Analysis Ground ball gets - why are we so shithouse at them?

[RussellEbertHandball]

These GBGs stats are from WheeloRatings fantastic website for footy and other sports stats.

It includes last night's Freo v Collingwood game stats. First I sorted by total GBGs and we can say gee we get more than Collingwood, but are still in the bottom 3rd.

AFL Team Statistics

AFL team statistics.

www.wheeloratings.com

But then I looked at differentials and sorted by that - and guess what we are stone motherless last.

 

[Georgemehardies]

When Georgiades approaches a ground ball at times he almost freezes then looks like a toddler learning to walk then the oppo shuts it down or zooms off with the ball. Bizarre.

To be fair, Georgiades is in the team purely as an amazing mark and kick, and he is good enough at it that he will get a game in any team despite having no natural ability around the ground. He was simply not born with that ability, he's a specialist set shot goal kicker only. I often joke that once the ball hits the ground Georgiades is the player that plays how I would if I were out there

 

[Sleezy]

These GBGs stats are from WheeloRatings fantastic website for footy and other sports stats.

It includes last night's Freo v Collingwood game stats. First I sorted by total GBGs and we can say gee we get more than Collingwood, but are still in the bottom 3rd.

AFL Team Statistics

AFL team statistics.

www.wheeloratings.com

View attachment 2309352



But then I looked at differentials and sorted by that - and guess what we are stone motherless last.

View attachment 2309355

Guess who our top four are for GB gets: Butters (10pg), Wines (8pg), JHF (7pg) and... Lorenz (7pg).

Everyone else is 5 per game or less. Moraes is 2.3.

 

[Windy Cindy]

its what happens when you have a team full of fumblers

 

[Peninsula Boy]

Something that gets overlooked is our total lack of blocks laid by team mates. It buys the ball winner more time to gather (and less pressure), yet our players choose to peel off and try get the open handball receive after the other guy has won the ball.

The number of times a simple block would have helped the ball carrier run into open air but we didn't is astounding. Is this a result of far too many free kicks being paid against us? I doubt it, but possible. Often these blocks don't need to be a Byron Pickett style battering ram, just block the path ffs.

The overall synergy of the team playing more than its parts is definitely low.

Blocks and shepherds and winning contested ball with more players around.

Just all round intelligent team play is not our best attribute.

 

[Enviable Tradition]

Lorenz being dropped looks worse and worse

 

[Long live PAFC]

These GBGs stats are from WheeloRatings fantastic website for footy and other sports stats.

It includes last night's Freo v Collingwood game stats. First I sorted by total GBGs and we can say gee we get more than Collingwood, but are still in the bottom 3rd.

AFL Team Statistics

AFL team statistics.

www.wheeloratings.com

View attachment 2309352



But then I looked at differentials and sorted by that - and guess what we are stone motherless last.

View attachment 2309355

Really interesting.

More than collingwood and just less than the Hawks, who specifically targeted this as an area to work on.

Total GBG kind of follows the ladder, bar outliers - Carlton, St Kilda up top and pies and down low.

Seems like we have it on our terms, ie against Richmond, and we possess the ball nicely and ground balls become less relevant. We are up and about. Probably fewer GBGs too. Or we win it fiercely, ie against the Hawks in that first half, so win everything.

Otherwise we lose it. Those teams who all work to a plan, beat us.

 

[bow and arrow]

its what happens when you have a team full of fumblers

I'd like the club's/ coaches reasons as to why we have "a team of fumblers"! I don't think all our players start out that way.

 

[all seeing eye]

You play as you train and recruit.

 

[GremioPower]

These GBGs stats are from @WheeloRatings fantastic website for footy and other sports stats.

It includes last night's Freo v Collingwood game stats. First I sorted by total GBGs and we can say gee we get more than Collingwood, but are still in the bottom 3rd.

I read this first part and immediately thought: "the differential is more important". Then I saw the second part of the post...

 

[Long live PAFC]

Bit contrary but we’ve actually been fairly even in GBGs against the Dogs and pies. Generally actually we’ve been fairly even outside of the Saints, bombers and swans - who belted us. Even contested possessions and tackles we’ve been ok outside the dons and swans. Most of our deficit in GBGs is actually due to St Kilda, Essendon and Sydney.

But I don’t think this tells the whole story.

I suspect a quarter breakdown probably shows what’s going on, although I can’t see how/where to get this.

I suspect we smash a team for a quarter (Richmond, hawks, Swans, North, Essendon) and then get outworked for the remaining quarters thereby achieving a rough parity for the game. Or we get smashed and then slowly even the numbers as our opponent gets tired. St Kilda and Essendon just showed a willingness to keep working all game, which broke us when we didn’t take our chances.

So I think it comes back to the ability and drive to work for four quarters - fitness and mental toughness.

 

[GremioPower]

its what happens when you have a team full of fumblers

Many are naturally "outfielders". Not surprisingly, flankers play on the flank.

Those type of players don't usually go onto the mud and join the melee. Also, when they do, they aren't in their habitat and don't go well.

We used to have a good amount of "infielders". I do remember us being strong on the ground. I really missed when we changed our profile.

 

[RussellEbertHandball]

Saturday's GBG stats.

Us 75 v Geelong 90, at half time it was 41 v 51.

2024 QF Us 77 v 91
2024 PF Us 69 v 84

Rd 1 Col Us 71 v 86
Rd 8 WB Us 94 v 95
Rd 9 Ade Us 105 v 102

Rd 5 Haw Us 104 v 100
Rd 6 Syd Us 67 v 110
Rd 7 NM Us 99 v 93

 

[Long live PAFC]

Saturday's GBG stats.

Us 75 v Geelong 90, at half time it was 41 v 51.

2024 QF Us 77 v 91
2024 PF Us 69 v 84

Rd 1 Col Us 71 v 86
Rd 8 WB Us 94 v 95
Rd 9 Ade Us 105 v 102

Rd 5 Haw Us 104 v 100
Rd 6 Syd Us 67 v 110
Rd 7 NM Us 99 v 93

Hard to know what to make of those.

I wonder if there is something else there.

Ie we match contested possession and ground balls - effort is there and we win or are close. Or bring the pressure, win uncontested marks and ground balls become irrelevant?

 

[Expat power]

I thought our lack of GBG's in the second half on Saturday looked like either a communication or effort problem. Too often it looks like effort as it looks like two or three players are waiting on the outside but that could also be a communication issue when everyone thinks it's someone else's job.

 

[The Hobo]

I thought our lack of GBG's in the second half on Saturday looked like either a communication or effort problem. Too often it looks like effort as it looks like two or three players are waiting on the outside but that could also be a communication issue when everyone thinks it's someone else's job.

With the early injuries and down to 2 on the bench for an entire half, there's not a lot to learn from that game from an effort perspective. I'm worried that the fatigue will translate into this week as well.

 

[RussellEbertHandball]

This graphic was put up on 7's broadcast last Thursday night before the bounce against Carlton.

Its differential stats and Port are pretty poor, but no surprise we are stone motherless last for Ground Ball Gets differential.

We lost Ground Ball on Thursday night, 68 v 80.

 

[Us against the rest]

This graphic was put up on 7's broadcast last Thursday night before the bounce against Carlton.

Its differential stats and Port are pretty poor, but no surprise we are stone motherless last for Ground Ball Gets differential.

We lost Ground Ball on Thursday night, 68 v 80.


View attachment 2357104

Instead of playing soccer, some good skills training might help, these things are taught, Tredrea was fantastic below his knee's.

 

[shewho]

The above graphic is very concerning. It is what I expected to see from Richmond this year but it means Richmond and West Coast are beating us in most of those areas.

I thought last year we were a high level contested side, making the drop off even more concerning.

To answer the thread's question: the only logical answer is that we are slower to react (agility) and not hard enough at the ball (strength, effort). However, the fact that we are still (barely) in the hunt for finals tells me that there must be something compensating for these glaring deficiencies so a third reason must be game style. We must be relying on turnovers, ball movement and defensive pressure across all lines rather than concentrating on the contest.

It isn't working and it also explains the blowout losses.

 

[Alberton Proud]

Not enough really close checking by others in and around the contest

 

[Coobk001]

It'll be ugly this weekend, the upcoming collapse V Brisbane is so easy to see coming. Our inability in this space is going to get shredded apart.

Ken and the boys patting themselves on the back after winning 3 from 4, and then as soon as our backs are broken in the game and suddenly any minuscule mathematical finals chance disappears and they get on top, it will turn ugly fast against a side that has a history of absolutely destroying us.

You can see though when we play, we're so reliant on having our skills sharp and hitting targets. When we do that we get the ball on the outside and carve sides up, as soon as that is taken away from us it gets ugly the other way.

 

[Duckimus Prime]

Bit contrary but we’ve actually been fairly even in GBGs against the Dogs and pies. Generally actually we’ve been fairly even outside of the Saints, bombers and swans - who belted us. Even contested possessions and tackles we’ve been ok outside the dons and swans. Most of our deficit in GBGs is actually due to St Kilda, Essendon and Sydney.

When the opposition are moving the ball through handball chains and taking marks then they don't get ground ball gets.

Also if they're getting clear intercepts from our disposals they aren't getting ground ball gets.

 

[shewho]

We ended the season 15th at Ground Ball Gets, 16th at Ground Ball Gets inside 50 and 18th at Crumbing. We were also 16th for Centre Clearances and 16th for Contested Possessions. For most of those categories we were only in front of West Coast and Richmond.

These stats are a disgrace and an embarrassment to the Port Adelaide ethos.

Our inability to win Ground Ball Inside 50 was obvious and in dire need of improvement: Richards (1.7), Rioli (1.6-gone) and JHF (1.3) were the only 3 to average in the Top 100 of the comp. Given one has retired and another belongs in the midfield, something has to change quickly.

To put these averages into perspective, the delisted Orazio Fantasia

14

Orazio Fantasia

Age

30

Ht

180cm

Wt

73kg

Pos.

Fwd

Career

Season

Last 5

D

13.6

3star

K

7.4

3star

HB

6.2

4star

M

3.6

4star

T

3.1

5star

G

1.4

5star

D

9.8

2star

K

5.4

2star

HB

4.4

3star

M

3.0

3star

T

1.2

2star

G

0.2

3star

D

12.0

3star

K

4.6

2star

HB

7.4

5star

M

3.4

4star

T

2.2

4star

G

0.0

1star

averaged 3.0 per game for an average Carlton.

Crumbing (a ground ball get after a marking contest) we had 1 player in the top 90: Jed McEntee (1.5)!!!

This emphasises my impression that our greatest recruiting need is a forward with real presence at ground level- not another DBJ who jags the occasional goal because defenders leave him free inside 50. I'd go so far to say that without a proper Rioli replacement, we won't get near the 8 and we will lose Butters at the end of the year.