Review Good/Bad vs Hawthorn - Rd 19

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Godallblighty

Premiership Player
May 17, 2010
3,562
5,978
Hanging Rock
AFL Club
Adelaide
Parnell is obviously the least physically developed player on our list. Cook had a shoulder injury in the pre-season and couldn't get into the weights room until later, Gollant was starting from way back because he was so skinny. Rowe had two years in the SANFL where, to his credit, he was busting his gut to make it on to an AFL list. I think he'll come out of next years program more or less the same player he is right now, with slightly more endurance certainly, but if you want to hold out hope that he'll be transformed into a faster player, I think you're going to end up disappointed.
I think I've been pretty clear that my expectations of him are quite measured. My initial response was to the idea that genetics are the be-all-and-end-all and that there was nothing he could do to get quicker. He can at least a bit, and being fitter and stronger might compensate for a lack of pace also. Whether he's good enough is absolutely in question but there's been any number of slow players have AFL careers.

Oh, and I said team, not list.
 

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BRL121

Norm Smith Medallist
Jun 21, 2014
5,773
6,273
AFL Club
Adelaide
These stats don't make sense Dermie kept telling me how great Grainger-Barras was.
And if Sholl didn't go way negative in the first, what the hell do you have to do for that honour? ;)

I agree on the rankings: only some of them are in agreement with the eye test.
 

Mr_Moogle

Brownlow Medallist
May 29, 2011
18,044
27,200
SA
AFL Club
Adelaide
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Sturt
Laird just had one of those games where he was on fire. That second goal he kicked, he had no time at all to aim for the goals, just went on pure instinct and it went in.
 

1970crow

Hall of Famer
Jun 7, 2011
44,197
45,129
Mount Gambier
AFL Club
Adelaide
Bad for our draft position - games against teams around the same spot as us are the ones we really should be losing. But from a short term, instant gratification point of view it was nice to get a win after a few shockers.

Jones, McPherson, Schoenberg, possibly McHenry had their best games to date. Fog great start then faded, as he tends to do. Probably the game we've seen from Frampton, too, although that's a low bar to get over and I doubt he has a long term future, but he at least looked better down back than he has up forward. It may also be that our entire team looks better when we have two genuine talls down there (ie Butts and Murray / Frampton), rather than just Butts and trying to play Doedee as a KPD which has usually let to ordinary results.

Speaking of Doedee, thought he was excellent, too. And similar to above, he looks a vastly better player when we have 2 proper tall defenders to free him up to not have to play on the big gorillas.

On the downside - what the hell is going on with Berry? Hardly sighted him. He seems to have been parked in some deep, dark corner of our forward line where nobody ever goes. Like Milton in Office Space when he got shifted down to the basement. If we're not careful, Berry will set fire to the building. Surely he has to be playing in the midfield? He started the year so well but has faded right out of it, not sure if it's fitness preventing him from getting in there and he just needs another preseason or what. There's almost no value playing him at all at the moment, apart from the fact that there's no SANFL while we're in lockdown meaning that there's no other way for him to get a game of footy.
Wouldn't be surprised if Berry is being asked to be the pressure provider in our forward 50. The idiotic role where you never lead up at the ball but rather follow players around waiting to get it so you can try and get to them. His pressure acts are off the charts considering where he's playing and how few times he's winning possession. Not married to it, just a thought based on stats because I can't recall seeing him at all.

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Golumless

A bigger deal out west.
Jul 12, 2013
33,723
41,381
Adelaide
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Adelaide
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Wouldn't be surprised if Berry is being asked to be the pressure provider in our forward 50. The idiotic role where you never lead up at the ball but rather follow players around waiting to get it so you can try and get to them. His pressure acts are off the charts considering where he's playing and how few times he's winning possession. Not married to it, just a thought based on stats because I can't recall seeing him at all.

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It's likely that he's a defensive forward in our set-up, seeing it is playing to a strength of Berrys game. My entire opinion is just "eh, better to get AFL games into him than not". Especially as a first-year player who didn't play in his final junior year.
 

Jarman3

Premiership Player
Oct 22, 2013
3,903
7,693
AFL Club
Adelaide
Wouldn't be surprised if Berry is being asked to be the pressure provider in our forward 50. The idiotic role where you never lead up at the ball but rather follow players around waiting to get it so you can try and get to them. His pressure acts are off the charts considering where he's playing and how few times he's winning possession. Not married to it, just a thought based on stats because I can't recall seeing him at all.
And that's OK as far as generating pressure goes, but surely his future is as a midfielder, not a pressure forward. I understand that he'd have to spend a bit of time up there, he can't speed 100% game time in the middle especially in his first season etc etc etc. But he had 3 possessions in a rare game where we came up against a team as bad as our own, and thus were able to win our share of ball in the middle for a change. Surely that would be the perfect opportunity to get some of these young guys running through the middle a bit more. I certainly think we saw more of Schoenberg than we have in previous weeks, but I don't recall seeing Berry there at all, and the 3 possessions suggests to me that's because he never got in there.

I know right now the goal is to get games into kids, but there's more to that than just being able to increment the number in their "career games played" stat. I have to question how much he's actually learning and developing from that pressure forward role if that is actually what they're doing with him.
 

FR0GGY

Press the button
Oct 9, 2004
49,811
64,406
Adelaide
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Adelaide
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Wouldn't be surprised if Berry is being asked to be the pressure provider in our forward 50. The idiotic role where you never lead up at the ball but rather follow players around waiting to get it so you can try and get to them. His pressure acts are off the charts considering where he's playing and how few times he's winning possession. Not married to it, just a thought based on stats because I can't recall seeing him at all.

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McHenry surprising
 

Jeffcrowe

Brownlow Medallist
Sep 28, 2014
14,776
17,753
AFL Club
Adelaide
Dare I say it's a very Adelaide like split, where it's too much left to too few defensively. Mitchell and O'Meara did a lot of work, with both being >=8 tackles, and >= 27 PA, and Worpel/Cousins/Wingard/Howe also contributed with a >=4 tackle and >= 14 PA game. That said players who probably should be contributing like Bramble, Phillips, McEvoy, Shiel weren't impacting defensively, with all <= 3 tackles, 10 PA. Certainly, there was a contingent of Hawks keen on bruise-free footy.

Compared to Adelaide where it's a lot more even all-round, with 11 players (Schoenberg, Sloane, Laird, Berry, Hamill, Keays, Seedsman, O'Brien, Sholl, Kelly, Smith) over 15 PA. Though of course, the tackle numbers aren't as consistent with Adelaide, with two of them in O'Brien and Kelly not troubling the scorers in that regard, and Sholl, Smith and Seedsman only registering <= 2 tackles. Adelaide doesn't have that drop off either, with only defenders being below that 10 PA mark.*



*and yes, that does mean Fogarty was a monster on the defensive side of things. Well for a key forward, anyway, with a 2 tackle, 12 PA game. Which makes me very happy.
Agree re Fog and it looked like that to the eye , he pressure and harassed and stayed in the game , I’ve been a critic but I can see a career now

and to anyone who doesn’t rate pressure act stats , well I don’t know what to say .Doesn’t tell the whole story but it’s very important to successful teams
 

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1970crow

Hall of Famer
Jun 7, 2011
44,197
45,129
Mount Gambier
AFL Club
Adelaide
Agree re Fog and it looked like that to the eye , he pressure and harassed and stayed in the game , I’ve been a critic but I can see a career now

and to anyone who doesn’t rate pressure act stats , well I don’t know what to say .Doesn’t tell the whole story but it’s very important to successful teams
Spread out across the 22 pressure acts do show intent, but my issue remains that they can throw up individual anomalies. Like Berry, who I think you want sent to the 2s racking up midfield level PAs to go with 3 disposals. So 1 touch per 7 pressure acts. But if you go by pressure acts alone, that's an untouchable game.
 

Scorpus

Match Fit
Apr 16, 2014
45,916
112,950
AFL Club
Adelaide
Wouldn't be surprised if Berry is being asked to be the pressure provider in our forward 50. The idiotic role where you never lead up at the ball but rather follow players around waiting to get it so you can try and get to them. His pressure acts are off the charts considering where he's playing and how few times he's winning possession. Not married to it, just a thought based on stats because I can't recall seeing him at all.

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I'm not convinced that the pure pressure, zero goals small forward is a role that any club should have
 

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