News Harley Bennell - Signed for 2019

fnerd

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Surely there is a specialist with a different kind of treatment in the world who we can send Harley to? I know we sent him to that quack in Germany so why not find someone else. The US must be full of doctors who specialise in this area with the number of sports people they have. Or even here in the UK although he would be more likely to lose his leg.
Yeah this has always been my thinking, mind you you d reckon the club would have at least looked at all possible options (inc over seas)
 

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sherrif

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I’ve been thinking about this whole HB situation.

I’m wondering if we could get a silver lining to assess independently the value our Sports and condition team or stop the thousands of posts on how terrible how S&C either way it’s a win.

So I suggest delist.

3 possible outcomes :

1) If he gets picked up by another club and rehab him to play AFL, we have proven our S&C are terrible and can then replace them

2) If he does get picked and calf blows Freo S&C team keep jobs, no more “Fremantle have the worst S&C team in the universe and Webber has to go” posts

3) doesn’t get picked by another AFL club no more posts on “Bennell is a once in a generation player who will win us a premiership”

Moral of the story. Bennell will be delisted BUT there will be a silver lining.
So the so called best sports calf injury expert in the world couldnt fix the injury but its all on our strength and conditioning staff. There are that many sportspeople who have to retire because of an injury that cant be repaired its ridiculous. Xavier Ellis, Clay Smith, Nick Maxwell, Jason Blake and Justin Leppitsch are just some of the players who have had not been able to overcome calf injuries and return to the field. I guess all of the medicos involved should resign. Some sports injuries cant be fixed no matter how good the treatment or strength and conditioning programs.. Richmond has had a long injury list all year after years of having a good record. That doesnt actually mean their strength and conditioning staff are suddenly doing a worse job either. Injuries happen. The role of strength and conditioning to prevent them is insanely, gigantically overrated on here. Strength and conditioning programs play a role in injury management, but luck still has a ton more to do with injuries than anything else. There are also teams like Adelaide who have had a worse record of injury than us in recent years. That doesnt mean our sports science people are better than the Adelaide staff either.

If you want any more evidence that sometimes the best sports science and conditioning still cant fix some calf injuries click on the link below:
https://www.complex.com/sports/2012...-by-injury/sports-careers-ruined-by-injury-25

Even NBA superstars like Grant Hill, Penny Hardaway and Tracy McCgrady with the best strength and conditioning money can buy werent able to fix calf injuries. The choice and precision of the surgeon who completes the operation is also way more important than the strength and conditioning team to begin with. Id be way more interested in finding out the surgeons Hawthorn uses for calves and hamstrings then their strength and conditioning practice. The extent of a calf injury can also vary greatly, resulting in some injuries being able to repair easily and some injuries being very difficult to fix.

Most sports scientists also believe genetics plays a role in injury recovery.
https://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2015/02/the-genetics-of-being-injury-prone/385257/

Overall, if you want to look for a scapegoat for injuries go for it. Just know the reality is that some injuries are unable to be fixed even if the best sports science and conditioning practices in the world ate implemented.
 
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RonnieRaven

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This board is a lot like Carlton boards
Potential, promising , could be, hope.
We’ve been through the **** over the 25 years and those words have helped us get through but we need to be real now trust the players on the park.
Harley has the rest of the year to play four best 22 games in the afl forget about 2014 HB when pav and McPharlin were still playing football.
Ive live all around the country there’s a plethora of ridiculously skilled players but physically or mentally they can’t play afl
Unless he can pull a rabbit out of a hat
We say goodbye knowing we have put in 4 years of time effort and money to try and get the best of Harley I’m not sure he has replicated the effort or commitment he has received but it is what it is
Good luck Harley
 

Frigate

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This board is a lot like Carlton boards
Potential, promising , could be, hope.
We’ve been through the **** over the 25 years and those words have helped us get through but we need to be real now trust the players on the park.
Harley has the rest of the year to play four best 22 games in the afl forget about 2014 HB when pav and McPharlin were still playing football.
Ive live all around the country there’s a plethora of ridiculously skilled players but physically or mentally they can’t play afl
Unless he can pull a rabbit out of a hat
We say goodbye knowing we have put in 4 years of time effort and money to try and get the best of Harley I’m not sure he has replicated the effort or commitment he has received but it is what it is
Good luck Harley
Believe it not, age is a factor when you look at these things. Harley is 26. He "could" have 10 years of footy left in him. He led his junior side at 15 to a premiership. Under 18 championships - Lake Medal - best in the whole tournament. Number 2 draft pick. Thanks Wiki.

Freo get this dude and the fans want to move him on to draft a WAFL play that might be ok -is this new meta? what TF are we talking about. This thread is crazy.

Simplify. You have the best junior kid in the country on your list- Tick yes. He is under 30 - tick yes. He has been best on ground on multiple occasions in the past year for "seconds or WAFL" - another tick.

Negative - he cannot get his body right, and keeps getting injured so he is a waste of space on our list. Maybe. maybe.
Here are the players I would drop before a 20% chance of Harley playing again (no order):
1. Mitchell Crowden
2. Lachie Schultz
3. Lloyd Meek

I appreciate the fact that they made it, and they are good, however I cannot see them in a winning Freo team.

I just want to know - is it possible that Bennell plays again? Why do the Eagles persist with Nic Nat? I get that Bennell has not played many games, but we all surely can understand he has been close to a recall. He has ticked every box - and that is the frustration. Maybe, maybe if us fans can let go of a second pick for him (which was nothing in that year), and we take the pressure off - maybe he will be ok. I want Harley to be ok. I think if he is playing footy this will happen, and I will be ok if I am watching him play - because I like watching him play.
 

Superkoops

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Harley is 27 in Oct, so you think he could be playing still in the year he turns 37? He is having endless soft tissue issues in his mid twenties - I can assure you from experience that is only going to get worse.

People keep referring to his talent as a junior and what he showed on the park back in 2012-2014. We’re talking 5-6 years ago.

Last season and I saw or listened to lot of HB and the WAFL he was best on ground in 1 or maybe 2 games. He played in 10 and 2-3 of them he came off injured or with awareness/tightness and his first 3-4 games were on managed time.

One of the games (his 9th from memory) that was his best against West Perth he played very well but aggravated his calf late into 4th quarter. Tightness they said. He had a couple of weeks off and tried another comeback to last less than a half and be done for the season.

I’m on the record after his most recent lower leg problem as saying let him see what he can do over the next 6 weeks before making a decision on him for the year. It appears that the most recent lower leg problem was more Achilles related and he is close to making a comeback - great.

He will need to show in the WAFL that he can play full game without injury, exacerbation or the dreaded awareness. Yes he has exquisite skills but his body in my opinion isn’t up to it. Long shot to play beyond this season let alone 10 more.

Also Crowden just came off a 27 possession and 12 tackle game for Peel. His skills under pressure are a work in progress but he is making progress. Schultz has played 3 games in 2019 which is more than HB has played in the last 4 AFL seasons. He is a nuggety type that isn’t a true AFL fwd pocket prob more a HFF that can push into the midfield. The criticism of him has been harsh. Meek I 100% agree but he isn’t injured. Nick Natanui whilst overrated has managed to play 161 games.

None of these guys went on a bender the night before the first day of a preseason training and not show up at all.

So very likely we won’t participate in the mid-season draft but I 100% agree with Ronnie - HB from 5 seasons ago is a very different proposition to the one we have in 2019. He needs to play solid 4 quarter games in the WAFL and at least be in a position to play AFL. Anything less and he needs to be cut.


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RonnieRaven

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Believe it not, age is a factor when you look at these things. Harley is 26. He "could" have 10 years of footy left in him. He led his junior side at 15 to a premiership. Under 18 championships - Lake Medal - best in the whole tournament. Number 2 draft pick. Thanks Wiki.

Freo get this dude and the fans want to move him on to draft a WAFL play that might be ok -is this new meta? what TF are we talking about. This thread is crazy.

Simplify. You have the best junior kid in the country on your list- Tick yes. He is under 30 - tick yes. He has been best on ground on multiple occasions in the past year for "seconds or WAFL" - another tick.

Negative - he cannot get his body right, and keeps getting injured so he is a waste of space on our list. Maybe. maybe.
Here are the players I would drop before a 20% chance of Harley playing again (no order):
1. Mitchell Crowden
2. Lachie Schultz
3. Lloyd Meek

I appreciate the fact that they made it, and they are good, however I cannot see them in a winning Freo team.

I just want to know - is it possible that Bennell plays again? Why do the Eagles persist with Nic Nat? I get that Bennell has not played many games, but we all surely can understand he has been close to a recall. He has ticked every box - and that is the frustration. Maybe, maybe if us fans can let go of a second pick for him (which was nothing in that year), and we take the pressure off - maybe he will be ok. I want Harley to be ok. I think if he is playing footy this will happen, and I will be ok if I am watching him play - because I like watching him play.
Yes I’m glad you highlighted one of the words “could” helps a narrative of a blind optimist my thinking for Harley and the club in my post was fair reasonable
Saying a bloke who’s not playing, has never played a full afl season and has played 2 or 3 games in 4 years I can’t remember them can play for 10 years is Fanciful and reiterates the first lines of my initial post
 

salim malik

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Harley is 27 in Oct, so you think he could be playing still in the year he turns 37? He is having endless soft tissue issues in his mid twenties - I can assure you from experience that is only going to get worse.

People keep referring to his talent as a junior and what he showed on the park back in 2012-2014. We’re talking 5-6 years ago.

Last season and I saw or listened to lot of HB and the WAFL he was best on ground in 1 or maybe 2 games. He played in 10 and 2-3 of them he came off injured or with awareness/tightness and his first 3-4 games were on managed time.

One of the games (his 9th from memory) that was his best against West Perth he played very well but aggravated his calf late into 4th quarter. Tightness they said. He had a couple of weeks off and tried another comeback to last less than a half and be done for the season.

I’m on the record after his most recent lower leg problem as saying let him see what he can do over the next 6 weeks before making a decision on him for the year. It appears that the most recent lower leg problem was more Achilles related and he is close to making a comeback - great.

He will need to show in the WAFL that he can play full game without injury, exacerbation or the dreaded awareness. Yes he has exquisite skills but his body in my opinion isn’t up to it. Long shot to play beyond this season let alone 10 more.

Also Crowden just came off a 27 possession and 12 tackle game for Peel. His skills under pressure are a work in progress but he is making progress. Schultz has played 3 games in 2019 which is more than HB has played in the last 4 AFL seasons. He is a nuggety type that isn’t a true AFL fwd pocket prob more a HFF that can push into the midfield. The criticism of him has been harsh. Meek I 100% agree but he isn’t injured. Nick Natanui whilst overrated has managed to play 161 games.

None of these guys went on a bender the night before the first day of a preseason training and not show up at all.

So very likely we won’t participate in the mid-season draft but I 100% agree with Ronnie - HB from 5 seasons ago is a very different proposition to the one we have in 2019. He needs to play solid 4 quarter games in the WAFL and at least be in a position to play AFL. Anything less and he needs to be cut.


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Crowden had 27 possessions? I was at the game and hardly noticed any of them. Harley gets 10 and you sure as hell remember every one of them. Not to disrespect Crowden but he is chalk to Harleys cheese.
 

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Jezzitizle

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Crowden had 27 possessions? I was at the game and hardly noticed any of them. Harley gets 10 and you sure as hell remember every one of them. Not to disrespect Crowden but he is chalk to Harleys cheese.
We’re like gamblers who are chasing our losses, it’s time to leave the table.

It’s such a shame, like losing Shane Yarran who could have been anything.
 

Nodgey

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The only way Harley will forge out a career with us is if his calves are actually fine, and this has all been an expertly implemented ruse to disguise a long suspension..... i.e. no way at all. It’s a tragic, but he’s cooked.
 

Docker82

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There’s no way you drop Crowden or Schultz from the list before Bennell.

Crowden didn’t show a lot in his first year but neither have plenty of others - whys he the one getting singled out. His WAFL stats are quite encouraging.

Schultz had one good AFL game in round one and two game AFL games later he’s been written off as delist material. There’s plenty of half forwards with average skills getting games around the league...
 

Superkoops

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Crowden had 27 possessions? I was at the game and hardly noticed any of them. Harley gets 10 and you sure as hell remember every one of them. Not to disrespect Crowden but he is chalk to Harleys cheese.
Fair enough sometimes that isn’t a good measure. Don’t get me wrong though Crowden has a way to go but from what I have seen he is trending albeit slowly in the right direction.

I’ve been to the last 3 home games where we have played Collingwood and each time I feel like I haven’t noticed Steel Sidebottom at all yet I check the stats and he has disposed of the ball 40 times. Crowden has a genuine dip. Makes a few bad disposals but obviously gets another 20 that go relatively unnoticed.

HB reminds me of a dreadful penny stock that was purchased at a mid range price but was all the rage to go gangbusters. For my example let’s call HB Carnegie Clean energy. Everyone was excited at first but Carnegie (HB) failed to deliver, struck some issues (ie got injured), missed out on government funding and went into administration (due to consistent calf issues that can’t be fixed). Anyway the stock value is so low now at 3 cents, everyone says why not keep Carnegie (HB) it will surely bounce back to that potential when we first bought yet everything points to that never happening due to damaged goods. So Fremantle hang onto Carnegie (HB) with unfounded hope that never reaps a return on investment.


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Cesoir

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Fair enough sometimes that isn’t a good measure. Don’t get me wrong though Crowden has a way to go but from what I have seen he is trending albeit slowly in the right direction.

I’ve been to the last 3 home games where we have played Collingwood and each time I feel like I haven’t noticed Steel Sidebottom at all yet I check the stats and he has disposed of the ball 40 times. Crowden has a genuine dip. Makes a few bad disposals but obviously gets another 20 that go relatively unnoticed.

HB reminds me of a dreadful penny stock that was purchased at a mid range price but was all the rage to go gangbusters. For my example let’s call HB Carnegie Clean energy. Everyone was excited at first but Carnegie (HB) failed to deliver, struck some issues (ie got injured), missed out on government funding and went into administration (due to consistent calf issues that can’t be fixed). Anyway the stock value is so low now at 3 cents, everyone says why not keep Carnegie (HB) it will surely bounce back to that potential when we first bought yet everything points to that never happening due to damaged goods. So Fremantle hang onto Carnegie (HB) with unfounded hope that never reaps a return on investment.


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This is not intended in any way to support or oppose the delist Harley argument, but I just want to say something about Crowden. For me he epitomises the issues we have with our list currently - we have far too many players who try hard but just don't have the skills / weapons to be game breakers. Crowden is short (not strong overhead), slow (regularly gets caught holding the ball - think Nick Suban) and very, very one-sided which again makes him easy to corral and tackle. You can afford to have one or two of these types playing a role in a really good side, but we have WAY too many B and C graders and not enough A graders.

Please let us have Blakely, Hill and Logue (trust me on this one) back in the side soon!
 
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Not bothering getting my hopes up, expecting us to probably resign him for a year but unsure if he will ever pull on the purple again.
I'd think we would need to see something like 5 afl games and a couple of those at a high level to re-sign him (and being fit at the end of the year will help)
 

theGav56

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There’s no way you drop Crowden or Schultz from the list before Bennell.

Crowden didn’t show a lot in his first year but neither have plenty of others - whys he the one getting singled out. His WAFL stats are quite encouraging.

Schultz had one good AFL game in round one and two game AFL games later he’s been written off as delist material. There’s plenty of half forwards with average skills getting games around the league...
What I would really like is....

..... draft in Serong and Henry and play them as electric, aggressive, smart, small forwards who one day will have the fitness to roll midfield like Walters.

Develop Sturt's fitness and prime him for an early 2020 debut (perhaps a late game or two this season).
 
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