Goals not valued enough?

[lordbob]

Happened again yesterday. Despite kicking 4 goals Jesse Hogan was seen as GWS's 9th best player on the field, losing to Bedford who only got 13 disposals and 0 goals but also got 13 tackles in the game which means 13 tackles are worth more than 4 goals.

Or Amiss, who also got 4 goals but was somehow rated as Fremantle's 15th best player of the match.

Because Amiss detracts points for poor accuracy.

 

[RUNVS]

Apparently Jesse Hogan was only the 4th best GWS player yesterday according to SuperCoach, and the 5th best according to AFL Fantasy.

He kicked 9 goals.

 

[deck]

Champion Data demonstrates this, they're trying to flog their stats packages as a scientific tool for punters, but they had the Pies losing most games in 22/23 on expected score.

They had to "tweak the algorithm" because, well, their system is bulldust. Stats are subjective: the only numbers that matter is the final score.

The early days of there ranking points was a disaster. Ruckman filled out most the top 10 spots due them way overrating the value of a hit out.

 

[iameviljez]

Apparently Jesse Hogan was only the 4th best GWS player yesterday according to SuperCoach, and the 5th best according to AFL Fantasy.

He kicked 9 goals.

Everyone knew that Hogan and Thilthorpe were the best players in their respective matches, but not AFL Fantasy.

IMO possessions are not the same - IMO Fantasy and Supercoach should recognise that a possession is far harder to win forward of the centre square than behind it.

 

[PhatBoy]

Happened again yesterday. Despite kicking 4 goals Jesse Hogan was seen as GWS's 9th best player on the field, losing to Bedford who only got 13 disposals and 0 goals but also got 13 tackles in the game which means 13 tackles are worth more than 4 goals.

Or Amiss, who also got 4 goals but was somehow rated as Fremantle's 15th best player of the match.

Funnily enough the first post I saw on twitter this morning was a retweet of Barrett or someone making a statement along the lines of ‘you could argue that Darcy is the best player in the AFL.’

All the responses were ‘ever heard of Thilthorpe?’

My first thought was ‘there’s a guy from GWS who won the Coleman by 11 goals last year and so far in two games this season he’s kicked 4 against Hawthorn and then without breaking a sweat he kicked 9 against the Eagles and dished off his tenth to an unmarked teammate in the goal square.’

 

[Vikingnz]

View attachment 2275856

Apparently Jesse Hogan was only the 4th best GWS player yesterday according to SuperCoach, and the 5th best according to AFL Fantasy.

He kicked 9 goals.

It's almost like fantasy points aren't totally indicative of the best players or something.

This isn't unique to AFL either by the way.

 

[JHF1870]

It is almost 3am but for some reason this annoys me.

Just looking at a random game, the North/Western Bulldogs game and I saw that Nick Larkey kicked 5.1 in the game, so 31 of Norths 97 points and yet according to Supercoach Larkey was only North Melbourne's 8th best player on the field.

View attachment 2251164

and it gets even worse with AFL Fantasy as according to that Larkey, despite kicking almost 30% of North's points for the match was somehow rated as North's 15th best player.

Now this is not a dig at SuperCoach or AFL Fantasy as such, but more of a observation that the AFL just does not value goals as much as they should.

I would take Larkey's game over Corr's game every day of the week. Yes Corr's stats are pretty good, but he didn't kick 5 goals, Larkey did.

I think we fans, and especially the AFL media overvalue stats that midfielders get, getting huge stats in things like inside 50's, tackles, rebounds, clearances, things that good midfielders get a lot of, and we just don't value actual goals enough, you know, the thing that teams need to actually win games.

I think it is a problem with the Brownlow as well, umpires go for the midfielder who touched the ball 30 times, got 6 clearances and maybe a goal, but they ignore the forward who actually kicked a large amount of their teams score. Sure the big bags don't happen as much as they used to, but when a player kicks 5 goals in a match then that player should be seen as one of the best players on the field, not as the 8th, or the 15th best player, all because Larkey didn't get many inside 50's, tackles, or the other things the media or fantasy football like. What he got was goals, and that is surely more important.

No doubt the umpires won't be giving Larkey any Brownlow votes today either.

Does anyone else agree that the AFL just does not value goals enough?

You know Supercoach is scaled right?

I would take it with a grain of salt.