Review Good / Bad / Ugly vs West Coast

[maxlilly]

I thought there were, for the first time this year, lots of positives out of the game.
It looked like they were all trying and there was run and handball to move the ball forward.

Hamill excites me with how he is so attacking.
It was good to McAsey up forward
Nice to see McPherson debut and look comfortable at the level.
Jones slowly improving
Smith actually offering some run and carry
Getting games into Ned and McAdam, I would like to see McAdam get the crumbs from the packs instead of flying for the speccy
Doedee looks impressive
ROB around the ground, one of the few playing in the midfield who actually run into defense to help out the backline

I don't think we need anymore proof that Sloane and the Crouchs are not our midfield going forward

 

[RunBurgundy]

I thought there were, for the first time this year, lots of positives out of the game.
It looked like they were all trying and there was run and handball to move the ball forward.

Hamill excites me with how he is so attacking.
It was good to McAsey up forward
Nice to see McPherson debut and look comfortable at the level.
Jones slowly improving
Smith actually offering some run and carry
Getting games into Ned and McAdam, I would like to see McAdam get the crumbs from the packs instead of flying for the speccy
Doedee looks impressive
ROB around the ground, one of the few playing in the midfield who actually run into defense to help out the backline

I don't think we need anymore proof that Sloane and the Crouchs are not our midfield going forward

Agree with you here but I put Jones‘ game into Hamill territory. Is seriously starting to show very good signs of an attacking midfielder.

 

[hugecannon]

better than i thought we would be.

lol at giving a spray to a 19 year old kid in a dysfunctional team for being outplayed by one of the best defenders of this generation.

interesting to see matt crouch only played 67% game time

liked mcpherson and hamill in particular, keays did a job on gaff, mchenry got more and more of the ball, jones started well but faded a bit. probably wouldnt make any unforced changes from this game honestly

M Crouch has pretty heavy bandaging on his shoulder, could this be a part of why he’s trying to play more outside ATM?

Genuinely trying to find a reason for how far he’s fallen over the last year or so.

 

[Mego Red]

Also a goal, but was a quiet day.

10 goals this year and ave 4 tackles a game playing the Murphy role...

I'd take Butler for pick 56 everyday

Yep, agreed. Will be interesting to see if he is still doing it in six weeks time, or if he was going through a purple patch.

 

[Mego Red]

No one is giving him a contract worth that pick as compo.


Except us. He won't leave.


The Crouch bros will end their careers here.



Unfortunately.

Our priority for the next two drafts/trade periods is to build the midfield so these two guys are not our best mids.

So far we have Jones.

Sent from my SM-G965F using Tapatalk

Why wouldn't a club give Brad $650k to $700k?

All you need to do is not re-sign a couple of guys at the end of their career. He'd be excellent for five or six different clubs.

 

[hey shorty]

No one is giving him a contract worth that pick as compo.


Except us. He won't leave.


The Crouch bros will end their careers here.



Unfortunately.

Our priority for the next two drafts/trade periods is to build the midfield so these two guys are not our best mids.

So far we have Jones.

Sent from my SM-G965F using Tapatalk

I reckon one goes, whoever that is I don't particularly care. Also I think you underestimate a clubs ability to turn the form of a player and pay for it.

 

[Deaneus!]

Good:
ROB - he did win around the ground, but he lost the hitouts 24-12, so i guess his notes came true
Smithers - played a good game, much happier with his distribution
The Kids - keep showing glimpses of something special: Hamill looks to be a gun, McHenry, Jones looked very good early (loved that tackle), McPherson didn't look overawed, McAsey looked good.
I liked us changing and running it out of defence, we definitely surprised WCE
Brouch - played well, but it looks like he needs support, another top-line mid, right now - either he leaves at the end of the year, or we buy an A+ so he's not doing it all himself.
Defence was good.

Bad:
It's our senior players looking like they're playing to a different gameplan - our old gameplan that sucked.
Mrouch - needs to reinvent himself
Sloane - needs a rest
The move from mid to forward line, yuck. Very inexperienced.
Not sure what Mackay brought to the game yesterday.

Ugly:
Stengle - why is he better than Murphy again? I didn't see anything.


I'd bet on WCE by 32, we won by 33, so I'm happy.
The kids looked good.
Some tweaks required.
We're last by at least 2 games.
We've had what 5 debutants so far? That's good. There's some more to come too I think.

 

[1970crow]

McAsey was reportedly unhappy that he got picked by Crows. He's still showing it.

was better than any 4 quarter effort dished up by tex this year. Shouldn't have been dropped and will almost certainly be gone end of his original contract.

 

[1970crow]

If he gets caught because he's taking the game on, or there's no options up forward to go to I don't mind that at all.

Our kids must be told to play on instinct, much like Hamill does and today Fish did.

HTB is not a problem as long as the player doesn't allow the ball to get loose and give the oppo a chance to play on. We need more of it, not less. I hope they're not coached to see getting caught when taking the game on as a negative.

 

[CrowBloke]

We're still too bad to capitalise on dominant periods in the game but at least there's signs of life. We're playing a lot of young/inexperienced players and some of them are showing a lot. Just have to persist and try to be as competitive as you can whilst developing these players.

First half yesterday was the first time I saw anything resembling a game plan, even if it was the generic Play-on/run/overlap (ie nothing innovative). Also the first time I saw real enthusiasm to take the game on, and our youth (Jones and Hamill in particular) led that. Looks like it rubbed off on Smithers who showed some real dash.
It wasn't good enough to be ahead at half-time, but it was better than anything they've served up this year.

 

[CrowBloke]

I expect increasing pressure from Victorian teams and those teams that traded away this year’s draft picks like Poort Pear to pressure Gill for a special lottery style draft this year.

That'd be right.
The Crows earn the #1 Draft Pick by being terrible and the AFL opts for a lottery in which we get #10-18 instead .

 

[fortunatecrow]

Good:
ROB - he did win around the ground, but he lost the hitouts 24-12, so i guess his notes came true

Yes, he did what he said he would. The clearance work by those he tapped to made his tap-work look worse than it really was. Around the ground he was excellent & I think we will see him a kick behind play more often.

Lots of positives. McPherson played with composure - hell, we need that in the backline. McAdam, Jones, McAsey all showed more and their confidence must be growing. Doedee is shaking off the rust & Hamill is looking very very good. Just for moving around, shifting the defence, and crashing some packs Frampton added something we haven't seen this year. Stengle was disappointing but I just hope he has a three game block regardless.

 

[hey shorty]

HTB is not a problem as long as the player doesn't allow the ball to get loose and give the oppo a chance to play on. We need more of it, not less. I hope they're not coached to see getting caught when taking the game on as a negative.

Judging by Nicksys presser he's encouraging it, which is good.

 

[Geoffa32]

Why wouldn't a club give Brad $650k to $700k?

All you need to do is not re-sign a couple of guys at the end of their career. He'd be excellent for five or six different clubs.

That kind of money is end if first round pick.

It is what Brisbane got for Rockliff.

North of $800k plus/minus contract length gets us the pick after our first.


We are the only club who will offer a $800k four year deal.

Sent from my SM-G965F using Tapatalk

 

[hey shorty]

That kind if money is end if first round pick.

It is what Brisbane got for Rockliff.

North of $800k plus/minus contract length gets us the pick after our first.

Sent from my SM-G965F using Tapatalk

Well that depends on if the AFL rejig the compo structure after COVID.

I still think someone will pay him that, but I think at this stage of his career and after the year we've had he'll want to go to a good team if he goes at all.

 

[CrowBloke]

... we are years away from relevancy at the moment and relying solely upon a #1 pick won’t turn anything around.

I think #1 and another early first-round pick two years in a row (likely for 2020/21) will help a great deal to turn things around, at least on the field eg Jones and Hamill will be very good and are all ready starting to influence games.
I'm thinking players like Rozee, Rankine, Lukosius.

But you're deadset right about "relying solely" --- BIG changes are needed in Admin and if the Club believes that Nicks is the man, they have to get him better Coaching Staff.

 

[Geoffa32]

Well that depends on if the AFL rejig the compo structure after COVID.

I still think someone will pay him that, but I think at this stage of his career and after the year we've had he'll want to go to a good team if he goes at all.

Once the draft lottery comes in we will have pick 10 anyway.

Sent from my SM-G965F using Tapatalk

 

[CrowBloke]

Hamill's was more flashy, but it was a good bit of class from both.

True, but my point was that flashy side-steps, spins or evasions are only useful if they then deliver the ball effectively.
eg I've gone right off Matt Crouch, who's no use to us if he gets plenty of the ball but butchers it.
Having said that, Hamill will no doubt improve that facet of his game. How/when will Mrouch, if not by now?

 

[hey shorty]

Once the draft lottery comes in we will have pick 10 anyway.

Sent from my SM-G965F using Tapatalk

That'll be next year

 

[WaynesWorld19]

I would be delighted if both Crouches left the club. At an absolute pinch keep Brad for a year. Matt drives me insane with slow decisions and ball use. Then when he decides to kick its down the line and lobby. FMD It stands out so badly now we have no support.

There's a growing chorus on this thought ......look he tried in the first half last week to adjust his game to kicking longer and carrying the ball

But yesterday he was back to his old self, having no impact with his possessions, and mostly putting teammates into trouble

I'd have no hesitation in trading Matt Crouch .......that said I'd keep Brad, but not on a big contract ....which IMO has gone up in smoke now anyway

 

[Kane McGoodwin]

Once the draft lottery comes in we will have pick 10 anyway.

Sent from my SM-G965F using Tapatalk

Huh?

 

[Mr_Moogle]

That'd be right.
The Crows earn the #1 Draft Pick by being terrible and the AFL opts for a lottery in which we get #10-18 instead .

Made this comment to my work mate. There is no way in hell the AFL will ever let Adelaide have pick 1. They will find some way to take it off us.

 

[feenix67]

Overall Center Clearance Work Analysis

Result: Lost center clearances 4-13, absolute demolition job

Real clusterfu** to be honest. We did not win a single clean center clearance for the entire match, just 4 center clearances of any kind total. Two were free kicks, another was won via a mark from a West Coast player that won the ball first, and the other we won the ball only to cough it straight back up.

Nic Nat is a dominant ruckman but I'd say there was only one occasion where he got a beautiful tap directly to his team mate. The rest of the time, the taps were regulation stuff to contests. O'Brien's work was the least concerning aspect.

Worst offenders for letting West Coast win center clearances:

Brad Crouch - on three occasions Brad's lack of defensive work allowed his direct opponent to win the clearance, and on another occasion he fumbled a handball receive. Cost us more clearances than he won.

Matt Crouch - on two occasions Matt applied an egregious lack of defensive pressure, letting his direct opponent win the clearance. Given Matt had one center clearance himself for the entire match (which was a free kick) this is simply not good enough

David Mackay - had absolutely zero impact playing wing the entire match at center stoppages and on two occasions his direct opponent got involved because David was caught ball watching or manning space rather than attacking the contest.

Brodie Smith - on two occasions Brodie misses a disposal opportunity to a free team mate and either makes the wrong decision or gets caught

Ben Keays - generally did a great job negating Gaff noticeably at stoppages but offered nothing offensively, when the ball was tapped to him he either fumbled or conceded free kicks

Reilly O'Brien - his ruck work in the center wasn't nearly as bad as it might have seemed and often he was able to nullify the ruck to an extent that our midfielders had a chance, were they playing with any semblance of form. However on multiple occasions he got badly towelled up

---

Other thoughts:

Sloane was reasonable at stopping his man at the stoppages but made little attempt at actually winning it himself. I think this is why he was moved out of the center work after the first 6 bounces. Didn't seem as interested in hunting the ball as he has in the past, this timid approach is very unlike Sloane and I suspect his continual injuries is impacting his work here.

Our entire tap setup is geared towards working the ball through Brad or Matt, who often get the "prime" stoppage locations and are positioned near O'Brien's usual tap zone. However, both Crouches are actually pretty poor at reading the tap and routinely let their man win the clearance instead through either running out of position/under the ball or lack of defensive work. West Coast paid no respect defensively to either player, whoever was on a Crouch was purely focused on winning the clearance and it worked to perfection. It also seemed like West Coast tried to play through the Crouches as much as possible at stoppage.

Jones is our most dynamic player at stoppages, he actually tries to break free and did so successfully in the first quarter. However with Brad/Matt sucking up a lot of work at the stoppages and being ineffective, Jones didn't get many chances and was often positioned defensive side or away from the main tap zone. West Coast paid far more defensive attention to Jones after he started running around at stoppages, especially in the second half, where at times he was very closely checked.

In my opinion, while Keays is undoubtedly a solid tagger, our use of him is actively harming our center clearance work. Because Keays is unable to do anything offensively or impact the center bounce, we are removing a potential avenue for our own clearances. Yes, we are negating the opposition, but rather than getting a win here we're getting a draw, which hurts when we are badly smashed in the center. A better option here would be a midfielder that can work hard defensively on an opponent but know when to try getting involved as well.

We also aren't utilizing a very attacking structure in general. Our midfielders at the center bounce (aside from the Crouches) are very defensive minded, and often it looked like we had two midfielders purely focused on stopping the opposition. This would be more effective if our primary attacking option had a single defensive bone in his body because it just allowed West Coast to work through that player (usually Brad) and circumvent our tags. Alternatively our attacking clearance player needs to be much smarter and more focused on reading taps and winning the ball.

We need to spend a lot more time on dynamic stoppage drills to get our players moving, to better understand where team mates are for outlets and to get laser focused on positioning while being unpredictable. Jones is very promising in this regard, the Crouches need a re-wire. Some of our players seem clueless as to where the tap is likely to go, and where team mates are for assistance, and where they should be positioned for maximum effectiveness both offensively and defensively. In particular we need to work on lateral vision and involving our wings more, rather than straight down the line stuff. We're poor at spreading too, that needs work and more training.

Smith looks decent on the wing but needs to tidy up his decision making, some of the stuff he attempted was stupid even though his ball winning was very strong. Mackay is useless there, having him on the wing is like playing one down, he literally never impacted the stoppage. That position needs to be given to a young player immediately.

What I'd like to see structure and personnel wise for center bounce:

Jones - Primary attacking midfielder, replacing Brad Crouch (position wise, in the O'Brien hot zone). The most dynamic mid we have and needs to be given license.

Brad Crouch - secondary attacking midfielder, replacing Jones. Needs to focus on defensive work and bringing others into the game, can do so from a secondary role.

Sloane - defensive midfielder, either tagging if necessary or playing defense first (replacing Keays). Still given a license to attack and work off his man. If he's not up for the fight he should be rested for Poholke who slots into this exact role.

Smith - primary wing, needs to continue running through stoppages for an option but tidy up his decision making

???? - secondary wing, but not Matt or Mackay who are both ineffective. I also think Sloane is too slow for this role, should be a quicker player (maybe Hamill/Sholl) or a nuggety defensive pressure beast (McHenry). I see a spot for Milera here on return

We'd also need additional second rotation players, this is where Keays would get involved, McHenry, Poholke if he plays, etc. It'd also be great if that secondary wing could rotate inside at times

Matt Crouch dropped from the side entirely

Outstanding mate. Aside from the fantastic analysis, the use of the word egrerious was the absolute highlight

 

[WheresGroomgone]

This is where we probably disagree on the value of a ruck tap. I've always been off the opinion that unless you are Nic Nat or Grundy, ruck taps have very little value. To me a ruck contest is similar to throwing an odd shaped ball up and letting it fall onto a raised octagon. On most occasions where there isn't a completely dominant player, the ball will fall by chance and it is up to your midfielders' nous individually and as a collective unit to then win the battle.

If ROB can be better at it or at least be less likely to be dominated by the big guns, then that's great. I think there are more important facets though such as providing a marking contest out of defence or taking marks in defence.

I think you have made a really good point - elite ruckman are incredibly valuable - unfortunately we have not had one since the 90's, we are happy to just compete the ruck contest and hope all goes well, this is passable if you then have elite midfielders who can read and react - again we don't have them. ROB is serviceable at best in ruck contests the Crouch's are slower than my mum - therefore we are at a disadvantage already and playing catch up. We were absolutely destroyed in clearances and couldn't make up the difference.

ROB as a lumbering giant is quite good around the ground but he's not damaging, he takes some grabs but simply pops up a kick or a handball he won't win games for us at the moment. We have stat accumulators in ROB with his marks, Crouches and Laird that don't "damage" teams.

 

[Kane McGoodwin]

Made this comment to my work mate. There is no way in hell the AFL will ever let Adelaide have pick 1. They will find some way to take it off us.

If the Crows finish stone motherless last, there will be a public outcry if the AFL strip the #1 pick for a lottery.

Won't happen.