Ghost train fire Sydney 1979

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BFew

Norm Smith Medallist
Mar 5, 2017
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Alan's wife would not release the evidence documents she claims Alan left, until after a year’s mourning as required by her late husband’s Jewish religion.
Interesting seeing as how the year is not up until later this month.
Still 4 days to go.

Embedded in this article about David Saffron's very recent Ponzi scheme is an update on the above.
Interestingly, no criminal charges have been laid against him.
Just a court order to pay USD $32 million to pay back/off investors and civil fines.

'Abe Saffron: Grandson of legendary Sydney crime figure in trouble in America
April 19, 2021'

'Alan’s family has not yet released the promised documents as the NSW State Coroner Teresa O’Sullivan is considering holding a fresh inquest into the unsolved blaze.'
 

Kurve

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Dec 27, 2016
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Still 4 days to go.

Embedded in this article about David Saffron's very recent Ponzi scheme is an update on the above.
Interestingly, no criminal charges have been laid against him.
Just a court order to pay USD $32 million to pay back/off investors and civil fines.

'Abe Saffron: Grandson of legendary Sydney crime figure in trouble in America
April 19, 2021'

'Alan’s family has not yet released the promised documents as the NSW State Coroner Teresa O’Sullivan is considering holding a fresh inquest into the unsolved blaze.'
That might be interesting enough to rattle some cages.
 

BFew

Norm Smith Medallist
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Below from a year ago, is the first I've read that Alan Saffron had diaries of his father (Abe (Mr Sin)) locked in the safe of Angus and Robertson, marked ‘never to be released’ until he died. (he died exactly one year ago as of tomorrow).

By ANDREW WOODHOUSE
Posted on 29 April 2020


'Abe Saffron a criminal in Kings Cross in the 1970s was linked to other crime bosses including developers.
He bribed police and his illegal nightclubs were frequented by police with the money couriered by his son, Alan.'

'Alan’s recent book, describing his life in the Cross in the 70s, was launched in Sydney a few years ago and I met him on the streets of Kings Cross.

“Do you know who murdered Juanita Nielsen?” I asked him. “It’s all in my father’s diaries,” he replied, “which are locked in the safe of Angus and Robertson, publishers, and marked ‘never to be released’ until I die.”
“Why?” I asked. “Because I would fear for my own life,” he responded.

He implied what others have said, namely: that criminal underworld figures of the 1970s and some police who may be implicated are still alive and might seek retribution if new investigations were now launched.

However, Alan’s widow, Genevieve Saffron, 73, has said she intends to release the diaries, saying: “I want redemption”, to respect his wishes and for the facts to be revealed.'
 

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zedx

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Below from a year ago, is the first I've read that Alan Saffron had diaries of his father (Abe (Mr Sin)) locked in the safe of Angus and Robertson, marked ‘never to be released’ until he died. (he died exactly one year ago as of tomorrow).

By ANDREW WOODHOUSE
Posted on 29 April 2020


'Abe Saffron a criminal in Kings Cross in the 1970s was linked to other crime bosses including developers.
He bribed police and his illegal nightclubs were frequented by police with the money couriered by his son, Alan.'

'Alan’s recent book, describing his life in the Cross in the 70s, was launched in Sydney a few years ago and I met him on the streets of Kings Cross.

“Do you know who murdered Juanita Nielsen?” I asked him. “It’s all in my father’s diaries,” he replied, “which are locked in the safe of Angus and Robertson, publishers, and marked ‘never to be released’ until I die.”
“Why?” I asked. “Because I would fear for my own life,” he responded.

He implied what others have said, namely: that criminal underworld figures of the 1970s and some police who may be implicated are still alive and might seek retribution if new investigations were now launched.

However, Alan’s widow, Genevieve Saffron, 73, has said she intends to release the diaries, saying: “I want redemption”, to respect his wishes and for the facts to be revealed.'
Roll on 24th April! Then we will know all! But will we???
 

Kane McGoodwin

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Well done investigation which should lead to NSW Government having a decent Coronial inquest. The victims families deserve the truth for some closure. There is still a possibility the 3 bikies can be convicted.

Wran, Police & all the corrupt cronies deserve to be condemned & their true legacy in the open.

Yet another reminder why we need proper ICAC'S for all governments. We badly need a Commonweslth one, as there will be people who will abuse their power.
 

BFew

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'MEDIA RELEASE
10 MAY 2021
... On tonight’s 7.30, reporter Caro Meldrum-Hanna speaks to three new eyewitnesses about what they saw at Luna Park in June 1979. They were never interviewed by police and have never spoken publicly before....

A 7.30 SPECIAL REPORT INTO LUNA PARK’S GHOST TRAIN FIRE, MONDAY 10 MAY AT 7:30PM ON ABC'
 

BFew

Norm Smith Medallist
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Names, circumstances and current/1979 pics of the 3 new witnesses to be aired on the ABC TV 7:30 Report tonight, contained in the below.

Spoiler alert for those wanting to be surprised by what's on the telly tonight!

I was hoping that at least one of these witnesses was one of the alleged bikies or somehow connected to one of them. Alas not.

Could the bikies have been a cunning decoy, whilst the actual culprits that started the fire on a night when their access into and out of the Ghost Train ride by one of the out of public view access points, was made all that easier since the staffer who normally worked inside the ride, was not working that shift and had not been replaced by the Park's Management that evening shift, for some yet to be publicly disclosed reason.

Luna Park security so busy following the bikies, that it probably made it much easier for someone dressed more normally to fuel/start the Ghost Train Ride.

'All three witnesses were at Luna Park on the night of the fire but were never contacted or interviewed by NSW Police, and were not included at the 1979 coronial inquest.'

'Mr Visser said when he rode the Ghost Train earlier that night, there was no smell of kerosene and nothing was out of the ordinary.
But during a second ride later that night, something was amiss.
"I could distinctly smell the kerosene burning," he said.
"Absolutely … There's no doubt about it."
Mr Visser remembers the strong smell of kerosene being "very strange" because it was not present earlier that night.
He wanted to speak to police the next day and tell them about the kerosene but says he was deterred by the actions of the officer in charge.
"When I heard the news report the next morning that [the fire was caused by] an electrical fault, well, you just believed the police, because the police are law-abiding people," he said.
"You believe what you hear from the police.
... "As a child, my mother had kerosene cookers to keep the soup warm. And that smell, that kerosene-burning smell, is something that stays with you all the time.""'

'Two new Luna Park staffers have come forward to the ABC to reveal they also saw a suspicious group of bikies at the funfair that night.

... Ms Lawson has come forward to reveal she distinctly remembers standing inside the booth at the entrance gates of Luna Park when she saw a group of men queuing up to come inside.
"They were dressed and looked like bikies," Ms Lawson told the ABC.
"I thought it was unusual. It was not a place that bikies would frequent or for bikies to come to."
Ms Lawson said she was so concerned she made sure security followed them after they had entered the park.
She said she saw the bikies again later that night, and they were behaving oddly.
"What they were really doing is just sort of killing time," she said.
"They weren't really interested in riding rides. They were just hanging around.
"Those bikies had been around different parts of the park during that night."
It was after this second sighting of the bikies that Ms Lawson said the fire in the Ghost Train broke out.'

Kathy Dewar was 24 and working a weekend shift at the chip bar on the night of the fire.
... Ms Dewar said it was unusual for bikies so "rough-looking" to be at Luna Park.
"These were young guys who wore leather boots, long hair. They just looked kind of a bit out of place at Luna Park," she said.
"It was very unusual to see a group like that at the park."
 

sprockets

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"... she made sure security followed them ..."

Presuming security followed them, because Ms Lawson made sure they did, how could the bikies have started the fire?
 

BFew

Norm Smith Medallist
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Presuming security followed them, because Ms Lawson made sure they did, how could the bikies have started the fire?
We'll need to hear from the security that claimedly followed them to some unknown degree that night, if they are even still alive, or remember what went down that 1979 night.

 

zedx

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Names, circumstances and current/1979 pics of the 3 new witnesses to be aired on the ABC TV 7:30 Report tonight, contained in the below.

Spoiler alert for those wanting to be surprised by what's on the telly tonight!

I was hoping that at least one of these witnesses was one of the alleged bikies or somehow connected to one of them. Alas not.

Could the bikies have been a cunning decoy, whilst the actual culprits that started the fire on a night when their access into and out of the Ghost Train ride by one of the out of public view access points, was made all that easier since the staffer who normally worked inside the ride, was not working that shift and had not been replaced by the Park's Management that evening shift, for some yet to be publicly disclosed reason.

Luna Park security so busy following the bikies, that it probably made it much easier for someone dressed more normally to fuel/start the Ghost Train Ride.

'All three witnesses were at Luna Park on the night of the fire but were never contacted or interviewed by NSW Police, and were not included at the 1979 coronial inquest.'

'Mr Visser said when he rode the Ghost Train earlier that night, there was no smell of kerosene and nothing was out of the ordinary.
But during a second ride later that night, something was amiss.
"I could distinctly smell the kerosene burning," he said.
"Absolutely … There's no doubt about it."
Mr Visser remembers the strong smell of kerosene being "very strange" because it was not present earlier that night.
He wanted to speak to police the next day and tell them about the kerosene but says he was deterred by the actions of the officer in charge.
"When I heard the news report the next morning that [the fire was caused by] an electrical fault, well, you just believed the police, because the police are law-abiding people," he said.
"You believe what you hear from the police.
... "As a child, my mother had kerosene cookers to keep the soup warm. And that smell, that kerosene-burning smell, is something that stays with you all the time.""'

'Two new Luna Park staffers have come forward to the ABC to reveal they also saw a suspicious group of bikies at the funfair that night.

... Ms Lawson has come forward to reveal she distinctly remembers standing inside the booth at the entrance gates of Luna Park when she saw a group of men queuing up to come inside.
"They were dressed and looked like bikies," Ms Lawson told the ABC.
"I thought it was unusual. It was not a place that bikies would frequent or for bikies to come to."
Ms Lawson said she was so concerned she made sure security followed them after they had entered the park.
She said she saw the bikies again later that night, and they were behaving oddly.
"What they were really doing is just sort of killing time," she said.
"They weren't really interested in riding rides. They were just hanging around.
"Those bikies had been around different parts of the park during that night."
It was after this second sighting of the bikies that Ms Lawson said the fire in the Ghost Train broke out.'

Kathy Dewar was 24 and working a weekend shift at the chip bar on the night of the fire.
... Ms Dewar said it was unusual for bikies so "rough-looking" to be at Luna Park.
"These were young guys who wore leather boots, long hair. They just looked kind of a bit out of place at Luna Park," she said.
"It was very unusual to see a group like that at the park."
I can't recall why the staffer was not working on the night of the fire? Can some one please enlighten me?
And regarding the bikies - no one seems to recall if they were wearing their patches? Which would have made they identifiable. How and why then, did people identify them as bikies? Could they not have just been some rough looking hoods?
...and another person smelling kerosene before the fire!!
 

BFew

Norm Smith Medallist
Mar 5, 2017
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I can't recall why the staffer was not working on the night of the fire? Can some one please enlighten me?

'After working through the afternoon, REDACTED left for a friend’s 21st birthday party. He had told his bosses well in advance but management didn’t roster a replacement for the evening shift.
Without him, there was no attendant to patrol inside the Ghost Train.'
 

BFew

Norm Smith Medallist
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'families of the victims are nervous and concerned that if this is just a review of the original investigation, then it is vital that they avoid relying on the evidence taken at the time. There must be new, fresh evidence.'

Linked in the above is this podcast recorded today on the situation.
(Caro Meldrum-Hanna joined Jonesy & Amanda for an exclusive chat)
 

Bunk Moreland

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I can't recall why the staffer was not working on the night of the fire? Can some one please enlighten me?
And regarding the bikies - no one seems to recall if they were wearing their patches? Which would have made they identifiable. How and why then, did people identify them as bikies? Could they not have just been some rough looking hoods?
...and another person smelling kerosene before the fire!!
Ive always assumed they weren’t actually bikies, they just had a bikie “look” - long hair and rough - and so were referred to as such.

I think they would’ve just been the ones at the bottom of the food chain who got the final order to carry it out.
 

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zedx

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Ive always assumed they weren’t actually bikies, they just had a bikie “look” - long hair and rough - and so were referred to as such.

I think they would’ve just been the ones at the bottom of the food chain who got the final order to carry it out.
My thoughts are that the 'bikie' description was just a red herring to take the focus off the real perps. One person mentions 'the bikies' and suddenly every one remembers 'the bikies' although there was no actual evidence they were bikies - just leads everyone down the wrong path !!
 

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