve further.