Rumour GFC 2018 Player Trading, Drafting, FA, Rumours, and Wish lists - PT3

[Jhye Clark 13]

Link: http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/a...g/news-story/cc89c43065a33d650cec16278d26d064


Link: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Scott_(Australian_footballer)

Looks like Bailey Scott will make a choice between us or the Suns...

My hunch is that he'll remain on the GC and play for the Suns.

 

[ChookNorris]

My hunch is that he'll remain on the GC and play for the Suns.

I'd agree. Have any academy players changed clubs to date? I know some more fringe draftees have not been nominated by clubs.
All comes down to what a shables the club really is? Can't hold on to anyone it seems, might be the only thing in our favour.

 

[Jhye Clark 13]

I'd agree. Have any academy players changed clubs to date? I know some more fringe draftees have not been nominated by clubs.
All comes down to what a shables the club really is? Can't hold on to anyone it seems, might be the only thing in our favour.

He resides on the GC which is a huge factor imo and he'll be guaranteed game time relatively quickly. I'd be surprised If doesn't nominate GC.

 

[Landgraft]

He resides on the GC which is a huge factor imo and he'll be guaranteed game time relatively quickly. I'd be surprised If doesn't nominate GC.

One big thing I suspect will be if our facilities/coaching/culture were able to wow him at all. These are the areas we have comparative advantage in and could be the basis for pitching a chance to start an AFL career instead of being thrown into an environment that won't nurture him as well.

 

[Jhye Clark 13]

One big thing I suspect will be if our facilities/coaching/culture were able to wow him at all. These are the areas we have comparative advantage in and could be the basis for pitching a chance to start an AFL career instead of being thrown into an environment that won't nurture him as well.

I'm not really fussed to be honest. His type of player really isn't one of our needs. I think Oscar Brownless is a better prospect and serves the same purpose.

 

[Pure_Ownage]

I'd agree. Have any academy players changed clubs to date? I know some more fringe draftees have not been nominated by clubs.
All comes down to what a shables the club really is? Can't hold on to anyone it seems, might be the only thing in our favour.

Dunkley didnt go to Sydney and there are others.

I think Scott will depend how the Suns go if they look on the improve staying home will appeal to him. If they go crap this year lose Lynch (FA) and more senior players and look set for a 5 year rebuild his manager is probably going to help nudge him towards a more successful club that develops players well.

At least he's (from his recent interview) open to all three of his choices (GC Geelong North Melb) plus the other clubs.

 

[Landgraft]

I'm not really fussed to be honest. His type of player really isn't one of our needs. I think Oscar Brownless is a better prospect and serves the same purpose.

I'm happy for him to go wherever for the most part but at the same time this would stick in the craw of Suns fans which is always fun.

 

[CatTricks]

My hunch is that he'll remain on the GC and play for the Suns.

My thoughts too.
Not sure how we would be able to accumulate the points to facilitate taking him in addition to the other father-son eligible players.
I suspect the club know where they stand too.

 

[ChookNorris]

My thoughts too.
Not sure how we would be able to accumulate the points to facilitate taking him in addition to the other father-son eligible players.
I suspect the club know where they stand too.

Is anyone able to confirm how the deficits in points works?

For example if Scott nominates and we need to use a 2nd rounder on him, and we end up 200 points short overall.

Would our first round pick the following year drop to make up for those points, or do we sacrifice points on next years 2nd as that is the round he was picked in.

 

[Landgraft]

Is anyone able to confirm how the deficits in points works?

For example if Scott nominates and we need to use a 2nd rounder on him, and we end up 200 points short overall.

Would our first round pick the following year drop to make up for those points, or do we sacrifice points on next years 2nd as that is the round he was picked in.

I believe that would be next years 2nd to lose points.

What I wonder is what happens if we'd already traded the future 2nd out before the draft and then deficit matched in the 2nd round.

 

[dazbroncos]

Is anyone able to confirm how the deficits in points works?

For example if Scott nominates and we need to use a 2nd rounder on him, and we end up 200 points short overall.

Would our first round pick the following year drop to make up for those points, or do we sacrifice points on next years 2nd as that is the round he was picked in.

Pure_Ownage is well across all of this.

But im pretty sure we can "go into pick debt" from the next year to top up points, im just not sure how that is done. Whether you have to take your first, use the points needs and you get the balance credited back as say a 2nd and 3rd im not sure - or perhaps you just take the closest pick to the points value you need and cash that "in" im not sure.

GO Catters

 

[Pure_Ownage]

Is anyone able to confirm how the deficits in points works?

For example if Scott nominates and we need to use a 2nd rounder on him, and we end up 200 points short overall.

Would our first round pick the following year drop to make up for those points, or do we sacrifice points on next years 2nd as that is the round he was picked in.

No the deficit occurs in the round the bid happens e.g. if oscar is bid r2 and we match and bailey r2 and we dont have points left to match its our r2 2019 that the points come off not r1. The club already has 2 x r3 (us and rich) and 2 x r4 (carl and gc) for bid matching points and we can obviously trade out players for picks if we need more points so we should be fine.

 

[Pure_Ownage]

Pure_Ownage is well across all of this.

But im pretty sure we can "go into pick debt" from the next year to top up points, im just not sure how that is done. Whether you have to take your first, use the points needs and you get the balance credited back as say a 2nd and 3rd im not sure - or perhaps you just take the closest pick to the points value you need and cash that "in" im not sure.

GO Catters

Deficit occurs in the same round as any bid and any residual points come back to the club. For e.g. if oscar bid r2 and we are 300 points short (after 20% discount and whatever picks we have) then 300 points come off our r 2 2019. For e.g. if the r2 is worth 650 points that pick pushes back and we are given whatever pick in the 2019 order is worth 350 points etc.

 

[Landgraft]

Deficit occurs in the same round as any bid and any residual points come back to the club. For e.g. if oscar bid r2 and we are 300 points short (after 20% discount and whatever picks we have) then 300 points come off our r 2 2019. For e.g. if the r2 is worth 650 points that pick pushes back and we are given whatever pick in the 2019 order is worth 350 points etc.

Are you aware of how it would interact with the trading of future picks?

 

[Art Vandelay_]

Might interest Pure_Ownage or Turbocat

https://theage.com.au/sport/afl/the-afl-s-secret-formula-for-free-agency-compensation-20180221-p4z16j.html

Geelong were controversially awarded the same compensation for free agent Steven Motlop as the Brisbane Lions received for Tom Rockliff partly because of the one-year age difference between the pair.

Motlop, who surprisingly earned the Cats an end-of-first-round choice (pick 18), just scraped into the same compensation ‘‘band’’ as Rockliff, who was paid close to $100,000 a season more than the ex-Cat over the same period and whose salary nearly delivered the Lions pick No.2 in the 2017 national draft.

The Motlop decision was made on the basis of a secret formula that The Age can reveal in detail – the so-called ‘‘secret herbs and spices’’ which also renders the length of contract largely irrelevant to the draft pick that teams get for losing a free agent.

Key components of the compensation system include:
■A free agent paid $2 million over two years will be ranked higher on the compensation table than one who is paid $3.5 million over four years. The length of contract is only a ‘‘tie-breaker’’ if annual salary is equal to another player. The contract must be at least two years.

■The compensation is based entirely on guaranteed money, or the ‘‘base’’ salary, with incentive-based payments counting for nothing. A player who is paid $500,000 a season, who can make $800,000 with incentives, is ranked on the basis of a $500,000 contract.
It was this factor - plus the player’s age - that meant North Melbourne received only a second-round pick for star Daniel Wells, even though Wells can make more than $1.5 million over his three-year contract.

His base is less than $500,000 a season and he was 31 when he signed with Collingwood.


■The key to the formula is a ranking system, in which every player in the AFL aged 25 or older is placed in order, based on the size of their (guaranteed) contract.

The highest-paid players are ranked at 100 points, the lowest at 0.

The AFL then allocates up to 12 additional points for a player’s age. At 25 (as of October 31), a player receives the maximum of 12 points, a 26-year-old earns another 10 points, 27-year-olds gain another 8, 28 brings 6 and so forth, with a 30-year-old worth just 2 extra points.

Players older than 30 earn no points - which also counted against Carlton when the Blues lost Jarrad Waite to free agency and received nothing. Under this system, thus, the maximum a player can receive is 112 points.

AFL sources say that the age of a player is important, because two fewer points might see a free agent slide 10 or so placings in the rankings, when they are paid the same money.


Motlop is understood to have been right at the bottom of the band for players who earn an end-of-first-round draft pick, while Rockliff - who was paid an estimated $650,000-$700,000 by Port - was right at the top of that band and not far from earning the Lions pick No.2.

First-round picks are awarded to players who rank in the top 5 per cent, based on the points, while end-of-first-round picks are given for free agents in the 5-15 per cent bracket.

Second-round picks - which Tyrone Vickery and Chris Mayne netted Richmond and Fremantle respectively in 2016 - are for free agents in the 15-30 band. End of second round is for those ranked in the 30-50 per cent group.

The AFL has deliberately avoided letting the clubs know the compensation formula, in part because of concerns that it will be manipulated - as some clubs have contemplated.
Clubs have discussed deals in which a player would be paid enough to earn a first-round pick, and then the club receiving the pick would pay part of the salary of a different player in a ‘‘separate’’ trade.

But clubs can only guess at the ranking of a player if they know where he will be placed, contract-wise, compared to the rest of the competition.


Clubs can appeal the compensation decision, but none has chosen to as yet. The AFL can also intervene and change the compensation - as some thought it should in the Motlop case - if it feels that the outcome is an anomaly.

There is a view from some at club level that first-round compensation picks should be placed in the middle of the first round - giving every team that doesn’t play finals an uninterrupted first-rounder.

Calls for compensation to be scrapped seem unlikely to be heeded, given the risks for northern market clubs such as the Giants and Suns, who would potentially see their lists decimated.

 

[Turbocat]

Might interest Pure_Ownage or Turbocat

https://theage.com.au/sport/afl/the-afl-s-secret-formula-for-free-agency-compensation-20180221-p4z16j.html

Interesting... some might say very convenient for the afl to find a way to grease the ablett deal wheel.... not to mention 12 months earlier when a club would have to cough up one of their picks..there were no takers.

I have moved a tad on the comp issue.. I think RFA is the player that should deliver comp but once a player is ufa , i think there is a case for no comp.

and I think having the first band of comp in the middle of draft is not a bad idea . Single figure picks are just to valuable and giving a club a pick too drastically affects the position of the other clubs.

 

[Landgraft]

Interesting... some might say very convenient for the afl to find a way to grease the ablett deal wheel.... not to mention 12 months earlier when a club would have to cough up one of their picks..there were no takers.

I have moved a tad on the comp issue.. I think RFA is the player that should deliver comp but once a player is ufa , i think there is a case for no comp.

and I think having the first band of comp in the middle of draft is not a bad idea . Single figure picks are just to valuable and giving a club a pick too drastically affects the position of the other clubs.

Comp should either be completely independent or dependant on ladder position imo. The current system that flips between the two is just bizarre.

 

[catempire]

Interesting... some might say very convenient for the afl to find a way to grease the ablett deal wheel.... not to mention 12 months earlier when a club would have to cough up one of their picks..there were no takers.

What do you mean? I thought the article proved there was no “convenience” and it was just a quirk of the formula.

 

[Turbocat]

What do you mean? I thought the article proved there was no “convenience” and it was just a quirk of the formula.

What do I mean? I mean that that it was quite convenient for us and for Gold Coast and for the AFL that the secret formula suited the Motlop situation and that now sometime later it has been leaked/become public that it suited the Motlop contract so closely.
Of course it may have been like that from day one , one would think in a robust and open set of rules there would be no doubt because it would have been known what the rules were...but as it was a KFC calculation at the time of the trade we can only nod our heads and say it was very "lucky" that Motlop just scraped into that comp.

 

[catempire]

What do I mean? I mean that that it was quite convenient for us and for Gold Coast and for the AFL that the secret formula suited the Motlop situation and that now sometime later it has been leaked/become public that it suited the Motlop contract so closely.
Of course it may have been like that from day one , one would think in a robust and open set of rules there would be no doubt because it would have been known what the rules were...but as it was a KFC calculation at the time of the trade we can only nod our heads and say it was very "lucky" that Motlop just scraped into that comp.

Mate the ‘cynical’ username is already taken!

 

[willcxe]

Not sure if anyone else saw this, from a HS article last week.
http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/a...g/news-story/cc89c43065a33d650cec16278d26d064
THE WHISPER

We hear one father-son prospect who has a choice of clubs this year won’t be going to one in particular. The reason? His old man is still dirty about being left out of a finals team back in his day.

I wonder if they’re talking about Scott, only reference I could find was Robert not being in the Roos 1999 flag team. Wayne Carey said he was unlucky. Can’t remember him being specifically dropped or left out of any of our finals teams but couldn’t find him in the 1994 GF team, and he was traded at the end of that season.

 

[Landgraft]

Not sure if anyone else saw this, from a HS article last week.
http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/a...g/news-story/cc89c43065a33d650cec16278d26d064
THE WHISPER

We hear one father-son prospect who has a choice of clubs this year won’t be going to one in particular. The reason? His old man is still dirty about being left out of a finals team back in his day.

I wonder if they’re talking about Scott, only reference I could find was Robert not being in the Roos 1999 flag team. Wayne Carey said he was unlucky. Can’t remember him being specifically dropped or left out of any of our finals teams but couldn’t find him in the 1994 GF team, and he was traded at the end of that season.

Its an interesting thought but imo 'whisper' is just journalist for bulldust.

If it was something they believed then it would just be a story.

 

[Boxhead_31]

Who says we don’t have room in the cap? We have a whole $82 left to pay someone

 

[Larry Donohue]

What's the story with this young Dhurkkay kid? Promising?>

 

[CatRiot]

I reckon someone like Gaff would compliment our team very well... However, we wouldn't have the cap for him.

Duncan has one of the wings, whilst the other will be fought between - Kelly, Guthrie, Parfitt, Parsons, Murdoch, Thurlow it seems.