Rumour Goodwin under close scrutiny

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00Stinger

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Slightly off topic but the above is a good argument for an AFL funded doctor at each club. It's hard to believe that concussion protocols are all that we're assured they are if club officials are prepared to pressure medical staff like this.
That is a reasonable idea, would defiantly take away a lot of the potential grey area

The thing is that there in no evidence that any of these discussions took place. It is a he said, she said argument at the moment and in this day and age you are guilty until proven innocent rather than the other way around. Goodwin may have said that, but equally he may not have
 

dee64

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I'd expect most to operate with a bit more respect.

The fact that this has come out as a story should indicate that it's not the norm.
I suspect it was on Burgess' advice that Dr Arain was sacked. Dr Arain had 17 players go under the knife after the 2018 season when we made the prelim. Burgess said that it was ridiculous. Burgess has a philosophy that the human body is more resilient than we give it credit. He believes it's more psychological than physical.

Goodwin clearly respected Burgess more than the Doctor, and wasn't buying the BS the Doctor was feeding him when it comes to resting players. At the end of the day, the buck stops with the coach. He's entitled to question any staff member, including the doctor. And the diatribe of expletives was probably Goodwin reaching the end of his tether with the Doctor.
 

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juss

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Slightly off topic but the above is a good argument for an AFL funded doctor at each club. It's hard to believe that concussion protocols are all that we're assured they are if club officials are prepared to pressure medical staff like this.
I agree.

I have to ask myself, would a Dusty, Petracca, Bontempelli, etc. be ruled out of a Grand Final by the doc if it was line ball?

I'm sure the coaches would be looking for any loophole for their players to play rather than being too worried about medical best practice and protocol.

An AFL funded medical professional isn't a bad idea, even if they are only overseeing that protocols are being adhered to and club doctors are following best practice guidelines.

Very off topic though.
 

ThirtyFive

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I suspect it was on Burgess' advice that Dr Arain was sacked. Dr Arain had 17 players go under the knife after the 2018 season when we made the prelim. Burgess said that it was ridiculous. Burgess has a philosophy that the human body is more resilient than we give it credit. He believes it's more psychological than physical.

Goodwin clearly respected Burgess more than the Doctor, and wasn't buying the BS the Doctor was feeding him when it comes to resting players. At the end of the day, the buck stops with the coach. He's entitled to question any staff member, including the doctor. And the diatribe of expletives was probably Goodwin reaching the end of his tether with the Doctor.
Forgive me if I'm wrong, but, Dr. Arain is a sports doctor, not a surgeon. Specialists make decisions about surgery, not G.P's.
 
Apr 19, 2006
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hahaha if that is bullying then this world is f’ed

View attachment 1324624

Sounds like robust feedback to an employee who isn't meting their deadlines
Did you just step out of time machine? 😂

Maybe it’s the level of business you’re in, but if anyone spoke like that to another employee in my workplace the company would finish them up.
 

ThirtyFive

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Did you just step out of time machine? 😂

Maybe it’s the level of business you’re in, but if anyone spoke like that to another employee in my workplace the company would finish them up.
......and rightly, so. Practicing medicine in a professional sporting club is a bloody hard gig. I've read Dr. Arain's bio and he seems to be quite well credentialed. Certainly, ex Melbourne players who have returned to the State League competition I'm involved in have held him in high regard. You just can't hang a sign on your front porch and call yourself a sports doctor. It's another 4 years of study and exams on top of your initial 7 year degree. He's ethically bound to treat players with their health and wellbeing paramount. I've worked with despot coaches in the past. None of them have had a grasp on medical legal and ethical responsibilities. I feel that it's not just a matter of him being precious. It's a unique employment relationship.
 

00Stinger

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Did you just step out of time machine? 😂

Maybe it’s the level of business you’re in, but if anyone spoke like that to another employee in my workplace the company would finish them up.
lol

I've worked at some very big and well known companies, if you didn't meet important timeframes you would be getting wound up very quickly. So being spoken to like that would probably be the least of your concerns

And lets not pretend that professional sporting clubs are the same as other industries. I mean if broke my nose at work my employers wouldn't be telling me to tape it up and get back on the computer
 
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lol

I've worked at some very big and well known companies, if you didn't meet important timeframes you would be getting wound up very quickly. So being spoken to like that would probably be the least of your concerns

And lets not pretend that professional sporting clubs are the same as other industries. I mean if broke my nose at work my employers wouldn't be telling me to tape it up and get back on the computer
You don’t sound like you’ve got a very good understanding of the corporate world right now, how it’s driving change within society, and the push within both AFL clubs and big business to lead on “culture” in the form of DEI.

It’s not 1995 anymore where you can tell someone a few home truths about how you feel they’re not living up to the job.
 

00Stinger

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You don’t sound like you’ve got a very good understanding of the corporate world right now, how it’s driving change within society, and the push within both AFL clubs and big business to lead on “culture” in the form of DEI.

It’s not 1995 anymore where you can tell someone a few home truths about how you feel they’re not living up to the job.
Well considering I was at school in 1995 I have no idea what the corporate world was at that time

But considering my current position in a large well known company I would say I have a pretty ******* good idea what it is like at a high level. How ruthless these big corporations are and I get a pretty first hand view of what people get moved on for in my position

There is a culture of high performance at where I work now and my previous employer who would even be a bigger company in a different sector.
 

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Apr 19, 2006
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Well considering I was at school in 1995 I have no idea what the corporate world was at that time

But considering my current position in a large well known company I would say I have a pretty ******* good idea what it is like at a high level. How ruthless these big corporations are and I get a pretty first hand view of what people get moved on for in my position

There is a culture of high performance at where I work now and my previous employer who would even be a bigger company in a different sector.
If you honestly work in a business that thinks the sort of comments Goodwin made is just robust feedback it most likely has a high staff turnover.
 

GWT6

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Slightly off topic but the above is a good argument for an AFL funded doctor at each club. It's hard to believe that concussion protocols are all that we're assured they are if club officials are prepared to pressure medical staff like this.
Definitely believe this needs to be implemented, I've been saying it since the Essendon got done as drug cheats. To have a lifelong fan as the doctor was always going to be a problem.

Hypothetical - Say Melbourne had a doctor that had been at the Demons for 30 years, massive fan of the club, had never seen a premiership, and just before 3/4 time in last year's Grand Final Petracca gets a head knock. What does he do?

Need independent doctors who rotate between clubs every couple of years.
 

Demonic Ascent

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X-rated? :tearsofjoy: :tearsofjoy: :tearsofjoy:

Gil;
“I know for a fact your coach is out drinking with players at the Sorrento pub – are you crazy? That doesn’t work,” McLachlan said.

“Hanging out with his players, drinking and betting – just the wrong behaviour. There has to be enough distance. You need to respect him and like him, don’t have to love him, but respect him. You can’t be doing that s**t. You have to make tough decisions. It doesn’t work.”

Well it seems it does work hey Gil! Maybe you don't know what the * you're talking about.
 

Demonic Ascent

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If only it was that easy. Some orthopedic surgeons won't operate on ACL's for a week. Just because you're an AFL player doesn't give you cred to jump the surgical queue for elective surgery.

Pretty sure they're not waiting on a public list mate and would've worked out who was having what prior to finishing up the last game of the season.
 

Demonic Ascent

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Slightly off topic but the above is a good argument for an AFL funded doctor at each club. It's hard to believe that concussion protocols are all that we're assured they are if club officials are prepared to pressure medical staff like this.

Cody Weightman wasn't even tested after hitting his head into the goalpost and ricocheting onto the ground during the first quarter of the GF. And this was 3 weeks after being subbed out with concussion and 2 weeks after missing a game due to concussion.
 

Demonic Ascent

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You don’t sound like you’ve got a very good understanding of the corporate world right now, how it’s driving change within society, and the push within both AFL clubs and big business to lead on “culture” in the form of DEI.

It’s not 1995 anymore where you can tell someone a few home truths about how you feel they’re not living up to the job.

The "corporate world" only cares about perception - if they will be perceived to have tolerated bullying, if they will be perceived to have ignored it and failed to investigate. Actually doing anything about it depends entirely on the standing of the alleged perpetrator and victim.
 

Beerfish

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Cody Weightman wasn't even tested after hitting his head into the goalpost and ricocheting onto the ground during the first quarter of the GF. And this was 3 weeks after being subbed out with concussion and 2 weeks after missing a game due to concussion.
Maybe they just assumed he was diving.
 

leon123

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if you look carefully, I actually said I was writing to their major sponsors, not to the MFC.

What doesn't disgust me? Long lockdowns and social distancing.
I bet you don’t.. and I reckons, your list of disgust..... is really, really, really long.

Try to be more positive, it helps others and I know, it will make u more happy hey.
 

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