Gold Coast Suns vs Geelong - 6:40 PM AEST - AFL Marsh Series Rd 1, 2020

owen87

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Apr 23, 2016
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WC won the premiership the year before without Naitanui, Gaff and Shepard despite being 5 goals down in front of a hostile crowd. Geelong were in a winning position at half time with a 21 point lead that should've probably been greater, putting those 3 players in the side doesn't change the fact that the entire team rolled over after half time allowing a 40 point turn around when they had the tigers on the ropes. 2 goals after half time in a prelim final shows a lack of a resolve and desire throughout the entire team, a couple of personnel changes doesn't fix that.
Weird comment.
 

owen87

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Very insightful response, well done. Geelong weren't premiers because they lacked the desire to go all the way, can't blame it on missing a couple of players when you are in a very strong position to win a game and fall apart.
Not really. Richmond came out with increased intensity and Geelong lacked the ability to stop them. Adding Duncan as an experienced mid with generally good ball use, and Hawkins as a mature marking target may very well have been enough to keep them from getting run over.

You also neglect that Richmond had fresher bodies after an extra week off, and completely demolished both Brisbane and GWS in the same finals series.

That West Coast was able to win despite their outs has exactly 0 relevance to what Geelong was able (or not able in this case) to do with their outs.

Alternatively every team who ever loses just lacks the desire and it’s definitely no other factors 🙄
 

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Tiger71

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Not really. Richmond came out with increased intensity and Geelong lacked the ability to stop them. Adding Duncan as an experienced mid with generally good ball use, and Hawkins as a mature marking target may very well have been enough to keep them from getting run over.

You also neglect that Richmond had fresher bodies after an extra week off, and completely demolished both Brisbane and GWS in the same finals series.

That West Coast was able to win despite their outs has exactly 0 relevance to what Geelong was able (or not able in this case) to do with their outs.

Alternatively every team who ever loses just lacks the desire and it’s definitely no other factors 🙄
Um, you realise during that game we had Dusty play 2 quarters hurt, Graham dislocated a shoulder, and broad was out of the game after half time after being knocked out?

Oh we also did not have Rance play either........oh Duncan and Hawkins out had greater effect lol
 

PhatBoy

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WC won the premiership the year before without Naitanui, Gaff and Shepard despite being 5 goals down in front of a hostile crowd. Geelong were in a winning position at half time with a 21 point lead that should've probably been greater, putting those 3 players in the side doesn't change the fact that the entire team rolled over after half time allowing a 40 point turn around when they had the tigers on the ropes. 2 goals after half time in a prelim final shows a lack of a resolve and desire throughout the entire team, a couple of personnel changes doesn't fix that.
With respect for the amazing job west coast did the year before, that doesn’t mean we wouldn’t have won with Hawkins and Duncan in the side.

What happened happened, we can’t change it, but to actually get to that lead in the first place shows we were doing something right and having our 3rd best mid and our most important structural player back in the side could have made all the difference.
 

PhatBoy

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Um, you realise during that game we had Dusty play 2 quarters hurt, Graham dislocated a shoulder, and broad was out of the game after half time after being knocked out?

Oh we also did not have Rance play either........oh Duncan and Hawkins out had greater effect lol
Rance is pretty irrelevant considering he didn’t play at all.
 

PhatBoy

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Very insightful response, well done. Geelong weren't premiers because they lacked the desire to go all the way, can't blame it on missing a couple of players when you are in a very strong position to win a game and fall apart.
Desire?

You have to be kidding.

Resolve. Yes.

The only people that know if they had the desire is the player themselves.

I’m sorry but you, or I for that matter, are in no place to quantify that.

If desire wins you games, then why does anybody bother picking players with skill
 

owen87

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Um, you realise during that game we had Dusty play 2 quarters hurt, Graham dislocated a shoulder, and broad was out of the game after half time after being knocked out?

Oh we also did not have Rance play either........oh Duncan and Hawkins out had greater effect lol
None of this is relevant though; what Richmond were able to do doesn't mean Geelong suddenly 'lacked desire'. It shows Richmond were a better side, as evidenced by the rest of the finals results where Richmond demolished GWS a week later. Hawkins & Duncan may have been the personnel difference Geelong needed to get over Richmond where all other factors are unchanged.

Some truly illogical arguments going on here.
 

dazbroncos

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Agreed. Lots of trolls wanting to make something of these Mickey Mouse games. Am sure the Suns were focussing on a game plan that can see them win games and the Cats on variations they have not tried before.
This is true - but full credit to Suns players for kicking our arses.
But you are also correct - we had about 5-7 players out of position and with four 0 gamers - and the 0 gamers are picks in the 50's not the picks 1-4 that the GCE regularly trot out.

But again - no excuses - the Suns players did the job and did it well.

GO Catters
 

La Dispute

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Um, you realise during that game we had Dusty play 2 quarters hurt, Graham dislocated a shoulder, and broad was out of the game after half time after being knocked out?

Oh we also did not have Rance play either........oh Duncan and Hawkins out had greater effect lol
Two gun players out has a much bigger effect than Dusty playing a bit sore, Rance out (which showed to have no real impact across the season) and C-graders Broad and Graham not playing for much of the game.
 

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catscollector

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You had 6 months to prepare for being without Rance. We had less than 6 days to prepare for being without both Hawkins and Duncan. Massive difference.
Why didn't it seem to make no difference at all in the first half of the game?

Also, go check our record whenever Hawkins misses. It's surprisingly good.
 

PhatBoy

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Why didn't it seem to make no difference at all in the first half of the game?

Also, go check our record whenever Hawkins misses. It's surprisingly good.

Don’t think you need to be Einstein to work out that covering for two important players for half a game is easier than doing it for an entire match
 

Lolbert

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Um, you realise during that game we had Dusty play 2 quarters hurt, Graham dislocated a shoulder, and broad was out of the game after half time after being knocked out?

Oh we also did not have Rance play either........oh Duncan and Hawkins out had greater effect lol
I believe he was swinging in support of Richmond mate.
 

catscollector

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Don’t think you need to be Einstein to work out that covering for two important players for half a game is easier than doing it for an entire match
I think that's just a good old excuse from your part.
We were playing completely fine without them. In fact, we were not one-dimensional and we had other avenues to goal and causing problems (Kelly for one).
Richmond scored a goal within 50 seconds of the third quarter. Margin is back to 15 points and it's game on.

It looked like the weeks break for Richmond worked in our favor. They were sluggish but a completely different side after an hour of footy. Perhaps Hawkins and Duncan do play, given how pedestrian Duncan often is in September, who is to say we are only 1 goal up at halftime or presumably even behind because of being Hawkins-conscience and one-dimensional?
 

PhatBoy

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I think that's just a good old excuse from your part.
We were playing completely fine without them. In fact, we were not one-dimensional and we had other avenues to goal and causing problems (Kelly for one).
Richmond scored a goal within 50 seconds of the third quarter. Margin is back to 15 points and it's game on.

It looked like the weeks break for Richmond worked in our favor. They were sluggish but a completely different side after an hour of footy. Perhaps Hawkins and Duncan do play, given how pedestrian Duncan often is in September, who is to say we are only 1 goal up at halftime or presumably even behind because of being Hawkins-conscience and one-dimensional?

Where did I say we weren’t fine without them?

if you take good players out of any team, does it become harder to play at a high level for Longer or not?

Of course it does.

Take smith and Warner out of the Aussie team - they still managed an excellent rearguard draw in the UAE, so yes they could still produce good cricket without them but over a longer period its not going to be the norm is it
 

catscollector

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Where did I say we weren’t fine without them?

if you take good players out of any team, does it become harder to play at a high level for Longer or not?

Of course it does.

Take smith and Warner out of the Aussie team - they still managed an excellent rearguard draw in the UAE, so yes they could still produce good cricket without them but over a longer period its not going to be the norm is it
Not in one game it does not.
If Geelong were without Duncan and Hawkins for the entire season. it's likely going to impact the side as we don't have any decent users of the footy in Duncan's case.
One game as of that against Richmond MCG final, it made little to no difference when consider Richmond's out's and injuries during the game.
Geelong were just fortunate they received a highly dubious free kick before the halftime siren which kept our noses ahead. We showed out true selves in the second half. A team that has perennially shit themselves when teams have gained momentum in finals footy ever since 2012.
 

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