List Mgmt. Half-backs

[lewdogs]

It's an interesting thing with our list looking at the number of half-back types that we've recruited over the past few years. I thought that we may have been putting a few too many eggs in this basket, but in light of some of the matches on the weekend I'm not so sure.

A good player or two in this position can have an enormous impact on the side. Look at how Johannison killed us with his pace and delivery. Gibson was also massive on the weekend, controlling the Hawks backline and setting up attacks.

Now at the moment in our side we have

Savage
Roberton
Webster

acting in this role. To be honest I think all three have been very disappointing so far this year.

Waiting in the wings we have

McKenzie
Rice
White
Wright
Lee

What we need from these players are first and foremost, elite kicking and decision making. Pace is also handy.

So here is my question... who makes it in the long run? Will Savage, Roberton and Webster come out of the team soon to try some of the others? Or is the reason those players aren't being as effective as those in other sides something to do with our entire defensive or midfield set up.

Whatever the case, I have noticed over the past fortnight that we have struggled big time to get it out of defence. We have a glut of these half-back types, but who makes it long term?

 

[gringo2011]

Webster has been my biggest disappointment so far this year. He is now at the age he should be really starting to make himself a star. So far this season he's seemed lazy and unaccountable. As much as everyone bags Geary at least he never lets his player off the leash. Already this year Webster has been up the field while his player doubles back leaving Fisher or Dempster trying to cover 2 players on several occasions. Fisher lets him know about it too but doesn't seem to stop him. Savage and Roberton are both off where they were last season too. There seems a problem with options to kick to as well. We are often forced to kick to contests because no options present to the back trying to clear the ball. Bruce and Newness seem the only 2 willing to try to make an option with searching leads.

 

[SaintRick88]

Great post. This is the question I have been asking myself since the Dogs game. At the end of last year I felt this was a position we were very strong in. I had great faith that Webster, Roberton and Savage were good enough to become good-very good finals playing half backs in the future. They all have weapons but have all been poor so far this year. Webster has pace and good kicking skills but it let down by poor decision making and poor discipline. Savage also has pace and good kicking including for goal beyond 50m but doesn't impact games enough and still needs to improve defensively. Robbo has height and mobility and is generally a good kick as well but sometimes appears slow and makes some big errors. Having said that, their job is made a whole lot harder playing in a poor side. They are under a lot of pressure and dealing with a lot of entries. Of the next batch, McKenzie is the one I have high hopes for. Pace, courage, marking and kicking. I think due to his physique and personality it will be a slow burn with DMac.Hopefully by the end of this year we can say we have 2-3 half backs that will make it in finals sides because it is such a pivotal position.

Yeah DMac is the one for mine. Is tough and hard at it, can mark, run and kick. Looking forward to forward to seeing where he can get to, but I reckon we will need to be patient with him. Not sure about Rice, but apparently a great kick and loves the hard stuff, which is a good start. White could be the surprise packet - at least I hope so!

 

[bird_man]

Even though we have a number of half back flankers, none of them are absolute stars unfortunately. Roberton is the kind of player that would get a game in most sides but wouldn't really improve the side a lot. Savages best is terrific but it's rare we see it unfortunately. Webster seems to have been given a really defensive role back there. Wrights skills are ordinary. White is an unknown really.

I have high hopes for McKenzie but Rice is not someone that can really break the lines although he has a good boot.

 

[Doggstats]

Excuse my intrusion. I think Ameet and Trout have done an amazing job so far with your rebuild. A really good textbook rebuild. Start with the spine and then finish off with the class and x-factor. That's where the half back flankers come into it, and I agree with most of what's been said so far.

I think you could honestly mount a case for the half back line being the most important line in modern footy. Why else would the Hawks rotate arguably their 3 best players (Hodge, Burgoyne and Mitchell) through there? Why else would Collingwood be playing their best player (Pendlebry) on the half back line in their 2 games so far this year? Also, why else would Bevo recruit another back flanker (Suckling) for us, even though it was already by far our strongest line last year.

So having said that, my question is, what do you guys think of playing Billings off half back? Looking in from the outside, Billings looks like he's by far your best ball user and decision maker. 1 thing I took away from our game on the weekend was just how weak your half back line is compared to your other lines. Your forward line is one of the best going around -Rooey, Bruce, Mccartin, Billings and Lonie -, and your midfield also stacks up pretty well with Armo, Steven, Montagna and Ross. Add another few years of development to Acres (Was shocked he was dropped TBH), Gresham and then throw in Freeman and things are looking really good.

So once you throw in Carlisle and Goddard down back I think it's pretty clear that your half back line is your only noticeable chink in the armour. I really like the look of Savage and Webster but you need a lot more depth down there. For example we have 7-8 genuinly good ball users who rotate through our half back line:
Johanissen
R.Murphy
E.Wood
M.Boyd
S.Biggs
M.Suckling
L.Hunter
K.Steven
And even Bontempelli started the game rotating through HBF on the weekend.

The reason for the need of so many rotating half backs is that once a ball is intercepted, all half backs in attacking positions will blitz forward and contribute to that play. Then any half backs/wingers not in attacking positions who can't contribute to that play will rotate back and fill in the holes left by the blitzers. So whilst it might look like kamikaze play, in actuality, they always have defensive coverage through rotating.

The kick that starts your transition from the back line is probably the most important kick in footy ATM. So why not rotate Billings(and maybe even Gresham)-one of the best kicks in the comp-, through Half-back and the wing? You might say that you'd prefer him kicking goals and delivering inside 50, but that is what he would be doing as an attacking back flanker. Eg, look at Johanissen so far this year, our most attacking flanker, is averaging 1 goal, 2 goals assists and 4.5 inside 50's a game so far (ave 4.2 inside 50's last year) this year. As well as a lazy average of 31 disposals a game. Now, imagine Billings (Who IMO is a better ball user than JJ) racking up 30+ touches a game and setting up all your offensive transitions (think Burgoyne, Pendlebry, R.Murphy or Brodie Smith). Or even just have him as a defensive winger, rotating through wing and HBF (think Sam Mitchell or Lachie Hunter for us).

 

[TheLonieRanger]

Excuse my intrusion. I think Ameet and Trout have done an amazing job so far with your rebuild. A really good textbook rebuild. Start with the spine and then finish off with the class and x-factor. That's where the half back flankers come into it, and I agree with most of what's been said so far.

I think you could honestly mount a case for the half back line being the most important line in modern footy. Why else would the Hawks rotate arguably their 3 best players (Hodge, Burgoyne and Mitchell) through there? Why else would Collingwood be playing their best player (Pendlebry) on the half back line in their 2 games so far this year? Also, why else would Bevo recruit another back flanker (Suckling) for us, even though it was already by far our strongest line last year.

So having said that, my question is, what do you guys think of playing Billings off half back? Looking in from the outside, Billings looks like he's by far your best ball user and decision maker. 1 thing I took away from our game on the weekend was just how weak your half back line is compared to your other lines. Your forward line is one of the best going around -Rooey, Bruce, Mccartin, Billings and Lonie -, and your midfield also stacks up pretty well with Armo, Steven, Montagna and Ross. Add another few years of development to Acres (Was shocked he was dropped TBH), Gresham and then throw in Freeman and things are looking really good.

So once you throw in Carlisle and Goddard down back I think it's pretty clear that your half back line is your only noticeable chink in the armour. I really like the look of Savage and Webster but you need a lot more depth down there. For example we have 7-8 genuinly good ball users who rotate through our half back line:
Johanissen
R.Murphy
E.Wood
M.Boyd
S.Biggs
M.Suckling
L.Hunter
K.Steven
And even Bontempelli started the game rotating through HBF on the weekend.

The reason for the need of so many rotating half backs is that once a ball is intercepted, all half backs in attacking positions will blitz forward and contribute to that play. Then any half backs/wingers not in attacking positions who can't contribute to that play will rotate back and fill in the holes left by the blitzers. So whilst it might look like kamikaze play, in actuality, they always have defensive coverage through rotating.

The kick that starts your transition from the back line is probably the most important kick in footy ATM. So why not rotate Billings(and maybe even Gresham)-one of the best kicks in the comp-, through Half-back and the wing? You might say that you'd prefer him kicking goals and delivering inside 50, but that is what he would be doing as an attacking back flanker. Eg, look at Johanissen so far this year, our most attacking flanker, is averaging 1 goal, 2 goals assists and 4.5 inside 50's a game so far (ave 4.2 inside 50's last year) this year. As well as a lazy average of 31 disposals a game. Now, imagine Billings (Who IMO is a better ball user than JJ) racking up 30+ touches a game and setting up all your offensive transitions (think Burgoyne, Pendlebry, R.Murphy or Brodie Smith). Or even just have him as a defensive winger, rotating through wing and HBF (think Sam Mitchell or Lachie Hunter for us).

I think it's time you bite the bullet and buy that saints membership your keep talking about

 

[Smoke_Me_AKipper]

Excuse my intrusion. I think Ameet and Trout have done an amazing job so far with your rebuild. A really good textbook rebuild. Start with the spine and then finish off with the class and x-factor. That's where the half back flankers come into it, and I agree with most of what's been said so far.

I think you could honestly mount a case for the half back line being the most important line in modern footy. Why else would the Hawks rotate arguably their 3 best players (Hodge, Burgoyne and Mitchell) through there? Why else would Collingwood be playing their best player (Pendlebry) on the half back line in their 2 games so far this year? Also, why else would Bevo recruit another back flanker (Suckling) for us, even though it was already by far our strongest line last year.

So having said that, my question is, what do you guys think of playing Billings off half back? Looking in from the outside, Billings looks like he's by far your best ball user and decision maker. 1 thing I took away from our game on the weekend was just how weak your half back line is compared to your other lines. Your forward line is one of the best going around -Rooey, Bruce, Mccartin, Billings and Lonie -, and your midfield also stacks up pretty well with Armo, Steven, Montagna and Ross. Add another few years of development to Acres (Was shocked he was dropped TBH), Gresham and then throw in Freeman and things are looking really good.

So once you throw in Carlisle and Goddard down back I think it's pretty clear that your half back line is your only noticeable chink in the armour. I really like the look of Savage and Webster but you need a lot more depth down there. For example we have 7-8 genuinly good ball users who rotate through our half back line:
Johanissen
R.Murphy
E.Wood
M.Boyd
S.Biggs
M.Suckling
L.Hunter
K.Steven
And even Bontempelli started the game rotating through HBF on the weekend.

The reason for the need of so many rotating half backs is that once a ball is intercepted, all half backs in attacking positions will blitz forward and contribute to that play. Then any half backs/wingers not in attacking positions who can't contribute to that play will rotate back and fill in the holes left by the blitzers. So whilst it might look like kamikaze play, in actuality, they always have defensive coverage through rotating.

The kick that starts your transition from the back line is probably the most important kick in footy ATM. So why not rotate Billings(and maybe even Gresham)-one of the best kicks in the comp-, through Half-back and the wing? You might say that you'd prefer him kicking goals and delivering inside 50, but that is what he would be doing as an attacking back flanker. Eg, look at Johanissen so far this year, our most attacking flanker, is averaging 1 goal, 2 goals assists and 4.5 inside 50's a game so far (ave 4.2 inside 50's last year) this year. As well as a lazy average of 31 disposals a game. Now, imagine Billings (Who IMO is a better ball user than JJ) racking up 30+ touches a game and setting up all your offensive transitions (think Burgoyne, Pendlebry, R.Murphy or Brodie Smith). Or even just have him as a defensive winger, rotating through wing and HBF (think Sam Mitchell or Lachie Hunter for us).

Thanks for the post - makes really good reading. Always interested to hear OP come on and rate the rebuild as it's a more dispassionate view. Most of us do agree with you - sort out the mids and the cream now.

And this is why we're still 1-2 years away. We do need a number of players who can use the ball well. I think we have one or two kids who do fit the bill but they are 1-2 years away most likely. Sort it out in the next two drafts, add back Carlisle and Freeman with a free agent or two and we start to look good....patience by supporters are all that is needed, (and that is hard)!!

 

[Rors]

Excuse my intrusion. I think Ameet and Trout have done an amazing job so far with your rebuild. A really good textbook rebuild. Start with the spine and then finish off with the class and x-factor. That's where the half back flankers come into it, and I agree with most of what's been said so far.

I think you could honestly mount a case for the half back line being the most important line in modern footy. Why else would the Hawks rotate arguably their 3 best players (Hodge, Burgoyne and Mitchell) through there? Why else would Collingwood be playing their best player (Pendlebry) on the half back line in their 2 games so far this year? Also, why else would Bevo recruit another back flanker (Suckling) for us, even though it was already by far our strongest line last year.

So having said that, my question is, what do you guys think of playing Billings off half back? Looking in from the outside, Billings looks like he's by far your best ball user and decision maker. 1 thing I took away from our game on the weekend was just how weak your half back line is compared to your other lines. Your forward line is one of the best going around -Rooey, Bruce, Mccartin, Billings and Lonie -, and your midfield also stacks up pretty well with Armo, Steven, Montagna and Ross. Add another few years of development to Acres (Was shocked he was dropped TBH), Gresham and then throw in Freeman and things are looking really good.

So once you throw in Carlisle and Goddard down back I think it's pretty clear that your half back line is your only noticeable chink in the armour. I really like the look of Savage and Webster but you need a lot more depth down there. For example we have 7-8 genuinly good ball users who rotate through our half back line:
Johanissen
R.Murphy
E.Wood
M.Boyd
S.Biggs
M.Suckling
L.Hunter
K.Steven
And even Bontempelli started the game rotating through HBF on the weekend.

The reason for the need of so many rotating half backs is that once a ball is intercepted, all half backs in attacking positions will blitz forward and contribute to that play. Then any half backs/wingers not in attacking positions who can't contribute to that play will rotate back and fill in the holes left by the blitzers. So whilst it might look like kamikaze play, in actuality, they always have defensive coverage through rotating.

The kick that starts your transition from the back line is probably the most important kick in footy ATM. So why not rotate Billings(and maybe even Gresham)-one of the best kicks in the comp-, through Half-back and the wing? You might say that you'd prefer him kicking goals and delivering inside 50, but that is what he would be doing as an attacking back flanker. Eg, look at Johanissen so far this year, our most attacking flanker, is averaging 1 goal, 2 goals assists and 4.5 inside 50's a game so far (ave 4.2 inside 50's last year) this year. As well as a lazy average of 31 disposals a game. Now, imagine Billings (Who IMO is a better ball user than JJ) racking up 30+ touches a game and setting up all your offensive transitions (think Burgoyne, Pendlebry, R.Murphy or Brodie Smith). Or even just have him as a defensive winger, rotating through wing and HBF (think Sam Mitchell or Lachie Hunter for us).

Quite possibly the best post I've read by an opposition poster on our board. Cheers for the 'foreign' insight. I think you're spot on. Our problem is that our midfield is so weak that we can't afford to have our most offensively skilled players down back at this stage, as far too much footy is being pumped into our defensive 50 arc by our opposition's midfield dominance.

Your idea is perfect for 2 years time once our midfield is stronger & more dominant. We can then afford to have heavily offensively minded players back there.

 

[Baughb]

While on the subject, does anyone have any info on White? Has he played VFL the last couple of weeks? I haven't heard anything since he was drafted.

 

[Doggstats]

Quite possibly the best post I've read by an opposition poster on our board. Cheers for the 'foreign' insight. I think you're spot on. Our problem is that our midfield is so weak that we can't afford to have our most offensively skilled players down back at this stage, as far too much footy is being pumped into our defensive 50 arc by our opposition's midfield dominance.

Your idea is perfect for 2 years time once our midfield is stronger & more dominant. We can then afford to have heavily offensively minded players back there.

Thanks. I definitely see where you're coming from regarding your midfield. It's interesting to note that clearances were even on the weekend and you guys laid 12 more tackles. But like you said there was definitely a noticeable lake of grunt in there. I'd like to see the stats on effective tackles, because I noticed that a lot of our boys were able to stand up in the tackle and get their hands up high and still distribute. I know a lot of it comes down to technique but when Steven (180cm), Montagna (178cm) or Armo (183cm) are trying to bring down guys 10-12cm taller (Bont 192cm, Macrae 191cm, Koby Stevens 189cm, Dunkley 189cm and Wallis 185cm) it's always going to be a uphill battle.

This is where I think Blake Acres (191cm) development is vital, not only for the ability to stand up in tackles but also to bring down the bigger boys himself. Then you also throw in O'meara (184cm and built like a mack truck), then all of a sudden it's a whole new ball game. Just like the domino effect we're now seeing with Dangerfield and the Cats, Selwood gets half the attention, then Duncan, then Caddy and so on. Now they can afford to throw Bartel and Guthrie down back and abuse their good foot skills and decision making.

So once you guys get Acres firing and trade in another big body like O'meara, then just like you said you guys will be able to afford to abuse Billings and/or Gresh's elite skills coming out of the back line. Having said that, you guys really should be getting as many games as possible into Acres right now IMO. 22 disposals, 10 contested and 4 clearances last week, why was he dropped?

 

[Rors]

Thanks. I definitely see where you're coming from regarding your midfield. It's interesting to note that clearances were even on the weekend and you guys laid 12 more tackles. But like you said there was definitely a noticeable lake of grunt in there. I'd like to see the stats on effective tackles, because I noticed that a lot of our boys were able to stand up in the tackle and get their hands up high and still distribute. I know a lot of it comes down to technique but when Steven (180cm), Montagna (178cm) or Armo (183cm) are trying to bring down guys 10-12cm taller (Bont 192cm, Macrae 191cm, Koby Stevens 189cm, Dunkley 189cm and Wallis 185cm) it's always going to be a uphill battle.

This is where I think Blake Acres (191cm) development is vital, not only for the ability to stand up in tackles but also to bring down the bigger boys himself. Then you also throw in O'meara (184cm and built like a mack truck), then all of a sudden it's a whole new ball game. Just like the domino effect we're now seeing with Dangerfield and the Cats, Selwood gets half the attention, then Duncan, then Caddy and so on. Now they can afford to throw Bartel and Guthrie down back and abuse their good foot skills and decision making.

So once you guys get Acres firing and trade in another big body like O'meara, then just like you said you guys will be able to afford to abuse Billings and/or Gresh's elite skills coming out of the back line. Having said that, you guys really should be getting as many games as possible into Acres right now IMO. 22 disposals, 10 contested and 4 clearances last week, why was he dropped?

O'Meara will be lucky to play another 50games in his career if any at all with my knowledge of patella tendon ruptures & heavy contact sports (I'm a biomechanist).

Agree with Acres. He just needs games so he can get used to the pace of AFL level. When played as a pure mid, he is a ball magnet.

 

[AFLOnline]

To the dogs supporter, great post, that was 100% bang on.

As Richo would say, we need another Billings. Putting him on the back flank for his creativity and ball use would be robbing Peter to pay Paul.

He's probably the only Saint I trust with the ball in his hand right now. And his work forward of centre is too valuable for mine.

 

[plugger66]

To the dogs supporter, great post, that was 100% bang on.

As Richo would say, we need another Billings. Putting him on the back flank for his creativity and ball use would be robbing Peter to pay Paul.

He's probably the only Saint I trust with the ball in his hand right now. And his work forward of centre is too valuable for mine.

Having said that it is a real issue that he hasn't kicked a goal for 6 or so games now. That just isn't good enough for a player like him who is outside the contest. He may be playing further up the ground but he still needs to kick some goals. I would say he has been slightly disappointing in the 2 games so far.

 

[Doggstats]

O'Meara will be lucky to play another 50games in his career if any at all with my knowledge of patella tendon ruptures & heavy contact sports (I'm a biomechanist).

Agree with Acres. He just needs games so he can get used to the pace of AFL level. When played as a pure mid, he is a ball magnet.

Really? Doesn't sound good. Well it's not really a surprise considering the same injury ended Chris Knights career, and by the looks of it Victor Cruz who's also suffered a torn patella might be headed down the same path (Don't think he's played a game in 1.5 years). Patella tendinitis is bad enough as it is, but a rupture on top is just rubbing salt into the wound.

The Suns are hoping for a mid year return, I assume that's wishful thinking from them?

 

[Rors]

Really? Doesn't sound good. Well it's not really a surprise considering the same injury ended Chris Knights career, and by the looks of it Victor Cruz who's also suffered a torn patella might be headed down the same path (Don't think he's played a game in 1.5 years). Patella tendinitis is bad enough as it is, but a rupture on top is just rubbing salt into the wound.

The Suns are hoping for a mid year return, I assume that's wishful thinking from them?

It's hard for a pure mid like O'Meara to be ever truly free of the patella tendinitis because he's always being tackled & the knee is continuously being driven into the turf. Once you add that to the biomechanics like issues around why it presented in the first place, you realise it's going to be a very complex case to get 100% right.

In his case now, there's been a rupture, which means there will also be scar tissue present on & around the origin or insertion of the tendon from the patella itself to the tibial tuberosity (don't know exactly which end it ruptured so I'm saying both). This will complicate things further.

If ever there was a case of 'buyer beware', unfortunately Jaeger O'Meara is the epitome of it

 

[Doggstats]

It's hard for a pure mid like O'Meara to be ever truly free of the patella tendinitis because he's always being tackled & the knee is continuously being driven into the turf. Once you add that to the biomechanics like issues around why it presented in the first place, you realise it's going to be a very complex case to get 100% right.

In his case now, there's been a rupture, which means there will also be scar tissue present on & around the origin or insertion of the tendon from the patella itself to the tibial tuberosity (don't know exactly which end it ruptured so I'm saying both). This will complicate things further.

If ever there was a case of 'buyer beware', unfortunately Jaeger O'Meara is the epitome of it

That really sucks. The kid had so much potential.

Might be better to just look at the draft this year then. There's a bloke running around for Murray, Will Brodie, who could be the cream that you're looking for, 187cm, tough, big, inside-out mid who I wouldn't be surprised if he grew another few cm and could end up 190cm+.

Considering how quick young mids develop in the AFL these days compared to the big boys, by the time Paddy and Goddard start firing, Brodie should be already up and going.

 

[Smoke_Me_AKipper]

That really sucks. The kid had so much potential.

Might be better to just look at the draft this year then. There's a bloke running around for Murray, Will Brodie, who could be the cream that you're looking for, 187cm, tough, big, inside-out mid who I wouldn't be surprised if he grew another few cm and could end up 190cm+.

Considering how quick young mids develop in the AFL these days compared to the big boys, by the time Paddy and Goddard start firing, Brodie should be already up and going.

Oh he's been identified as the one by a couple of folks on here and many of us (me included) have well and truly jumped on the bandwagon!! Very keen on Will and is the perfect addition for us....hoping he will still be available at our pick. (Although so much will happen in the next 6 months or so. Just look at Oliver coming from a long way back to be taken at pick 3 by Melbourne last year)

 

[Rors]

That really sucks. The kid had so much potential.

Might be better to just look at the draft this year then. There's a bloke running around for Murray, Will Brodie, who could be the cream that you're looking for, 187cm, tough, big, inside-out mid who I wouldn't be surprised if he grew another few cm and could end up 190cm+.

Considering how quick young mids develop in the AFL these days compared to the big boys, by the time Paddy and Goddard start firing, Brodie should be already up and going.

That was my thoughts.

I put a hypothetical in our trade thread yesterday.

2016 1st round pick - Will Brodie

Trade 2017 1st round pick + extras this year for Lachie Whitfield

At the end of 2017 season, reassess list & trade out a surplus player of reasonable talent to secure a 2nd round pick. Then trade the 2 2nd round picks to a team for academy points & receive their 1st & 3rd rounders in return.

Would give us Brodie, Whitfield & Carlisle to start the 2017 season, then another 1st rounder at the end of 2017 for another high end midfielder

 

[plugger66]

That was my thoughts.

I put a hypothetical in our trade thread yesterday.

2016 1st round pick - Will Brodie

Trade 2017 1st round pick + extras this year for Lachie Whitfield

At the end of 2017 season, reassess list & trade out a surplus player of reasonable talent to secure a 2nd round pick. Then trade the 2 2nd round picks to a team for academy points & receive their 1st & 3rd rounders in return.

Would give us Brodie, Whitfield & Carlisle to start the 2017 season, then another 1st rounder at the end of 2017 for another high end midfielder

Whitfield still isn't interested in leaving.

 

[t_94]

Excuse my intrusion. I think Ameet and Trout have done an amazing job so far with your rebuild. A really good textbook rebuild. Start with the spine and then finish off with the class and x-factor. That's where the half back flankers come into it, and I agree with most of what's been said so far.

I think you could honestly mount a case for the half back line being the most important line in modern footy. Why else would the Hawks rotate arguably their 3 best players (Hodge, Burgoyne and Mitchell) through there? Why else would Collingwood be playing their best player (Pendlebry) on the half back line in their 2 games so far this year? Also, why else would Bevo recruit another back flanker (Suckling) for us, even though it was already by far our strongest line last year.

So having said that, my question is, what do you guys think of playing Billings off half back? Looking in from the outside, Billings looks like he's by far your best ball user and decision maker. 1 thing I took away from our game on the weekend was just how weak your half back line is compared to your other lines. Your forward line is one of the best going around -Rooey, Bruce, Mccartin, Billings and Lonie -, and your midfield also stacks up pretty well with Armo, Steven, Montagna and Ross. Add another few years of development to Acres (Was shocked he was dropped TBH), Gresham and then throw in Freeman and things are looking really good.

So once you throw in Carlisle and Goddard down back I think it's pretty clear that your half back line is your only noticeable chink in the armour. I really like the look of Savage and Webster but you need a lot more depth down there. For example we have 7-8 genuinly good ball users who rotate through our half back line:
Johanissen
R.Murphy
E.Wood
M.Boyd
S.Biggs
M.Suckling
L.Hunter
K.Steven
And even Bontempelli started the game rotating through HBF on the weekend.

The reason for the need of so many rotating half backs is that once a ball is intercepted, all half backs in attacking positions will blitz forward and contribute to that play. Then any half backs/wingers not in attacking positions who can't contribute to that play will rotate back and fill in the holes left by the blitzers. So whilst it might look like kamikaze play, in actuality, they always have defensive coverage through rotating.

The kick that starts your transition from the back line is probably the most important kick in footy ATM. So why not rotate Billings(and maybe even Gresham)-one of the best kicks in the comp-, through Half-back and the wing? You might say that you'd prefer him kicking goals and delivering inside 50, but that is what he would be doing as an attacking back flanker. Eg, look at Johanissen so far this year, our most attacking flanker, is averaging 1 goal, 2 goals assists and 4.5 inside 50's a game so far (ave 4.2 inside 50's last year) this year. As well as a lazy average of 31 disposals a game. Now, imagine Billings (Who IMO is a better ball user than JJ) racking up 30+ touches a game and setting up all your offensive transitions (think Burgoyne, Pendlebry, R.Murphy or Brodie Smith). Or even just have him as a defensive winger, rotating through wing and HBF (think Sam Mitchell or Lachie Hunter for us).

Thanks. I definitely see where you're coming from regarding your midfield. It's interesting to note that clearances were even on the weekend and you guys laid 12 more tackles. But like you said there was definitely a noticeable lake of grunt in there. I'd like to see the stats on effective tackles, because I noticed that a lot of our boys were able to stand up in the tackle and get their hands up high and still distribute. I know a lot of it comes down to technique but when Steven (180cm), Montagna (178cm) or Armo (183cm) are trying to bring down guys 10-12cm taller (Bont 192cm, Macrae 191cm, Koby Stevens 189cm, Dunkley 189cm and Wallis 185cm) it's always going to be a uphill battle.

This is where I think Blake Acres (191cm) development is vital, not only for the ability to stand up in tackles but also to bring down the bigger boys himself. Then you also throw in O'meara (184cm and built like a mack truck), then all of a sudden it's a whole new ball game. Just like the domino effect we're now seeing with Dangerfield and the Cats, Selwood gets half the attention, then Duncan, then Caddy and so on. Now they can afford to throw Bartel and Guthrie down back and abuse their good foot skills and decision making.

So once you guys get Acres firing and trade in another big body like O'meara, then just like you said you guys will be able to afford to abuse Billings and/or Gresh's elite skills coming out of the back line. Having said that, you guys really should be getting as many games as possible into Acres right now IMO. 22 disposals, 10 contested and 4 clearances last week, why was he dropped?

Great posting mate! This is top tier stuff.

Not sure with Acres. Personally I'm very bullish on him as are a lot of people on here. Richardson said it was due to inconsistency throughout the game ( i.e. contrast between 3rd and 4th quarters- 10 and 2 disposals respectively). Personally it doesn't add up for me either, I would give him a block of games as I think he would really come on with some continuity- something he hasn't had with either injury or selection thus far.

 

[Rors]

Whitfield still isn't interested in leaving.

You keep saying that but until he re-signs, I'm gonna keep hoping he leaves

 

[DarkSaint]

As i said in an earlier thread we need to be playing for the future, There is no point having Gilbert play as a pure midfielder (who wont be there for the next flag) as this pushes out the development of Kids (Acres). We have seen that everytime Acres or any of the kids go back to the vfl then all dominate with 25+ touches and a couple of goals. These guys need to be given a block of 5 or 6 games in a row instead of being in and out of the side after a couple.

 

[AFLOnline]

Having said that it is a real issue that he hasn't kicked a goal for 6 or so games now. That just isn't good enough for a player like him who is outside the contest. He may be playing further up the ground but he still needs to kick some goals. I would say he has been slightly disappointing in the 2 games so far.

Disappointing without a doubt, having said that he is still our most reliable player with ball in hands well and truly.

 

[lewdogs]

Really reckon Billings back is a great idea; if we could get the ball to him he could become so damaging on the rebound.

 

[Defacto]

the truly great sides have amazing attack off the half back line, both by foot but also through creativity

webster of late has let himself down in this regard. savage is good by foot and roberton is also under-rated in that regard. not sure i rate anyone else in that backline

we've recruited far too many HBF that we hoped to turn into mids though. need to look for genuine superstar mids