Harcourt presentation "bombshell"

[Tiger_man322]

Instead of just the headline, at least read the article, if not the hundreds of posts/news articles on the topic. It has nothing to do with injecting supplements. It's a specific procedure that is not banned by WADA. Players such as Cooney and N. Riewoldt have used it, and publically talked about it, to try and overcome their respective knee issues.

Comparing that to a suspected doping regime unfair.

My intention wasn't to compare the actual procedure. My intention was to point to the fact that we know Dank and Hird had a conversation, via text about Hawthorn and Collingwood engaging in the top end injection procedures.

My thoughts are that Hird asked Dank, "How can we top this? How can we be better than them?"

And here we are.

My original post was very short and vague. I do apologize

 

[Devington]

My intention wasn't to compare the actual procedure. My intention was to point to the fact that we know Dank and Hird had a conversation, via text about Hawthorn and Collingwood engaging in the top end injection procedures.

My thoughts are that Hird asked Dank, "How can we top this? How can we be better than them?"

And here we are.

My original post was very short and vague. I do apologize

No need to apologise it's a discussion forum, and it's nice to actually discuss and clarify things, instead of the usual troll-bait-spam-koolaid-foamer circlejerk

 

[FuManchu]

that's right

he also is a great guy

Inept, out of his depth, not a man of his convictions, but a great guy!!!!

 

[BlueWorld]

The AFL dropped its charges against Reid. He took them to court when they'd have to REALLY prove their charges and the AFL ran away.

More a case of the AFL not willing to risk things being revealed in court that they'd rather weren't. They like to have absolute control over everything. Hence the negotiated penalties with EFC/ Hird etc. They don't like not having control- ASADA, courts.

 

[BlueWorld]

Didn't Andy D tip you guys off?

The AFL is corrupt. Money talks. Everything is smooth as long as the money comes in.

They will only deal with things if they have to. They knew Essendon were up to something. Probably had a few words in hopes that the club would stop. At that point, maybe they already had. But the damage had already been done.

"Did you inject the players?"
"Yep"
"Oh well. Just don't do it again"

Sad that EFC are trying to get at everyone who tried to help them. The last thing the AFL wanted was a weakened EFC.

 

[The Scales]

Sad that EFC are trying to get at everyone who tried to help them. The last thing the AFL wanted was a weakened EFC.

You are dreaming, aren't you. Does it not weaken a club when you deny them draft picks? When you deny a club the right to participate in a finals campaign? When you stand down a coach? Fine them $2M?

Based on what is in the public domain, the AFL were aware in 2011 of Hird's planned supplement program. The AFL were so concerned they "target tested" EFC players - and requested samples sent to Cologne to specifically examine "exotic" peptites, that ASADA couldn't identify in 2012. Even with the knowlege of zero AAF's ( and despite fears of carcinogens ), the AFL & ASADA failed to caution the EFC of their serious(?) concerns.

Harcourt, in the midst of an on-going investigation, again with zero findings, lectures about the totally awesome cosmic power of the joint investigative process, to the world at large, and the sanctions wrung out of a (still ) innocent club and playing group.

To date, not one doping violation has been sustained by any servant of the EFC. To date I am yet to understand how anyone has helped the EFC. Certainly not with early intervention, or requests for internal audits.

I would like to hear your rationale, as to how anyone helped the EFC, or didn't wish to weaken the club.

At least the EFC did not distribute carcinogens en-masse to the supporter group on an as regular basis as the CFC, we have fewer BBQ's to apologise for our lacklustre performances. Cheers MM.

 

[Big Fozza]

Yep. We didn't keep control of it. We didn't keep good enough records.

We were punished for all that last year.

No. You injected your players with illegal and dangerous substances in a program under the direction of your head coach in an attempt to get an advantage on the competition because your coach was so obsessed with winning he was willing to sacrifice player's health and safety.

Don't give me this we've been punished rubbish. Bad governance pales in comparison to injecting players with illegal and dangerous drugs.

Now EFC is trying to get the evidence thrown out on technicalities. Because they are scared.

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

do you even care if Essendon are guilty of anything? ..player welfare?..

seems essendon are far more concerned with the 'process' rather than the actual charges....

No, they're more concerned with getting off. No matter how.

Whatever it takes.

 

[nineteen eighty]

Yep. We didn't keep control of it. We didn't keep good enough records.

We were punished for all that last year.

Correct. And this time around you will be punished for injecting PED's into the players. Only issue is that it may not be a team punishment per se but rather player punishments with the team to suffer because of these player punishments.

It's the players turn to be thrown under the bus.

 

[nineteen eighty]

Not half as much as the players.

Do you know about the kids of the Algerian soccer team, back when they went on their team-wide doping jaunt ?

And this is my issue with the PED program. The use of off-label, not approved for human use drugs. Run by a farkin madman who didn't care what he was pumping into the players. FFS, he even injected a HGH type PED into a kid who was in remission with cancer. Didn't end well for him.

Interesting read re the Algerian team:

http://www.worldcrunch.com/did-sovi...er-team-into-doping-up-/c3s4124/#.U7WsufmSy5I

You are dreaming, aren't you. Does it not weaken a club when you deny them draft picks? When you deny a club the right to participate in a finals campaign? When you stand down a coach? Fine them $2M?

Based on what is in the public domain, the AFL were aware in 2011 of Hird's planned supplement program. The AFL were so concerned they "target tested" EFC players - and requested samples sent to Cologne to specifically examine "exotic" peptites, that ASADA couldn't identify in 2012. Even with the knowlege of zero AAF's ( and despite fears of carcinogens ), the AFL & ASADA failed to caution the EFC of their serious(?) concerns.

Harcourt, in the midst of an on-going investigation, again with zero findings, lectures about the totally awesome cosmic power of the joint investigative process, to the world at large, and the sanctions wrung out of a (still ) innocent club and playing group.

To date, not one doping violation has been sustained by any servant of the EFC. To date I am yet to understand how anyone has helped the EFC. Certainly not with early intervention, or requests for internal audits.

I would like to hear your rationale, as to how anyone helped the EFC, or didn't wish to weaken the club.

At least the EFC did not distribute carcinogens en-masse to the supporter group on an as regular basis as the CFC, we have fewer BBQ's to apologise for our lacklustre performances. Cheers MM.

Well you've convinced me. EFC are the victims in all of this. All of you internet heroes back the fck away now!

 

[The Scales]

No. You injected your players with illegal and dangerous substances in a program under the direction of your head coach in an attempt to get an advantage on the competition because your coach was so obsessed with winning he was willing to sacrifice player's health and safety.

Don't give me this we've been punished rubbish. Bad governance pales in comparison to injecting players with illegal and dangerous drugs.

Now EFC is trying to get the evidence thrown out on technicalities. Because they are scared.

If the AFL and ASADA were aware that this was occuring, and the players were contracted to the AFL for legal purposes, it was the AFL's responsibility to clarify and / or negate this risky regime.

The AFL were complicit, due to their awaremess (and negative AAF's ) of the program. ASADA were also "in the loop", being requested to send "target tested" samples to Germany for analysis.

Tell me again of the illegality, of the substances used. EFC have been under scrutiny since 2012, without one AAF. Scared of nothing., or no-one.

 

[ManWithNoName]

Correct. And this time around you will be punished for injecting PED's into the players. Only issue is that it may not be a team punishment per se but rather player punishments with the team to suffer because of these player punishments.

It's the players turn to be thrown under the bus.

I didn't realise we had a genuine psychic on BF.

Tell me, will Batman v Superman be any good at all?

 

[FFC_RoyBoys]

.............................

Harcourt, in the midst of an on-going investigation, again with zero findings, lectures about the totally awesome cosmic power of the joint investigative process, to the world at large, and the sanctions wrung out of a (still ) innocent club and playing group.

To date, not one doping violation has been sustained by any servant of the EFC. To date I am yet to understand how anyone has helped the EFC. Certainly not with early intervention, or requests for internal audits.

............................................

Fair enough comment. Harcourt should have probably spoken in far more generic terms, particularly about the way the players went along with the program and which drugs were being used at EFC.

Your beef therefore is with Harcourt and I guess the AFL for allowing him to attend the conference. I would imagine there would be remedies available through the courts. What do you reckon the chances are that either the players or EFC actually take it to court and demand that he show the evidence for his claims?

For myself I reckon it is 0%

 

[jenny61_99]

Hird's too big to touch?

Pray, tell, where has he been for the last year if not coaching us? He's clearly too big to touch therefore he must've got off scotfree and coached us all year, yes?

He's in Paris dear on an all expenses paid, $1 mil in advance, MBA at an elite school holiday. Then apparently coming back to a two year extended contract. Now, what were you saying?

 

[ManWithNoName]

He's in Paris dear on an all expenses paid, $1 mil in advance, MBA at an elite school holiday. Then apparently coming back to a two year extended contract. Now, what were you saying?

So our coach has been unable to coach us for the last year.

Thank you for confirming my point.

 

[jenny61_99]

So our coach has been unable to coach us for the last year.

Thank you for confirming my point.

He shouldn't ever be able to coach again such is the reprehensible doping program he oversaw. Hopefully ASADA will fix that.

 

[ManWithNoName]

He shouldn't ever be able to coach again such is the reprehensible doping program he oversaw. Hopefully ASADA will fix that.

Your views on our coaching appointments are noted and I'll be sure to raise them at this years AGM.

 

[nineteen eighty]

I didn't realise we had a genuine psychic on BF.

Tell me, will Batman v Superman be any good at all?

What's that you say...a man forms an opinion based on information that is in the public domain and seems more than credible. Geez go figure.

Keep fighting the good fight.

EFC is a club with no ethics and no morals. And before you go there, yes the Tigers are shit.

 

[ManWithNoName]

What's that you say...a man forms an opinion based on information that is in the public domain and seems more than credible. Geez go figure.

Keep fighting the good fight.

EFC is a club with no ethics and no morals. And before you go there, yes the Tigers are shit.

Yes but the important question is about Batman v Superman.

And what does Richmond have to do with anything? If you'll find a thread I started on the main board recently you'll see I think extremely highly of Richmond and Jake King in particular.

 

[Mningasimisonda]

You are dreaming, aren't you. Does it not weaken a club when you deny them draft picks? When you deny a club the right to participate in a finals campaign? When you stand down a coach? Fine them $2M?

Based on what is in the public domain, the AFL were aware in 2011 of Hird's planned supplement program. The AFL were so concerned they "target tested" EFC players - and requested samples sent to Cologne to specifically examine "exotic" peptites, that ASADA couldn't identify in 2012. Even with the knowlege of zero AAF's ( and despite fears of carcinogens ), the AFL & ASADA failed to caution the EFC of their serious(?) concerns.

Harcourt, in the midst of an on-going investigation, again with zero findings, lectures about the totally awesome cosmic power of the joint investigative process, to the world at large, and the sanctions wrung out of a (still ) innocent club and playing group.

To date, not one doping violation has been sustained by any servant of the EFC. To date I am yet to understand how anyone has helped the EFC. Certainly not with early intervention, or requests for internal audits.

I would like to hear your rationale, as to how anyone helped the EFC, or didn't wish to weaken the club.

At least the EFC did not distribute carcinogens en-masse to the supporter group on an as regular basis as the CFC, we have fewer BBQ's to apologise for our lacklustre performances. Cheers MM.

The AFL has clearly been in EFC's corner. It is in the AFL's interest to make it look like justice is being served to prevent public backlash, but they really don't want to cripple one of their main money makers.

 

[Catastic82]

I didn't realise we had a genuine psychic on BF.

Tell me, will Batman v Superman be any good at all?

Don't need a psychic for that answer

Although I reckon Aflleck as Bats will be hands down the best bats... Already has the best bats costume on screen.

 

[Thrawn]

The AFL has clearly been in EFC's corner. It is in the AFL's interest to make it look like justice is being served to prevent public backlash, but they really don't want to cripple one of their main money makers.

A convenient excuse for them, then you consider how hard they hit Carlton for doing something far less serious.

 

[Iskender Time]

Your views on our coaching appointments are noted and I'll be sure to raise them at this years AGM.

And I'm sure your repeated views on what someone may discuss on a discussion forum will be given due consideration at the next meeting of those who run these forums.

 

[evo]

Certainly not with early intervention, or requests for internal audits.

What could Doctor Harcourt possibly intervene in regards to? Afterall, you were

innocent

 

[lones37]

If the AFL and ASADA were aware that this was occuring, and the players were contracted to the AFL for legal purposes, it was the AFL's responsibility to clarify and / or negate this risky regime.

The AFL were complicit, due to their awaremess (and negative AAF's ) of the program. ASADA were also "in the loop", being requested to send "target tested" samples to Germany for analysis.

Tell me again of the illegality, of the substances used. EFC have been under scrutiny since 2012, without one AAF. Scared of nothing., or no-one.

For the 20,000th time, there is no test you can do for peptides or HGH.

Why do you think they embarked on this ridiculous campaign in the first place?

They knew it was safe from testing point of view.

Unfortunately for Hird, he hangs around with a convicted criminal, and one who was under surveillance.

So maybe step into the real world, and realise the 31 drugs named weren't made up, its what the players took.