Going Forward (The Future)

[Bandicoot]

Saying Rohan choked in the Grand Final is very harsh. He performed exactly to the level I expected from him: 5-12 disposals, a goal, occasional impact, unsighted for large periods. That's his average production over every season at AFL level and also at junior level both in the u18 championships and with the Geelong Falcons.

If this is the expectation we should have of Rohan, there is no way he should have been selected at 6. Anyone taken in the top 10 should be expected to provide more than he has.
Every now and again, he will show us what we should be seeing on a weekly basis, but these games are far too few.

 

[SwansFaninUSA]

You and I don't wear the jumpers because we are not professional and gifted athletes being played large amounts of $$$ to run around and play sport for a living. He is.

He had a good year in many respects, but he choked in the granny I'm afraid to say. As far as I could tell from being at the ground he didn't appear injured. He just had a poor game. It happens. Sadly, it's happened twice to him. Let's hope he gets another chance to redeem himself next season and he has a blinder.

For as bad of a run of injuries Rohan has overcome, and for him to still be a strong contributor this season, I have to admire him. Even if he wasn't his best in the granny, I am not sure our boys would have been there without him. Just because someone doesn't appear injured does not mean they are not playing in pain. I just hope he gets further recovered during the offseason, because when he is on his game, he can make everyone else out there with him better.

 

[melbournehammer]

If this is the expectation we should have of Rohan, there is no way he should have been selected at 6. Anyone taken in the top 10 should be expected to provide more than he has.
Every now and again, he will show us what we should be seeing on a weekly basis, but these games are far too few.

I'm not quite sure that either of these statements are inconsistent. Maybe he shouldn't have been picked at 6. He plays cameos as do many outside players who get plonked in the forward line and who do 70 metre chases not unlike a cheetah.

But its not his fault he was selected where he was. and he gets a goal or so a game puts pressure on opposition defences, is a reliable set shot, takes some good marks.

he isnt going to change all that much now.

btw congratulations to the lad on his wedding.

 

[melbournehammer]

You have offered a perfectly logical explanation of how our judgements of players changes with our level of expectation. I am still perplexed that you would see Rohan's game in the GF as on par with your expectation. If this is where Gaz is at after seven years in the swans system I don't see how improvement in his consistency within a game let alone within a season will change enough for him to be regarded as a must keep player.

Because he is not playing in midfield or defence. the switch backwards and across the field kicks you get from defence pad out stats. players always around the ball get more touches.

I really dont know what people expect here. Our inside fifties in the four finals were 187 for 251 against. We averaged 47 inside fifties per game in the finals, and interestingly our best inside fifty count was against the giants where we genuinely got flogged. the ball just doesnt get to our forwards very much other than asking them to halve contests and create another stoppage or kick a fast break goal.

there is a bigger question here about the performances of the team than the 12 possessions 1 goal game of rohans

 

[db swannie]

For as bad of a run of injuries Rohan has overcome, and for him to still be a strong contributor this season, I have to admire him. Even if he wasn't his best in the granny, I am not sure our boys would have been there without him. Just because someone doesn't appear injured does not mean they are not playing in pain. I just hope he gets further recovered during the offseason, because when he is on his game, he can make everyone else out there with him better.

Who said he was playing with pain though? I did forget about the injury against GWS in the first final, so perhaps that was still affecting him, I don't know...

Aside from that, I really hope he fulfils his potential, he has great talent, and he played some excellent footy for us at times throughout 2016.

 

[doona]

Anyone taken in the top 10 should be expected to provide more than he has.

There are tons of players selected in the top 10 of drafts that have shown far less than he has.

 

[Vin Rogue]

Because he is not playing in midfield or defence. the switch backwards and across the field kicks you get from defence pad out stats. players always around the ball get more touches.

I really dont know what people expect here. Our inside fifties in the four finals were 187 for 251 against. We averaged 47 inside fifties per game in the finals, and interestingly our best inside fifty count was against the giants where we genuinely got flogged. the ball just doesnt get to our forwards very much other than asking them to halve contests and create another stoppage or kick a fast break goal.

there is a bigger question here about the performances of the team than the 12 possessions 1 goal game of rohans

The bigger question??? Let me pose some questions. Outcoached perhaps? Game plan? Selectors? Choosing players who at their best give your team their best chance of victory, but with injury or not being match fit could never deliver their best footy? Players whose foot and hand delivery gift the opposition with turnovers? Then hard two way running that burns our midfielders because we can't rotate them often enough with equal quality. Which of these might be the question that we need to address?

 

[miggs]

There are tons of players selected in the top 10 of drafts that have shown far less than he has.

Copied from AFL article. 06,07 and 08 were horrible but note its an old report

http://www.afl.com.au/news/2014-11-25/boom-and-bust?wb48617274=37D53626

SYDNEY SWANS
Top five
Adam Goodes
351 games
Pick 43, 1997
Jude Bolton
325 games
Pick 8, 1998
Michael O'Loughlin
303 games
Pick 40, 1994
Ryan O'Keefe
286 games
Pick 56, 1999
Jarrad McVeigh
244 games
Pick 5, 2002

Bargains
Andrew Dunkley
217 games
Pick 56, 1991
Nick Malceski
176 games
Pick 64, 2002
Ryan O'Keefe
286 games
Pick 56, 1999
Troy Luff
155 games
Pick 74, 1994

Misses
Lewis Johnston
2 games (8 career games)
Pick 12, 2008
Patrick Veszpremi
11 games (23 career games)
Pick 11, 2007
Daniel O'Keefe
0 games
Pick 15, 2006

 

[Donners]

There are tons of players selected in the top 10 of drafts that have shown far less than he has.

And they are considered failures. He may not be at that level, but his output has been disappointing.

Because he is not playing in midfield or defence. the switch backwards and across the field kicks you get from defence pad out stats. players always around the ball get more touches.

I really dont know what people expect here. Our inside fifties in the four finals were 187 for 251 against. We averaged 47 inside fifties per game in the finals, and interestingly our best inside fifty count was against the giants where we genuinely got flogged. the ball just doesnt get to our forwards very much other than asking them to halve contests and create another stoppage or kick a fast break goal.

there is a bigger question here about the performances of the team than the 12 possessions 1 goal game of rohans

He probably stands out more because he is a consistently poor performer in finals. 13 finals for 8 goals and an average of fewer than 10 possessions is not good for any position.

To put that in perspective, Papley kicked more goals in this finals series, in his first season and with our low inside 50 count, than Rohan has kicked more than thrice as many finals across seven years.

 

[Bandicoot]

There are tons of players selected in the top 10 of drafts that have shown far less than he has.

Don't disagree Doona. But the expectation should be higher than that.

 

[Wolftone]

Does anyone know how Dawson and Reid stack up? I mean in terms of size, attributes etc

Reid is taller. Dawson has a much more resilient body shape/type. reid is a gun pack mark whereas Dawson will lead up for the overhead mark. He does it in the packs too but with a lead up to the ball. Reid tends to drift across and take the speckie. Dawson is a far better kick, far more accurate. Reid may be a bit faster I think. He is about 6cm taller than Dawson who is more a third tall than a Key Forward.

 

[Wolftone]

Who said he was playing with pain though? I did forget about the injury against GWS in the first final, so perhaps that was still affecting him, I don't know...

Aside from that, I really hope he fulfils his potential, he has great talent, and he played some excellent footy for us at times throughout 2016.

It is obvious in almost every game he is still in discomfort with his leg. sometimes worse than others. He still has the titanium in there i believe so that can play merry hell.

 

[Vin Rogue]

Copied from AFL article. 06,07 and 08 were horrible but note its an old report

http://www.afl.com.au/news/2014-11-25/boom-and-bust?wb48617274=37D53626

SYDNEY SWANS
Top five
Adam Goodes
351 games
Pick 43, 1997
Jude Bolton
325 games
Pick 8, 1998
Michael O'Loughlin
303 games
Pick 40, 1994
Ryan O'Keefe
286 games
Pick 56, 1999
Jarrad McVeigh
244 games
Pick 5, 2002

Bargains
Andrew Dunkley
217 games
Pick 56, 1991
Nick Malceski
176 games
Pick 64, 2002
Ryan O'Keefe
286 games
Pick 56, 1999
Troy Luff
155 games
Pick 74, 1994

Misses
Lewis Johnston
2 games (8 career games)
Pick 12, 2008
Patrick Veszpremi
11 games (23 career games)
Pick 11, 2007
Daniel O'Keefe
0 games
Pick 15, 2006

In 2006 we drafted Jessie White at pick 79. Soft expectations...probably performed better than the pick. The gem was Nick Smith picked at 15 as a rookie. Used our early draft picks in trades.
In 2007 we drafted Veszpremi at 11, Brett Meredith at 26 and Craig Bird at 59. The only real fail was our first pick?
In 2008 we drafted Lewis Johnston at 12, Hannebury at 30 and took Mike Pyke at pick 57 in the rookie draft. The only fail was our first pick.
In 2009 we drafted Rohan at 6, Jetta at 14 and Reid at 38. The fail?
In 2010 we drafted Lamb at 21, Parker at 40 and Alex Johnson at 57. The fail?
In 2011 we drafted Tom Mitchell at 21, Shane Biggs was a rookie pick 13. The fail - nil.
In 2012 we drafted Dean Towers at 22, Harry Marsh at 44, Tim Membrey at 46 and Harry Cummingham at 107. We took in the 2012 rookie draft, Jake Llloyd, Xav Richards, Dane Rampe, Dan Robinson, Brandon Jack and Sam Naismith. Not many fails in 2012 except maybe our first selection.
Can see a pattern of first pick fails with the exception of 2011. They fail because of the weight of expectation.
Our selection yips were remedied in 2013, 2014 and 2015 with Zak Jones, Heeney and Mills. Let's hope 2016 continues the most recent trend of the last three years.

 

[McRobie]

In 2006 we drafted Jessie White at pick 79. Soft expectations...probably performed better than the pick. The gem was Nick Smith picked at 15 as a rookie. Used our early draft picks in trades.
In 2007 we drafted Veszpremi at 11, Brett Meredith at 26 and Craig Bird at 59. The only real fail was our first pick?
In 2008 we drafted Lewis Johnston at 12, Hannebury at 30 and took Mike Pyke at pick 57 in the rookie draft. The only fail was our first pick.
In 2009 we drafted Rohan at 6, Jetta at 14 and Reid at 38. The fail?
In 2010 we drafted Lamb at 21, Parker at 40 and Alex Johnson at 57. The fail?
In 2011 we drafted Tom Mitchell at 21, Shane Biggs was a rookie pick 13. The fail - nil.
In 2012 we drafted Dean Towers at 22, Harry Marsh at 44, Tim Membrey at 46 and Harry Cummingham at 107. We took in the 2012 rookie draft, Jake Llloyd, Xav Richards, Dane Rampe, Dan Robinson, Brandon Jack and Sam Naismith. Not many fails in 2012 except maybe our first selection.
Can see a pattern of first pick fails with the exception of 2011. They fail because of the weight of expectation.
Our selection yips were remedied in 2013, 2014 and 2015 with Zak Jones, Heeney and Mills. Let's hope 2016 continues the most recent trend of the last three years.

Meredith and lamb big fat failures.


On iPhone using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[Vin Rogue]

Reid is taller. Dawson has a much more resilient body shape/type. reid is a gun pack mark whereas Dawson will lead up for the overhead mark. He does it in the packs too but with a lead up to the ball. Reid tends to drift across and take the speckie. Dawson is a far better kick, far more accurate. Reid may be a bit faster I think. He is about 6cm taller than Dawson who is more a third tall than a Key Forward.

Tailor made for XR's spot. I'd love for Reid to become a tall midfielder. Could be very hard for other teams to match him up if he could give us ten minutes each quarter.

 

[doona]

Don't disagree Doona. But the expectation should be higher than that.

I think the expectation/excitement is there when they get drafted. That they have a better chance of an AFL career. A better chance of becoming a star.

Now, after 7 years, who cares where he was drafted. He is what he is.

I just want him to find consistency and not get lost in games.

On Nexus 6P using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[GoTheSwannies]

If this is the expectation we should have of Rohan, there is no way he should have been selected at 6. Anyone taken in the top 10 should be expected to provide more than he has.
Every now and again, he will show us what we should be seeing on a weekly basis, but these games are far too few.

I'm hoping 2017 will be his breakout year. If he doesn't put it all together there are serious doubts about him. Seems like a player with very low footy iq.

 

[SwansFaninUSA]

Who said he was playing with pain though? I did forget about the injury against GWS in the first final, so perhaps that was still affecting him, I don't know...

Aside from that, I really hope he fulfils his potential, he has great talent, and he played some excellent footy for us at times throughout 2016.

He struggled with injury last season. And his body language and facial expressions at different times this season just seemed like a man dealing with some pain. Not enough to pull him out or slow him down, but enough to be nagging now and again. That was just my impression of watching him. I could be wrong, but believe I am right. But it makes more sense than to blame his heart or focus like some have seemed to question.

 

[Wolftone]

In 2006 we drafted Jessie White at pick 79. Soft expectations...probably performed better than the pick. The gem was Nick Smith picked at 15 as a rookie. Used our early draft picks in trades.
In 2007 we drafted Veszpremi at 11, Brett Meredith at 26 and Craig Bird at 59. The only real fail was our first pick?
In 2008 we drafted Lewis Johnston at 12, Hannebury at 30 and took Mike Pyke at pick 57 in the rookie draft. The only fail was our first pick.
In 2009 we drafted Rohan at 6, Jetta at 14 and Reid at 38. The fail?
In 2010 we drafted Lamb at 21, Parker at 40 and Alex Johnson at 57. The fail?
In 2011 we drafted Tom Mitchell at 21, Shane Biggs was a rookie pick 13. The fail - nil.
In 2012 we drafted Dean Towers at 22, Harry Marsh at 44, Tim Membrey at 46 and Harry Cummingham at 107. We took in the 2012 rookie draft, Jake Llloyd, Xav Richards, Dane Rampe, Dan Robinson, Brandon Jack and Sam Naismith. Not many fails in 2012 except maybe our first selection.
Can see a pattern of first pick fails with the exception of 2011. They fail because of the weight of expectation.
Our selection yips were remedied in 2013, 2014 and 2015 with Zak Jones, Heeney and Mills. Let's hope 2016 continues the most recent trend of the last three years.

Sorry but 2012 is not a fail as Towers is still on the list and looks like playing 50 games.

Lamb was a fail he is hopeless and now de-listed by his third club.

You must have a short memory as Meredith was also a fail at 26.

There are 10 players from all drafts/trades playing from 2012 and that is extraordinary.

From 2011 there is only one player lest, Harry Cunningham, the first round pick was a F/S pick and successful, so successful he ****ed off to Hawthorn.

2007 would go down as a terribly year as only one player from all drafts/trades turned out ok, Craig Bird.