Greatest Dynasty of the 21st century - Lions vs Cats vs Hawks vs Tigers

[Rasha]

We have been lucky enough as footy fanatics to have witnessed four dynasties during the 21st century so far.

Which is the greatest dynasty out of the four is up for debate though and an argument can be made for any of the dynasties to be the greatest.

 

[Art Vandelay_]

If we've had 4 great sides already this century then maybe dynasty is too loosely applied and thus dynasty really only should be attributed to Collingwood 1925-30 (6 consecutive GFs and 4 flags), Melbourne 1954-60 (7 GFs and 5 flags) and Hawthorn 1983-91 (8 GFs and 5 flags).

 

[Gralin]

Four dynasties.
Interesting.

 

[Rasha]

Four dynasties.
Interesting.

Yes.
Since the 21st century began.

 

[Gralin]

Yes.
Since the 21st century began.

Two of them were straight up though

 

[wal]

Wow! There are people that aren't selecting the Brisbane option.

 

[Rasha]

Two of them were straight up though

What do you mean straight up?
At the end of the day all four dynasties netted three flags.

Except ours isn't finished, is in the present and we can still net a fourth flag.
While the others are in the history books and are in the past.

 

[Luv_our_club]

I would probably say the Lions had the best team this century, but it is splitting hairs.


And Hawthorn won 4 flags, not 3. I don't get why some people think the 2008 flag is part of another era/generation, and not part of the dynasty.

It was 4 years between the Cat's first flag (2007) and their last (2011).

It was 4 years between the Hawks first grand final 2008 and their second in 2012. It is 5 years between the Hawk's first flag (2008) and second flag (2013). It is just wrong to think that the Hawks built one premiership team in 2008 and then finished top of the ladder in 2012 with a new team/era (and should have won the flag that year if they kicked straight).

A dynasty is an era of success. The 1983 Hawks flag is joined to the 1991 flag.
2008 is joined to 2015, under the same coach and with most of the same future HOF players.

 

[Barry_Badrinath]

Geelong had at least 20 different All Australian's between 2007-2011. They won 55/58 games over one stretch. If they had've won the 2008 Grand Final you could argue that Cats team was the greatest ever. Yet they're the only one that didn't go back to back, and they ended up taking the longest to win their 3 flags.

At the moment the 4 are hard to split, but the difference is Richmond can still add to their legacy. Only 2 teams in history have won 4/5. Richmond has the chance to do that next year.

 

[RJK Tiger]

Wow! There are people that aren't selecting the Brisbane option.

View attachment 998366

Which is shocking why? As good as they were (and they were), their run at the top was 4 years for 3 flags. After the last grand final they fell hard and fasat, finishing 11th.

The Lions "Dynasty" runs as this

Merged with Fitzroy & operated with additional list, draft and salary cap concessions compared to every other opponent

Lions
1997 - finished 8th, Lost Elimination final to St Kilda by 46 points
1998 - 16th, Wooden Spponers.
1999 - 3rd, Lost Prelim to Kangaroo's by 48 points
2000- 6th, lost Semi Final to Carlton by 82 points
2001 - Finished 2nd, won Flag by 26 points
2002 - Finished 2nd, won Flag by 9 points
2003 - Finsihed 3rd, won flag by 50 points
2004 - Finished 2nd, Lost GF by 40points
2005 - Finished 11th
2006 - Finished 13th
2007 - Finished 10th

Geelong
2006 - Finished 10th
2007 - Finished 1st, won flag by 119 points
2008 - Finished 1st, Lost GF by 26 points
2009 - Finished 2nd, won GF by12 points
2010 - Finished 2nd, Lost Prelim by 8 points
2011 - Finished 2nd, won GF by 38 points
2012 - Finished 6th, lost EF by 16 points
2013 - Finished 2nd, Lost PF by 5 points
2014 - Finished 3rd, Lost Semi by 6 points
2015 - Finished 10th

Hawthorn
2006 Finished 11th
2007 - Finished 5th, Lost SF by 33
2008 - Finished 2nd, Won GF by 26
2009 - Finished 9th
2010 - Finished 7th, Lost EF by 33
2011 - Finished 3rd, Lost PF by 3
2012 - Finished 1st, Lost GF by 10
2013 - Finished 1st, Won GF by 15
2014 - Finished 2nd, won GF by 63
2015 - Finished 3rd, won GF by 46
2016 - Finished 3rd, Lost SF by 23
2017 Finished 12th

Richmond
2012 - Finished 12th
2013 - Finished 5th, Lost EF by 20 points
2014 - Finished 8th Lost EF by 57 points
2015 - Finished 5th Lost EF by 17 points
2016 - Finished 13th
2017 - Finished 3rd, Won GF by 48 Points
2018 - Finished 1st, Lost PF by 39 points
2019 - Finished 3rd, Won GF by 89 points
2020 - Finished 3rd, Won GF by 31 points


Looking at these broken down like, Hawthorn holds the cake for longevity, while Richmond are the most clinical.

Hawks - 4 flags over 8 years including a 3peat + 2 minor premierships. Their 3peat follows 2 years where they lost a Prelim by a few points and a Minor Premiership + narrow GF loss by 10 points.

The Lions however had the 3peat but never won a Minor premiership and had the shortest run of anyone at the top. They also got heavily beaten in all the finals they lost & their finals run was crazily broken up with a wooden spoon. This suggest that as good as they were, they didn;t deal with failure well.
Plus, like it or not, they had several list & cap advantages their opponents did not. That has to count for something.


Cats had 3 but could never win a back to back which is vital when judging a dynasty. Their 3 are only divided by a minor premiership + shock GF loss and a narrow bitting prelim loss. Had the potential to possibly win 5, ultimately didn't.

Richmond are right on the Hawks neck though. 3 flags, including a back to back, with the 1st flag only separated by a convincing minor premiership & a shock Prelim loss. Also have the highest avg GF winning margin & only team to not lose a GF.

 

[M Malice]

I'm happy that someone has finally asked this question on Big Footy.

 

[tigers_of_old_08]

I'm happy that someone has finally asked this question on Big Footy.

Yeah but no one’s asked it like this, right?

 

[Power Raid]

better team by far......brisbane, followed by the cats

better outcome based on the quality of the side...........richmond

 

[Gralin]

What do you mean straight up?
At the end of the day all four dynasties netted three flags.

Except ours isn't finished, is in the present and we can still net a fourth flag.
While the others are in the history books and are in the past.

3 in a row is harder than 3 in 4 or 3 in 5

Hawks and Lions both played off in 4 straight grand finals and won 3

Cats played in 3 straight but not 4 and couldn't go back to back

Tigers have played in two straight and gone back to back but couldn't even play in 3 in a row

Never mind the fact that we had the same coach and core in 2008 as we had in 2012-2015

Lions and Hawks so far the only teams that have won three in a row in the AFL era, if you win next year then we can talk

 

[Dr Tigris]

I'll take any one.

Personally I'd have the Lions as the best of the 4.

But if they were just time transported and played off then it'd be the Tigers because modern tactics and fitness are much better. The other teams couldn't score and wouldn't know what hit them.

Give them all one year of modern training etc and I suspect it'd be the Lions.

 

[HairyO]

Which is shocking why? As good as they were (and they were), their run at the top was 4 years for 3 flags. After the last grand final they fell hard and fasat, finishing 11th.

The Lions "Dynasty" runs as this

Merged with Fitzroy & operated with additional list, draft and salary cap concessions compared to every other opponent

Lions
1997 - finished 8th, Lost Elimination final to St Kilda by 46 points
1998 - 16th, Wooden Spponers.
1999 - 3rd, Lost Prelim to Kangaroo's by 48 points
2000- 6th, lost Semi Final to Carlton by 82 points
2001 - Finished 2nd, won Flag by 26 points
2002 - Finished 2nd, won Flag by 9 points
2003 - Finsihed 3rd, won flag by 50 points
2004 - Finished 2nd, Lost GF by 40points
2005 - Finished 11th
2006 - Finished 13th
2007 - Finished 10th

Geelong
2006 - Finished 10th
2007 - Finished 1st, won flag by 119 points
2008 - Finished 1st, Lost GF by 26 points
2009 - Finished 2nd, won GF by12 points
2010 - Finished 2nd, Lost Prelim by 8 points
2011 - Finished 2nd, won GF by 38 points
2012 - Finished 6th, lost EF by 16 points
2013 - Finished 2nd, Lost PF by 5 points
2014 - Finished 3rd, Lost Semi by 6 points
2015 - Finished 10th

Hawthorn
2006 Finished 11th
2007 - Finished 5th, Lost SF by 33
2008 - Finished 2nd, Won GF by 26
2009 - Finished 9th
2010 - Finished 7th, Lost EF by 33
2011 - Finished 3rd, Lost PF by 3
2012 - Finished 1st, Lost GF by 10
2013 - Finished 1st, Won GF by 15
2014 - Finished 2nd, won GF by 63
2015 - Finished 3rd, won GF by 46
2016 - Finished 3rd, Lost SF by 23
2017 Finished 12th

Richmond
2012 - Finished 12th
2013 - Finished 5th, Lost EF by 20 points
2014 - Finished 8th Lost EF by 57 points
2015 - Finished 5th Lost EF by 17 points
2016 - Finished 13th
2017 - Finished 3rd, Won GF by 48 Points
2018 - Finished 1st, Lost PF by 39 points
2019 - Finished 3rd, Won GF by 89 points
2020 - Finished 3rd, Won GF by 31 points


Looking at these broken down like, Hawthorn holds the cake for longevity, while Richmond are the most clinical.

Hawks - 4 flags over 8 years including a 3peat + 2 minor premierships. Their 3peat follows 2 years where they lost a Prelim by a few points and a Minor Premiership + narrow GF loss by 10 points.

The Lions however had the 3peat but never won a Minor premiership and had the shortest run of anyone at the top. They also got heavily beaten in all the finals they lost & their finals run was crazily broken up with a wooden spoon. This suggest that as good as they were, they didn;t deal with failure well.
Plus, like it or not, they had several list & cap advantages their opponents did not. That has to count for something.


Cats had 3 but could never win a back to back which is vital when judging a dynasty. Their 3 are only divided by a minor premiership + shock GF loss and a narrow bitting prelim loss. Had the potential to possibly win 5, ultimately didn't.

Richmond are right on the Hawks neck though. 3 flags, including a back to back, with the 1st flag only separated by a convincing minor premiership & a shock Prelim loss. Also have the highest avg GF winning margin & only team to not lose a GF.

For sure.

Tigers win next year they are the best. Dont win til 2022 and its a tough decision.

Cats not in the argument. Lions were incredible (I 100% LOVED their style of play) but Hawks got the extra flag.

 

[ryza87]

Its hard to judge as Richmond have still potentially got 3-4 years with majority of its current team, we will only maybe loose one or two key players over the next 2 or 3 seasons (Jack and Houli)

Brisbane were basically unbeatable during there 3 flags, but Hawthorn are probably my pick to this point as they were at the top much longer then Brisbane.

If the Tigs win next year for 3 in a row, I think we clearly become best ever side with 4 flags in 5 years.
There is no point bringing up sides pre 1990 as it came down to size of the cheque book, there are now 18 teams, draft, free agency etc.

All amazing teams of their time though!

 

[My Cotchin Rules]

Its hard to judge as Richmond have still potentially got 3-4 years with majority of its current team, we will only maybe loose one or two key players over the next 2 or 3 seasons (Jack and Houli)

Brisbane were basically unbeatable during there 3 flags, but Hawthorn are probably my pick to this point as they were at the top much longer then Brisbane.

If the Tigs win next year for 3 in a row, I think we clearly become best ever side with 4 flags in 5 years.
There is no point bringing up sides pre 1990 as it came down to size of the cheque book, there are now 18 teams, draft, free agency etc.

All amazing teams of their time though!

Just waiting for the Blues & Bombers to bombard thread with their "we are the best we have 16 flags". Even though some prehistoric flags were won during 6 & 8 team round robin comps during the wars ect. Any flag in the AFL era holds way more value in my opinion.

In saying this my 1 to 4 by degree of difficulty.

1. Brisbane (won 3 traveling to the MCG against MCG tenants)
2. Hawks (won 3 against non-VIC teams) however won 3 in a row.
3. Richmond (won 2 in a row) including one out of their suitcases all year.
4. Geelong. Probably the most strongest side of them all but didn't capitalise their dominance. Should of won 4 or 5.

 

[dean33]

3 in a row is harder than 3 in 4 or 3 in 5

Hawks and Lions both played off in 4 straight grand finals and won 3

Cats played in 3 straight but not 4 and couldn't go back to back

Tigers have played in two straight and gone back to back but couldn't even play in 3 in a row

Never mind the fact that we had the same coach and core in 2008 as we had in 2012-2015

Lions and Hawks so far the only teams that have won three in a row in the AFL era, if you win next year then we can talk

You speak as if our dynasty is over? One thing is for sure if we win it again next year we sit alone as greatest of all time

 

[Blackas87]

Geelong for me.

-Largest grand final win.
-21-1 season was unreal despite not winning the Grand Final
-Won all their 3 premierships without losing a final while all of Brisbane, Hawthorn and Richmond needed 2nd chances during the finals to win their 3.
- Had tougher contenders in St Kilda, Collingwood and the Bulldogs during their era

 

[Lsta062]

You know what’s funny? Geelong are statistically the worst out of the 4 dynasties in the AFL era when it comes to Premierships (Geelong won 3 in 5). Having said that, I actually think that they were the strongest out of the dynasties. They were downright scary to face and were really dominant unlike the other three dynasties who’d have competition. They kicked above 200 twice (233 against Melbourne in 2011 and 222 against Richmond in 2007). They are the only team to have done that in the shortened quarters and they cleared the 200-point line comfortably. Also, their opponents were the likes of St Kilda, Western Bulldogs and Collingwood of 2008-2011, and they were also quite strong.

For that reason, I’d have them first. The rest are as follows:

1. Geelong
2. Hawthorn
3. Brisbane
4. Richmond

Having said that, if Richmond wins again next year then Richmond go straight to the top of this list because 4 in 5 years (including a three-peat) beats any of the other teams’ achievements. This Richmond side is honestly the fittest side that I have ever seen. It sometimes feels like they can go all day and still perform like they are just getting started.

If we’re talking about success through Premierships though then it’s obviously:

1. Hawthorn
2. Brisbane
3. Richmond
4. Geelong

This is simply because Geelong took the longest time to get to 3 Premierships and Hawthorn also had 4 Grand Finals in a row, but they had a couple of minor Premierships and won the 2008 Premiership with the same-ish core squad as the three-peat. Brisbane didn’t do that.

Being ranked in the top 4 for success throughout the entire AFL era is a really good achievement, so all 4 teams did well to have an era like this. It’s not insulting to rank 4th at all, because at least they all had a dynasty in the AFL era.

 

[JackFlash]

Richmond are clearly the weakest, but they have the numbers on the board as the competition is no where near as competitive..Only Richmond supporters and idiots would argue against that. What is a dynasty anyway, is Melbourne from 1955 -1960 the best team ever? 6 Grand Finals 5-1..

 

[SSrixon]

Brisbane. I don't think I've watched a team other than Hawthorn as much as I watched Brisbane between 1999-2004. They played a tough and high scoring brand of football and it felt like every second Sunday you'd tune in to see them absolutely flog someone at the Gabba. Michael, Leppitch, Black, Brown and Lynch is also the best spine I've seen.

 

[PrinceCharles]

Richmond are the only one of the 4 that aren't enjoyable to watch as a neutral. Not that it really matters.

 

[PhatBoy]

Just waiting for the Blues & Bombers to bombard thread with their "we are the best we have 16 flags". Even though some prehistoric flags were won during 6 & 8 team round robin comps during the wars ect. Any flag in the AFL era holds way more value in my opinion.

In saying this my 1 to 4 by degree of difficulty.

1. Brisbane (won 3 traveling to the MCG against MCG tenants)
2. Hawks (won 3 against non-VIC teams) however won 3 in a row.
3. Richmond (won 2 in a row) including one out of their suitcases all year.
4. Geelong. Probably the most strongest side of them all but didn't capitalise their dominance. Should of won 4 or 5.

It’s an opinion thing and I’m fine with that and I’m not like offended or something that you’ve ranked us fourth, but does ‘what they SHOULD have achieved’ actually take away from what they achieved?

Ie. say St George in the rugby league who won 11 in a row were actually minor premiers the 3 years after, would they get marked down for not doing as well as they actually should have?