Preview Hawks vs Saints Sat 29 Apr 1:45pm at UniTAS stadium

[mighty_sainters]

I would only bring Paddy back if there's no plan on dropping him again even if he has a sub par performance. He hasn't had a stand out game since heading back to the VFL so to reward him already isn't showing much thought.

If he comes in then we keep him in for a good month to work in to some form.

 

[Joffaboy]

I can't understand why we aren't all employed as selection and coaching advisors at AFL clubs to be honest...

I reckon it is all the fault of North getting a stand alone VFL team to be honest....

 

[VDS66]

I reckon it is all the fault of North getting a stand alone VFL team to be honest....

I'm very jealous of that.

 

[Stewart66]

I can't understand why supports keep calling for wholesale changes to the squad, re White, Marshall,Rice so on and so on while the side is still a realistic chance to make the 8, remembering we are only 5 rounds down we win this week it's back to 50/50 win loss ratio, if we are out of contention by round 15/16 then you start to filter these guy's through realistically we have been in every game this year bar a 15-20 min spell per game.

White can kick the ball to targets will only get better with every game played.

Rice can kick the ball will only get better with every game played.

Marshall can both Mark the ball & kick the ball, helps structure by keeping our forwards deep .

Sinclair can kick the ball and play midfield Weller , Long , Gresham , Minchington , Acres are not being played
in midfield , we play the same group they get tired and run out of legs


You need to integrate young players

 

[Saintos The ITK]

I tend to think it's just a matter, both physical and then mental, of just putting it all together. I think the game plan has been changed somewhat to try to fix a problem from last year which contributed to us missing finals - we didn't translate onfield dominance into scoreboard dominance well enough. That has produced a side effect - we can't seem to stop a run from our opposition. If we do it this week, knowing Hawthorn have and can be opened up, then things may fall into place. We actually have a lot going for us this weekend - Hawthorn are on their second six day break, they are not a fast side, they don't have a good tap ruckman or a deep midfield, and the big ground will suit some players more than Etihad (Billings, Newnes, Roberton).

I think for this week Gilbert as second ruckman is worth a try. He will absolutely get around the ground - it's just a matter of how bad the ruckwork is. But comparing that output to Bruce means it doesn't have far to fall.

We didn't beat the goldie last year when we really should have.
For a team that needed to win that game to make the finals it was a shocking performance.
That's what we need to overcome , these games where we just don't turn up to play for some reason.
We can have the best game plan and players but if we don't want it we're no chance. The way to fix that is to drive home some reality to some of the boys of the opportunity they have. In other words a decent kick up the date.

 

[The Punter]

We didn't beat the goldie last year when we really should have.
For a team that needed to win that game to make the finals it was a shocking performance.
That's what we need to overcome , these games where we just don't turn up to play for some reason.
We can have the best game plan and players but if we don't want it we're no chance. The way to fix that is to drive home some reality to some of the boys of the opportunity they have. In other words a decent kick up the date.

The GC game last year was a classic let down game and an immature performance. But if we had played in that fortnight more to ladder position, we would have beaten GC and lost to Geelong - same ladder result.

 

[saint_]

A lot at stake on this game. Lose to Hawthorn and finals are unlikely, but what could also be a tricky conundrum is if we stagnate this year. Would be interesting if it effects us bringing in a free agent, if we don't improve our record from last year.
To be a good or a better side, we need to win these games if we are fair dinkum of playing finals. Not saying it is easy though.

 

[StCicatriz]

We have had the ascendency at some point in every match this year. No need for drastic changes as the plan is working.

Need consistency however across each line as our midfield is weaker. Before anyone starts our midfielders have developed. Look at Ross acres etc.

We just need more in the way of top end mids. Will be sorted by year's end.

Expect a win this week. I have a feel piggy mccartin plays.

Is it a smaller ground that could suit paddy a bit better?

 

[JG22]

Round 2, Adelaide took 22 to 6 contested marks against Hawthorn. And took 17 marks inside 50.

Yes it's greatly affected by midfield and pressure put on the kicker but is an area we can get at Hawthorn.

McCartin obviously has that ability, add to that he played well last year down there. Can understand either way if we don't want him back yet though.

 

[PrinceofSeaford]

this week is a must win. lose and suddenly we could be 2-5 come the end of next week after we play the giants. frankly if we don't win, i don't think we deserve to be there anyway. having said that I'm fairly confident we will bounce back going into this one.

i have a feeling paddy will come back this week. played well against the hawks last year and they're a team that struggles to defend opposition with big marking targets up forward.

for mine its
out- Long and Dustan
in- Paddy and 1 of Stevens or Sinclair

really hoping Weller has a big game this week. been down on form for the most part of this year

 

[Dr Spaceman]

I can't understand why we aren't all employed as selection and coaching advisors at AFL clubs to be honest...

We are.

It's just that we all voted against including you

 

[Saintos The ITK]

The GC game last year was a classic let down game and an immature performance. But if we had played in that fortnight more to ladder position, we would have beaten GC and lost to Geelong - same ladder result.

Spot on.
If we stop letting ourselves down with those type of games we'll go ok.

 

[IllBeTheJudge]

Easy to call for changes considering how disappointed we all are with the result on the weekend, not to mention the season to date. Looking at it from a positive point of view though, we stuck with who are likely to be a top 4 team until pretty well the last quarter. This is despite a low output from Dunstan, Gresham, Long, Bruce and Longer (second half especially).

In other games this season it's been a goal kicking that has severely let us down.

Although I think changes are warranted, it still feels as though we are not far away from a stellar performance. We had a really good performance against West Coast, for example, but lost the game on poor kicking for goal.

A Hawks team with renewed confidence will be very dangerous I feel.

As much as Dunstan is getting bashed around here, if you're not getting the pill you at least need to be doing something good when you do have it; and he did set up one of Minchington's goals and kicked another himself. Still, 11 possies isn't enough for a starting mid, and he didn't do enough without the ball (2 tackles, 1x 1%er).

OUTS
Long, Dunstan

INS
Sinclair, Stevens (assuming passed fit)

 

[Barrels]

I'm very jealous of that.

Reckon it's bothered Hawthorn heaps over the last decade...

 

[Joffaboy]

I'm very jealous of that.

Well I for one am ******* ropable. How can I face the hordes of North supporters now?

 

[CanadianSaint]

Billings survives, he plays well against the hawks.. his average this year of 65% d.e is a worry for this year as we need outside players to be closer to 80%, Shane savage territory. Petracca has 71% d.e and the same avg possessions as billings of 20 in his second year. Is it our kamikaze gameplan? On tv last night they said that jack Riewoldt spent hours and 500 practise shots during training.. last night he kicked straight in the rain... do we need to practise kicking skills more, or is it our composure and lack of holding onto the ball? We also have poor handpass skills, when is the last time we saw a chain of bullet hand passes. We seem to miss easy handpass targets 2 metres away. I reckon we have the forwards andbacks.. just the mid clearances, contested...and outside spread with d.e.

Unless we fix this I can't see us beating the dorks.


On iPad using BigFooty.com mobile app

Sav's kicking efficiency is high because he kicks long to packs every time, he rarely tries to pin point a pass. Billings is trying to make game breaking passes all the time, and his kick efficiency is low because he is trying to hard. He will get there.

This is a great example of how stats can be misleading. When you kick long to pack, even if you kick it to a three on one not in your favour, or not to advantage, you are given an effective kick. It doesnt matter what happens next, the ball can get picked up by an opposition player and run the length of the ground for a goal against you, its still an effective disposal.

Also, this is why Acres disposal efficiency is high at the moment. He's been kicking long a lot recently. His disposal has improved, but not to the number he has at the moment.

 

[IllBeTheJudge]

Sav's kicking efficiency is high because he kicks long to packs every time, he rarely tries to pin point a pass. Billings is trying to make game breaking passes all the time, and his kick efficiency is low because he is trying to hard. He will get there.

This is a great example of how stats can be misleading. When you kick long to pack, even if you kick it to a three on one not in your favour, or not to advantage, you are given an effective kick. It doesnt matter what happens next, the ball can get picked up by an opposition player and run the length of the ground for a goal against you, its still an effective disposal.

Also, this is why Acres disposal efficiency is high at the moment. He's been kicking long a lot recently. His disposal has improved, but not to the number he has at the moment.

That seems weird. I have always thought an effective kick (or effective disposal) meant your own team gained possession from said disposal (eg. it might have been kicked to a pack, but one of your own team plucked it, or gained possession as the outcome).

DE is a bit overrated for mine at any rate. Just because I handpassed it to you and you gained possession (effective disposal to me, yay) doesn't look at the fact it was a hospital pass, you got crunched, turned the ball over.

 

[Persevering Saint]

We are.

It's just that we all voted against including you

Now, now, I voted for you VDS66 ... but nobody ever takes my selection suggestions seriously, even for the selection of the selection committee.

 

[CanadianSaint]

That seems weird. I have always thought an effective kick (or effective disposal) meant your own team gained possession from said disposal (eg. it might have been kicked to a pack, but one of your own team plucked it, or gained possession as the outcome).

DE is a bit overrated for mine at any rate. Just because I handpassed it to you and you gained possession (effective disposal to me, yay) doesn't look at the fact it was a hospital pass, you got crunched, turned the ball over.

I believe a +40 metre kick (and lets face it 90% of Savs are) has to be to a 50/50 contest. That could still be a 1 on 3, as long as two ground players are in the 5 metre area of a player.

Regardless, Im with you. Kicking efficiency is highly overrated. Good kicks are both players that hit a lot of players up, and players who make amazing kicks.

 

[Rors]

That seems weird. I have always thought an effective kick (or effective disposal) meant your own team gained possession from said disposal (eg. it might have been kicked to a pack, but one of your own team plucked it, or gained possession as the outcome).

DE is a bit overrated for mine at any rate. Just because I handpassed it to you and you gained possession (effective disposal to me, yay) doesn't look at the fact it was a hospital pass, you got crunched, turned the ball over.

A kick longer than 40m is considered an effective disposal due to metres gained, unless it is marked directly by the opposition

 

[gringo2011]

We have had the ascendency at some point in every match this year. No need for drastic changes as the plan is working.

Need consistency however across each line as our midfield is weaker. Before anyone starts our midfielders have developed. Look at Ross acres etc.

We just need more in the way of top end mids. Will be sorted by year's end.

Expect a win this week. I have a feel piggy mccartin plays.

I reckon Ross and Robbo are the only players on the list that are playing better than last year. Acres was about the same towards the end of 2016. I reckon we should be expecting a win but I can't say I'm as confident. If I didn't hate WCE enough they played the Hawks into form.

 

[IllBeTheJudge]

A kick longer than 40m is considered an effective disposal due to metres gained, unless it is marked directly by the opposition

Thanks for the explanation, honestly didn't know that

That being the case, it only emboldens my opinion that DE is overrated

 

[gringo2011]

Thanks for the explanation, honestly didn't know that

That being the case, it only emboldens my opinion that DE is overrated

Contested possession is pretty loose too. It's only got to have a player with in a certain distance. With the way they play in close these days half the possessions are contested.

 

[Rors]

Contested possession is pretty loose too. It's only got to have a player with in a certain distance. With the way they play in close these days half the possessions are contested.

Contested possession literally means exactly that - taken possession of the ball in a contested situation....

No 'disposal' is then required to notch up a contested, or even uncontested for that matter, possession

You could be tackled after grabbing the ball in a contested situation & the balls spills free 10 times - you'd have 10 contested possessions, but 0 disposals

 

[SaintsSeptember]

Contested possession is pretty loose too. It's only got to have a player with in a certain distance. With the way they play in close these days half the possessions are contested.

So why does Joel Selwood get a lot and Seb Ross not?