Hawks' scoring issues.

A Cut Above

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Thread starter #1
We're only seven games into the season, but thus far our highest score has been 93 points against Carlton which is an issue because many of our easiest matchups for the year we've already played. Of the games remaining, our best chances to crack the ton should be at home against Freo in round 17 and GC in round 22.

Admittedly its a low-scoring year, but does it surprise you we're struggling to score to this extent with forwards including Bruest, Gunston, Roughead, Puopolo & Wingard? Yes two are not the players they were and one is struggling to adjust to a new system, but lack of talent shouldn't be the problem. Is it our depleted midfield? We're still averaging 52 i50s a game so the ball's down there often enough even if the quality of supply isn't top shelf.

Here's my concern - that we're playing a system which is overly cautious and defensive and doesn't look remotely like producing more than 100 points. Perhaps Clarko is worried we don't have the midfield talent to win a shootout, but we don't have a stingy enough defense for our 'minimal risk' strategy to work either.
With Smith, Henderson, Scully & Impey surely we should be exploiting our running power much more and playing a freer brand of attacking football. Obviously that's easier said than done but so far the team has generally played slow, unimaginative and uninspired football.

We're by no means the worst scoring team, averaging 83 points which is 8th highest. Our scoring levels have also been consistent and we've kept every game fairly close. I worry though that we lack spark and look overcoached, playing a brand designed to minimize damage that our attacking players are struggling under. Or perhaps we're simply light on talent and our expectations need to drop accordingly.
 

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lickmerocks

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#4
At the start of games we seem to have some sort of structure.

The moment fatigue sets in our structure forward of centre goes missing and we cannot connect up when we win the ball. This starts from HB and we are constantly stopping and going back and around the cape to try and move it forward and it’s terrible to watch.

Stratton as skipper needs to set an example and play on quicker and get the ball moving rather than stopping and going backwards with a soft safety kick.
 

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I miss the days when we use to stop teams from exiting their D50 for what seems like eternity and repeatedly!
Great point, we've become reliant on locking the ball inside 50 to score and the new kickout rule has made that much harder to do.
 

Judd2Sewell

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#7
We move the ball so painfully slow. If we had big contested pack marking forwards we may be able to get away with our poor bombs-away gamestyle.

But we don't. We have no real contested marking forwards bar the green Lewis.

Instead, and obviously, we should be moving the ball quickly as that is what our best forwards - Breust, Wingard and Gunston thrive on.

Until we change this we will struggle to crack 90 points each game.
 
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#9
From the bits and pieces of hawthorn i hav seen this year i hav not seen them with a plan to get the ball back in as fast a possible from an oppositions point. If there has been a play on we get 3 steps and a 10 meter kick to the pocket. Surely there are plans in place for this. Unfortunately yesterday everyone went missing on the same day.

With the ever ageing list we hav i cannot see the next big forward or defensive beast on our list yet. I'm sure we hav the crumbers but none of the big men seem to just compete and keep the ball in play. I hav seen many blocks and hold on our forwards and some teams are allowed to do this and do it well.
 
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#10
imho
1 - We are doing too much bombing on top of the forwards heads.
2 - We are dropping too many marks, some of them onto the chest.
3 - Our accuracy from set shots is appalling, has been for some time, and might be getting worse.

Just my 2c.

I'm some what bouyed by Mitch Lewis also. If we can put a few KG onto Jackson Ross, maybe we can start something new.
 

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Charchi

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#15
Two things I would like to see:
1) always have a forward leading out of the goalsquare, it gives us something to kick too and pulls the opposition defender back, our current game style of long bomb and hope snap a goal is appalling. We have plenty of talent forward, it is just not being used to our advantage and seeing a player of Poppy's height trying to outmark two defenders is just plain embarrassing;
2) play Hardwick on the ball, we are screaming out for some talent in the centre, his body is mature enough, he has the grunt and can kick well. Has he got the tank, we have 80 interchanges a game, have a 5 minute rest and get back out there.
 
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#17
IMO there seems to be an overall lack of confidence in the team currently. It shows in the stunted, slow defensive game style the team is currently using. Very rarely do you see someone attempt the riskier kick to a target in the corridor, nor do you see players upfield of the kicker making themselves an option through the corridor. It all seems to be kicks to big contests down the wing or backwards , cross field then down the other wing with very little done at pace. The quickest plays have been those that have come about from oppo turnovers and then the quick transition back to our empty forward line due to there being such a high press, sure this sometimes results in scores but often results in the quick play being broken up by there being no options in front of the ball carrier. The slow play enables the oppo to roll back into our f50 too easily also, they clog up the space, our forwards can’t find a space to lead into and the the only option is.... the high long bomb and hope for the best. Opening the game up and trying to play with pace can only be beneficial surely, it brings Smith,Hendo and Scully into the game, opens up space for Impeys dash and presumably leads to a more open forward line where forwards can lead at the ball carrier making his job easier also.
 

rogiebear93

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#18
Our forward line are struggling to work together, all leading to the same spots and congesting hot spots. Everyone goes to the ball.

A good forward line needs to have players leading in different directions to separate defenders and allow some room to move.

Give the kicker some options.
 

Roger Rogerson

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#19
Number 1 issue for us is our lack of ability to regularly win the ball whether contested, loose or in the air.

Desperately need another major ball winner in the midfield. When fit Wingard will help. Glass looks to be the other option. Other than that we would need to experiment with someone like a Hardwick or do I dare say Sicily as a tall ruck rover. Might make him get out of his comfort zone a bit more.

Getting Cuz back this week's helps if he played last sat we win.
 

Mrzohs

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#20
James Sicily plays in defence!

You have to break it down , Scoring issues start with the ball before you enter the 50meter arc, Then once your inside your 50 meter arc.

#1 with the ball
Slow ball movement across the ground,
There is no overlap run from defence, we often play 2 key defenders and Stratton, That's 3 blokes out of our back 6 who create limited run, j.sicily is a elite ball user and gains meters to advantage with kicking not running.
B.Stratton must play as the 2nd tall with this setup.

In the midfield we don't use our outside run! We Have Slow ball movement, Tend to kick high and long into our forward line!
We have no reliable tall targets and often kick long to a small target double teamed.

Inside our 50.
Roughy and Poppy are past there best.
Gunston gets moved around more than a kid in a candy store.

What's going wrong?
A few things our talls don't take marks and often get out marked.
Our smalls are often the deepest target.
There is no space,no leads, no chemistry our most dangerous forwards are up the ground rather than isolated deep in the goal square.
 
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4THAWN

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#23
Two things I would like to see:
1) always have a forward leading out of the goalsquare, it gives us something to kick too and pulls the opposition defender back, our current game style of long bomb and hope snap a goal is appalling. We have plenty of talent forward, it is just not being used to our advantage and seeing a player of Poppy's height trying to outmark two defenders is just plain embarrassing;
2) play Hardwick on the ball, we are screaming out for some talent in the centre, his body is mature enough, he has the grunt and can kick well. Has he got the tank, we have 80 interchanges a game, have a 5 minute rest and get back out there.
not sure if dimma would be a good midfield fit. Drafted as a dominant forward and now playing in defense. Would probably say Impey is a better midfield choice.
 

QuietB

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#24
Hawthorn are not that good anymore. It is that simple. As a result they have to commit more resources to defending to be competitive and that means less scoring.

2011 - 2355 points for
2012 - 2679
2013 - 2523
2014 - 2458
2015 - 2452
2016 - 2134
2017 - 1864
2018 - 1972

Hawthorn were scoring approx. 25% more when they were approx. 25% better :D
 

seysearles

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#25
What scares/confuses me about this season is that we are a worse team (performance wise) than last season and yet we have so many players having breakout years or their best seasons for the club...

Henderson
O'Meara
Worpell
McEvoy
Impey
Lewis
Scrimshaw
Sicily

Arguably....
Shiels
Ceglar
Moore
Cousins
 
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