Review Good vs GWS

[jackster83]

We can't truly move from the grand final, camp, Burton, etc until all of Roo, Chapman and Fagan are gone.

 

[CrowBloke]

I applied your logic to Burton, just removed the Board Member bit:

But if [Burton] has learned from his mistakes and we can't get a better person what's the point in getting rid of him. Punishing [Burton] is stupid if it doesn't get us anywhere. We need passionate crows people and that includes ex players...so banishing [Burton] from the club as a punishment for daring to make it better but getting it wrong will only serve as a deterrent for others. It won't attract people to the club.

Burton learned from his mistakes. Burton was a passionate Crows person and ex-player.
I'm sure you'd agree, Burton had to go to be held responsible for what he stuffed up. Why not Roo? Roo's undisciplined, secrecy-breaking comments on radio about Lever/Greenwood and others who left the Club should be reason enough. He was a terrific (1998 Flag) player, Captain, BnF and Brownlow winner, a Club hero --- I loved the player --- but he should step down.

I'd ask again, has Roo done more good than harm in his Board role, paid or not? I don't think he has, heart-in-the-right-place or not.

 

[BACCS]

It has been a very long time, perhaps its never happened, since I have seen a Crows side play with the pressure that we have in the past 3 weeks. It hasnt always been pretty but its been rather effective.

Jones - As I mentioned in his thread, he had a 'nearly' game. Ran to the right spots, put pressure on his opponents and took a great contested grab. Just didnt have the polish required.

Brad - The last 2 weeks have shown that we really cant lose in the Crouch situation. If he stays and plays like this we win, if he leaves and these performances drive up his price we win. Another really good game

Murphy - As usual, if he finishes his work it probably ends up a big game..... but he didnt and he keeps himself on the edge.

Matt - Fantastic again, playing like the leader he is meant to be.

Kelly - Not awful, but still not very good.

Sloane - Kicked a goal right when we were being challenged in the 3rd, and once again pushed the ball forward however he could.

Talia - Seems more proactive this year, I wonder if the rest we gave him has anything to do with it.

Tex - Yeah not a great night from the big fella but he still did a couple of nice things.

Mackay - Customary shank at goal aside, yet another pretty good night out for DMac.

Hartigan - Not as good as the last couple but he didnt do a whole heap wrong.

Brown - See above.

Stengle - Another solid night for the Wombat, just looks so creative and composed with ball in hand, and marks the ball in the hands very well

McAdam - Just keeps getting better and better

Schoenberg - Much like Jones, had a 'nearly' night. Still kept hunting the ball which was good to see.

Keays - Close to the recruit of the season IMO, considering where he came from.

Laird - Midfield maestro, why has it taken so long ??

Fogarty - Presented well, pressured the ball carrier as good as I have seen in, just didnt finish his work.

Smith - Another solid game off half back, will go close on MB Medal night

Himmelberg - Well, well, well - I am very sorry Big Easy, youre finally doing what we all hoped you would but feared you wouldnt.

McPherson - Didnt put a foot wrong again, has a wise head on young shoulders.

ROB - Flukey snap that shouldve been stopped aside, ROB showed everyone just exactly why hes the No1 man. Absolutely dominated Sauce around the ground and in the middle. FWIW I didnt like the smattering of boo's Sauce got either.

Just watching the replay, Jones had a couple of really nice inside 50 entries, especially a lace out 45 metre pass to McAdam at the start of the 4th quarter on his left foot.

 

[CrowBloke]

Why Hart? Again things seem to be improving.

I'm genuinely surprised you're asking this. Our forward structure/movement has been dismal for the last 2 years, for which Hart is responsible as Forwards' Coach 2018-onwards. In one year under Hart, we went from the highest-scoring side to mediocrity.

Even during the last 2 wins, forward structure and movement (especially leading --- Hart was a solid backman --- what would he know about the nuances and timing of leading as a forward?) have been messy. Hart defended forwards; didn't play as one. It makes as much sense as getting Modra to be defensive Coach.
The improvement has come from the mids lifting, getting their hands on the ball and providing supply + McAdam and Himmelberg are starting to mark the ball. Kudos to Hart IF he has been their marking Coach, only.

 

[adelaidecrows]

I applied your logic to Burton, just removed the Board Member bit:

Burton learned from his mistakes. Burton was a passionate Crows person and ex-player.
I'm sure you'd agree, Burton had to go to be held responsible for what he stuffed up. Why not Roo? Roo's undisciplined, secrecy-breaking comments on radio about Lever/Greenwood and others who left the Club should be reason enough. He was a terrific (1998 Flag) player, Captain, BnF and Brownlow winner, a Club hero --- I loved the player --- but he should step down.

I'd ask again, has Roo done more good than harm in his Board role, paid or not? I don't think he has, heart-in-the-right-place or not.

There is a stark difference to employing someone to do a role and that person doing the job and completely ballsing it up. Of so you may as well fire every hr department for every poor hire.

Anyways it's clear we agree to disagree.

However it's funny. We cry out for change but we complain about how it happens when we get it and even though it's for greater good and the positives are everywhere some just demand too much. We could win a premiership in 5 years and Roo would be to blame for not winning the year before by some. Get over yourselves and look at the positives.

I guess some just loved the same old win 12 games a year and do nothing in finals approach or club had for two decades.

On VOG-L09 using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[Golumless]

There is a stark difference to employing someone to do a role and that person doing the job and completely ballsing it up. Of so you may as well fire every hr department for every poor hire.

Anyways it's clear we agree to disagree.

However it's funny. We cry out for change but we complain about how it happens when we get it and even though it's for greater good and the positives are everywhere some just demand too much. We could win a premiership in 5 years and Roo would be to blame for not winning the year before by some. Get over yourselves and look at the positives.

I guess some just loved the same old win 12 games a year and do nothing in finals approach or club had for two decades.

On VOG-L09 using BigFooty.com mobile app

To the bolded bit - oh Roo certainly fixed that.

This is the weirdest hill I've seen someone willing to die on today. There is no "greater good" to keeping Roo. Much like (to use an example elsewhere in the league) there was no "greater good" for Essendon to keep Hird after the drugs scandal. Both have done different acts to get there, but the end result has been the same, no matter how much they loved the club, they're decision making has forced a hard reset, turned the club into a laughing stock and burnt a generation of footballers.

Whilst there have been some positives this season, it does not absolve what has occurred. If you want a true positive to come from this season, removing the useless board member/director of football who got us into this mess would certainly be a big tick.

 

[CrowBloke]

1) It's no wonder ex players don't feel welcome at the club.
2) We need to start trusting in their appointments

1) McLeod not feeling welcome is an entirely separate issue. Irrelevant to our discussion on Roo, who behaves like he is the Club. He's not, and just does not 'get' that.
2) The problem is not trusting in their appointments --- all appointments are made on trust --- but retaining them after they have proved to be incompetent in their position/role.
Please read this, with which I agree:

See, if the mistake was small, I'd agree. Write it off. That said, this hasn't been a small mistake. This mistake cost us a window and pissed away 8 years building a squad to compete at the top end. That is not a mistake you can come back from, nor should you be given the opportunity at the place you are at. It doesn't matter if he's a passionate crows person, or (eww) an ex-crows player. We simply cannot afford to risk him destroying another tilt and there is no doubt Roo will destroy another tilt.
There is no point that hiring Brett Burton was daring to make it better. It was obvious in 2016 it was a shithouse move, it remained obvious in 2020. After all he badly failed in a lesser role at Brisbane. It was nothing more than incompetence.

Nothing less than incompetence.

 

[CrowBloke]

Anyways it's clear we agree to disagree.
However it's funny. We cry out for change but we complain about how it happens when we get it

Yes, we can agree to disagree, no problem .

I'm not alone when I say that the "review" last year which got rid of Burton and Campo has not gone far enough, ie not enough changes. I support this position:

We can't truly move from the grand final, camp, Burton, etc until all of Roo, Chapman and Fagan are gone.

.

 

[Golumless]

Why Hart? Again things seem to be improving.

This is what I don't get about Adelaides supporter culture. There is this image that all ex players are bad and they must go because they only got the job because of their mates. It's no wonder ex players don't feel welcome at the club. We need to start trusting in their appointments

On VOG-L09 using BigFooty.com mobile app

Those ex-AFC can do no wrong in your eyes? Doesn't matter if they are a yes man who has built a record of being a terrible coach (and the forward line has been hot garbage this year), or a GM who got hoodwinked by some cowboys and put all of our eggs in that basket, or the director of football who hires his mate even though he failed in a lesser role at a side who were one of the worst teams in this league.

There are ways to make ex-players feel welcome without blindly supporting the ones who are frankly useless in the role they're in. Not only that, but the club (you know, who employed all those people who get complained about) made those players feel unwelcome, not the supporters.

 

[CrowBloke]

This was bloody funny :

This is the weirdest hill I've seen someone willing to die on today.

His comments on Hart are equally strange.

 

[MRB37]

This was one part of the game that really impressed me in terms of a midfield passage of play. Schoenberg just does a little stutter step on Coniglio when the ball is about to hit the ruckman, which sends Cogs out of the contest thinking Schoenberg is going around for just a second and gives him the space to get through that huge hole that's developed between the other mids. De Boer sits off the contest because he's more concerned with Laird helps as well. Doesn't get all the way through, but enough time and space to grab the ball and hit a target inside 50.
View attachment 2020-09-12 12-01-59.mp4

 

[arrowman]

We are not committing 3 or 4 numbers to the 1m around the ball any more. We have options out the side and the back which we hadnt had all year.

So much this. Every time we have played well - come good after poor performances - over the last couple of years, that has been the common factor, to my eyes anyway. Needs to be every week.

 

[Kane McGoodwin]

So that is now consider ROB's "floor" game now by Nicks and the opposition coach....expectation are growing.

He was only playing against Sauce who we already knew is cooked...

 

[Kane McGoodwin]

Keays has only one real weakness in his game he has no right foot and will always try to run around a player to get on his left when the right play is to go direct by the right boot, don't think I've ever seen him use his right foot. But he has so many positives to his game that's really a minor criticism.

Has used his right foot a few times I can recall when under pressure & can't use his left... but agree he prefers not to.

 

[DangerSloane]

So much this. Every time we have played well - come good after poor performances - over the last couple of years, that has been the common factor, to my eyes anyway. Needs to be every week.

It stems from having a number of 'see ball get ball' players (as much as i hate that saying).
It seems now theyre thinking more about numbers... do i need to commit or not?

 

[arrowman]

It stems from having a number of 'see ball get ball' players (as much as i hate that saying).
It seems now theyre thinking more about numbers... do i need to commit or not?

Post needs to be in the Good vs Carlton thread. Because it happened again

 

[StonesThrow]

This was one part of the game that really impressed me in terms of a midfield passage of play. Schoenberg just does a little stutter step on Coniglio when the ball is about to hit the ruckman, which sends Cogs out of the contest thinking Schoenberg is going around for just a second and gives him the space to get through that huge hole that's developed between the other mids. De Boer sits off the contest because he's more concerned with Laird helps as well. Doesn't get all the way through, but enough time and space to grab the ball and hit a target inside 50.
View attachment 959486

Good pick up. This shows that opposition are at least thining about his run through the ruck contests. Coniglio getting spooked by a 5 gamer is pretty weird though. If he was actually to run on that path, Himm would have had to belt the ball 30 meters for Shoe to get a look in.

Voice of Sam Mitchell: What don't I like about this play Stephen?