List Mgmt. Grundy: Did we make the wrong choice?

[Pivo]

I couldn't be bothered getting into the debate about Grundy V Thurlow as I have already been there and done that late last year.

However, as a fan of Grundy, I think his games to date has shown that this myth that all ruckmen should be left until the 3rd round in the draft because they take too long to develop is pretty naive.

I don't think you should pass over a player just because he is classed as "a ruckman".

Besides, Dawson Simpson and Trent West have been on our list for years. So why do we really care that it might take some time to develop a ruckman anyway??

Grundy has held his own against Hawthorn and Sydney. He does all the things you want a ruckman to do; wins or breaks even at the stoppage, has good tap-work and has gives second efforts.

He also gets around the ground to provide an option, is pretty good below his knees and, I think, has the ability to play as a tall forward (and I base this on seeing him at junior level as well as the games he has currently played in the AFL).

I'm sure there are a few sides that are now wondering if passing him over was the right thing to do.

For the record, I really like Thurlow so I'm very, very comfortable with him and his selection.

However, if you are shrugging off Grundy because he plays for another club or because we chose Thurlow over him, don't. Grundy (like Thurlow) can play. It is just he wasn't the right fit for us at draft time.

Yes, some rucks will take a bit longer to develop. However, there are also kids like Grundy (and Leuenberger before him) that have "it" and, as I believe quality ruckman are harder to come by than midfielders or flankers, then sometimes you just need to take the punt.

So, why didn't we?? As another poster mentioned, the fact we secured McIntosh pretty much put paid to us going for Grundy.

A list with McIntosh, West, Simpson, Vardy and then Blicavs being used in ruck pretty much ensured there wasn't any room for another ruckman like Grundy.

 

[sarah.13]

Thurlow will be very good but I'd prefer Grundy. Getting McIntosh was the first mistake as this ruled out picking up Grundy.

Grundy was not expected to last to our pick. McIntosh was already traded for and Simpson was expected to be ready.
Both should be fit and firing next year and Grundy will no longer be a talking point

 

[Ikan Bodoh]

Grundy was not expected to last to our pick. McIntosh was already traded for and Simpson was expected to be ready.
Both should be fit and firing next year and Grundy will no longer be a talking point

This.

Plus IMO Thurlow is the most exciting young talent on our list. Will explode next year.

 

[cats_09]

Anyone want to go back to the Thurlow thread and read the comments that were being made after his games earlier this season?
He debuted against Essendon and picked up 17 disposals, the next week against the Pies he had 16, had a quiet game against Port with only 8 disposals, after a week off he comes back against GWS and gets 19 disposals.
At that time the comments were along the lines of "best rookie we have had since Selwood", "may not play finals this year, but will be a lock in the 22 next year", "will win the Rising Star next year" - on the last one it seemed questions were whether Mitchell (Syd) might be a lock for that next year, but he has now played 10 games so is out of contention next season - everything was super positive and how well we had done drafting this kid.

Now that Simpson is injured, HMac hasn't got up and that Grundy has played 5 games(?) suddenly questioning if we made the wrong choice - IF Simpson and/or H.Mac were fit and playing as #1, if West was playing with confidence and not forgetting that we have Vardy & Blitz, it would be a non-issue as to IF we should have taken Grundy instead.

Neither guy has played 10 games and we don't know how Grundy would have gone in our system - so maybe leave the comparison for whom we should have picked until they are 100 game players and revisit things then.

 

[The rabbi]

Hindsighted people have 20/20 vision.

 

[SleazySimon]

Here's an unpopular view - what if we kept both first round picks, we could have had both Grundy and Thurlow.
Instead of Caddy we play GHS instead.
After Ottens retires, we go for Ben Hudson or Ivan Maric instead of Stephenson, then we wouldn't need to go for McIntosh.
I'm not criticising our recruiting, there are ALWAYS gambles and mistakes, just looking at things in hindsight.

 

[Jemaine]

Pies have the next best recruitment to us, I think. Swans would be up there but they're great at trades also.

Not hard when you've got an extra mil and a bit in the salary cap.

 

[Gaz_Brownlow]

Very happy with Caddy and Thurlow.

Yes Grundy looks very promising, but we select based on needs and I think besides the fact we have been unlucky with injury to Simpson, Hawkins and Hmac, we have got it right.

I am backing in Vardy to be something very special anyway.

 

[THE CAT WRANGLER]

Very happy with Caddy and Thurlow.

Yes Grundy looks very promising, but we select based on needs and I think besides the fact we have been unlucky with injury to Simpson, Hawkins and Hmac, we have got it right.

I am backing in Vardy to be something very special anyway.

Agree with your comments

 

[Senatorguesty]

Here's an unpopular view - what if we kept both first round picks, we could have had both Grundy and Thurlow.
Instead of Caddy we play GHS instead.
After Ottens retires, we go for Ben Hudson or Ivan Maric instead of Stephenson, then we wouldn't need to go for McIntosh.
I'm not criticising our recruiting, there are ALWAYS gambles and mistakes, just looking at things in hindsight.

 

[FredLeDeux]

Yes, no.

 

[flatcat]

Grundy has been great the last 2 weeks for a first year ruck. I think he may well be a more influential player than Thurlow. Oh well, you win some you lose some. Thurlow looks like he will be a good player. If he is and plays 200 games then mission accomplished. As good as Wells is, you can't always the best available. You worry more about drafting guys with your first pick and them playing less than 50 games.

 

[tonxi]

Josh Fraser looked a world beater too. Too early to call superstar.

Jolly, Hudson and Lynch are nearly done. If Grundy is exposed to full time ruck work too early, it may cut him down physically. Just as it did Fraser. Not saying it will, but with the Pies rick stocks, who knows. Relying on a 20 year old to hold down the No 1 ruck position is a pretty big ask.

 

[Stig_90]

Hindsighted people have 20/20 vision.

Grundy was seen as the better prospect before the draft.

 

[Scottland2007]

I guess Pies won't be chasing Dawson now!

 

[JUBJUB]

Imagine if we too Mitch Thorp instead of Selwood.Some of you would've slashed your wrists by now.

 

[OldStyle2007]

They traded for HMac so why would they draft another ruckman? Thurlow is going to be a terrific player so I have no problem with how things worked out.

I think the point is we wouldnt have needed to take a 650k salary cap hit and give up a second round pick for Hmac

Conceivably we could have taken Grundy in round 1 and still got thurlow in round 2

Bad trade by the cats when you take everything into account

 

[The rabbi]

Grundy was seen as the better prospect before the draft.

A better prospect than who?

CF said: ↑

​

They traded for HMac so why would they draft another ruckman? Thurlow is going to be a terrific player so I have no problem with how things worked out.​

 

[Stig_90]

A better prospect than who?

CF said: ↑

​

Thurlow.

 

[dazbroncos]

Rear view mirror stuff. Sure HMAC was a risk but a calculated one. What would we be saying if it was Grundy that did what Daws did to his knee?

Woulda - coulda - shoulda but im glad we didnt. Thurlow will be a star.

Go Catters

 

[Senatorguesty]

Thurlow.

Thurlow has the potential to be a STAR half back.
Simpson and Vardy could be a star ruck combo for the next 5 years.

I think we did ok.

 

[FredLeDeux]

We made the calculated - and obviously correct - decision that we needed a big 1st ruckman if we were to win the premiership this year. We did not know whether Simpson would play, or be good enough. So we recruited McIntosh. That was a clearly correct decision.
That left us with 4 ruckmen on the list (after delisting OS, and not counting Blicavs).
There was room for no more.
It wasn't just a correct decision to duck Grundy, it was inevitable.

 

[dazbroncos]

We made the calculated - and obviously correct - decision that we needed a big 1st ruckman if we were to win the premiership this year. We did not know whether Simpson would play, or be good enough. So we recruited McIntosh. That was a clearly correct decision.
That left us with 4 ruckmen on the list (after delisting OS, and not counting Blicavs).
There was room for no more.
It wasn't just a correct decision to duck Grundy, it was inevitable.

totally agree with this. Funny now 21 rounds later we have no #1 at all, are pretty much conceding the position and playing the options we have ( run the guts out of the other rucks all over the ground and try and pressure the bejesus out of their clearances) and are still winning. Could this be the "forward press and rolling zone" of the future - in that no #1 ruck is the new fad of tha game?

Go Catters

 

[tenderwarrior]

Haven't had a great strike rate with early picks from Tassie

Gerard Bennett
Cameron Thurlow
Peter Street
The other big log that was the same year as Bennett and never made it.

Brockman. And it is Thurley, not Thurlow.

Hopefully Thurlow and Burbury can change it around. I think there was another player too from that era, but his name escapes me.

Thurley if I remember correctly turned down a contract just before the list deadline and we had to take an unplanned late pick in the draft to replace him. All in all it turned out very well


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[Ozguy]

Once again BF knows more about recruiting than Stephen Wells. The guy who spends every waking hour planning for the future. Slotting in players to where the club believes there will be the greatest need TOMORROW, not today.

And if you say Wells made a mistake, it means you are saying he made a mistake to take Simpson, Vardy and Blicavs because obviously none of them are going to work out.