Hawks want a ruckman for Chick or NO DEAL!

[Jars458]

Originally posted by Mcchawk
]

Wet Toast

Does ANYONE think that's funny?

 

[Pessimistic]

Originally posted by Jabber


He already has. You seem to be forgetting he has already left Hawthorn - not coming back. He was quite adamant about it - even prepared to quit on 149 games. Regardless of what he does next year, he will not be a Hawk.

Amazing how you know so much from 4000km away. Truth is his 'destination' is the USA. The plan is to spend the rest of his career in WA so that his family can see his son for a few years. I doubt even his parents would be pushing him to give up his career (or even play in the WAFL, which is where you eagles fans seem to be rating him) on that basis.

Of course his brother has died tragically in the meantime so It could all be different.

Now plenty of Hawks fans have been critical on the web but when this news came out some even said let him go for no trade, He is well thought of at hawthorn.
I ge the impression you eagles have quietly thought "beauty, now we can play even harder in the trade"
He is also quite well paid - would you eagles fans exploit his situation and give him a pay cut too ?

Personally I think the AFL should be able to step in in these circumstances and allow the move to happen regardless of whether a trade can be made. I'm sure any other employer would under the circumstances.

 

[Jabber]

Originally posted by Pessimistic


Amazing how you know so much from 4000km away. Truth is his 'destination' is the USA. The plan is to spend the rest of his career in WA so that his family can see his son for a few years. I doubt even his parents would be pushing him to give up his career (or even play in the WAFL, which is where you eagles fans seem to be rating him) on that basis.

Of course his brother has died tragically in the meantime so It could all be different.

Now plenty of Hawks fans have been critical on the web but when this news came out some even said let him go for no trade, He is well thought of at hawthorn.
I ge the impression you eagles have quietly thought "beauty, now we can play even harder in the trade"
He is also quite well paid - would you eagles fans exploit his situation and give him a pay cut too ?

Personally I think the AFL should be able to step in in these circumstances and allow the move to happen regardless of whether a trade can be made. I'm sure any other employer would under the circumstances.

For starters where do you get the idea I live 4000km away - I live in Melbourne, and I never claimed to know anything more about Chicks situation than what he has already said in a television interview.

The Eagles will play hard in a trade just like every other club does. The fact remains Hawthorn start from a very weak bargaining position - For them to demand Gardiner or Cox for Chick is ridiculous, and they will just end up looking stupid when it doesn't come off.

 

[Captain Random]

Originally posted by Pessimistic

I ge the impression you eagles have quietly thought "beauty, now we can play even harder in the trade"
He is also quite well paid - would you eagles fans exploit his situation and give him a pay cut too ?

You're misconstruing the position. As you've no doubt noticed from reading our board, we'd be happy to get him, but he is not a required player by any means - we already have the makings of a very tidy midfield. Hawthorn, however, don't want to contemplate losing another player for stuff-all, and won't let him go without a fight. The chances of that happening have now increased considerably.

So who is playing hardball here? The Eagles, who are being asked to trade a required ruckman for a merely desirable midfielder? Or Hawthorn, who have to go in hard or face the wrath of their supporters over another McPharlin-style disaster?

Anyway, you appear to be forgetting that, unfortunate as recent events have been, Chick himself exploited his situation to ramp up his income in his previous contract negotiations with Hawthorn. And Hawthorn don't exactly have clean hands when it comes to playing hardball with reluctant players - ask Paul Harding about that.

 

[The Mailman]

I think a three way trade between the Hawks, a WA club and another club seems likely for the Chick situation.
But for Pete's sake, the Hawks surely should do the right thing and trade him back to perth, even if they get a dodgy deal in return. His brother has just passed away for Pete's sake and his parents probably need him there at this stage of their lives.

 

[Danny Chook Fan Club]

Harding was a much different situation. He was a contracted Hawthorn player, and was seeking to breach that contract. The same with Gary Buckenara.

The only similarity between the 1987 problems and this one is that Hawthorn once again face losing players interstate for nothing.

If we were one of the favoured few, the AFL would grant us extra salary cap space and/or compensatory draft picks. But then, the AFL has tried to kill us, rather than prop us up, in the past, so I guess we shouldn't expect the same treatment as our other 'equal' partners in this league.

 

[Danny Chook Fan Club]

Originally posted by The Mailman
I think a three way trade between the Hawks, a WA club and another club seems likely for the Chick situation.
But for Pete's sake, the Hawks surely should do the right thing and trade him back to perth, even if they get a dodgy deal in return. His brother has just passed away for Pete's sake and his parents probably need him there at this stage of their lives.

Yeah, we're the villians in this situation. Dastardly Hawthorn, dragging these poor kids across the Nullabor, paying over the odds to keep them and then crying poor when they go home and leave the club with no compensation.

Should be ashamed of themselves.

The Hawks 'should' do the right thing? What do you think we've been doing for the last month? Forcing him to stay?

 

[The Mailman]

I think should just be happy with a first rnd pick from the Eagles and a fringe player. I don't think they are going to get any better deal than that.

 

[Goldenblue]

Originally posted by The Mailman
I think should just be happy with a first rnd pick from the Eagles and a fringe player. I don't think they are going to get any better deal than that.

Most logical post on this matter.

 

[hotpie]

Chick will be forced to stay in Melbourne. The Perth clubs will not have room in their salary caps and will not be able to/prepared to pay his high cost.

He aint that good anyway.

 

[Danny Chook Fan Club]

Logical?

It's logical to be dictated to by a player and by an opposition club?

It's logical to accept a pick in a poor draft and a no-hoper for a 150 game Club Champion and leading goalkicker?

It's logical to project yourself as a soft touch around the league?

 

[Pessimistic]

Originally posted by The Mailman
I think a three way trade between the Hawks, a WA club and another club seems likely for the Chick situation.
But for Pete's sake, the Hawks surely should do the right thing and trade him back to perth, even if they get a dodgy deal in return. His brother has just passed away for Pete's sake and his parents probably need him there at this stage of their lives.

As a Hawthorn member I'd be inclined to do that, but you get the feeling the eagles(or their supporters on here) would see that as weakness and make the trade just that bit 'dodgier'.

Then next year after chick has won a few games off his own boot the same supporters would be on here rubbing our faces in it.

I'd just like to point out that all the WA hawks were ignored by the WA teams.

 

[Pessimistic]

Originally posted by hotpie
Chick will be forced to stay in Melbourne. The Perth clubs will not have room in their salary caps and will not be able to/prepared to pay his high cost.

He aint that good anyway.

Scored more goals than all but 2 eagles last year. They were practically salivating in 2000 for him.

I'b be ecstatic to see him stay,even if it was on a year to year basis

 

[Dave]

Originally posted by Danny Chook Fan Club
Logical?

It's logical to be dictated to by a player and by an opposition club?

It's logical to accept a pick in a poor draft and a no-hoper for a 150 game Club Champion and leading goalkicker?

It's logical to project yourself as a soft touch around the league?

Apparantly so. It's also logical to trade a player away in return for moving a second round pick in the draft up 3 spots......

 

[Captain Random]

Originally posted by Danny Chook Fan Club
Harding was a much different situation. He was a contracted Hawthorn player, and was seeking to breach that contract. The same with Gary Buckenara.

The lever is different - Hawthorn can force Chick into a lottery with the likely result that he may have to sit the year out, rather than drag him through the courts to enforce a contract. But it's leverage all the same, and Hawthorn has shown in the past that it is not shy about using that leverage.

Really, you wouldn't expect any club to act any differently. All clubs have a tradition of treating players ruthlessly when required. As a result, though, you can't be too outraged when a player puts no. 1 before the club.

 

[Goldenblue]

Originally posted by hotpie
Chick will be forced to stay in Melbourne. The Perth clubs will not have room in their salary caps and will not be able to/prepared to pay his high cost.

He aint that good anyway.

Wrong.


Matera and McIntosh go onto the "Old mans" list next year and I think Jakovich and Banfield are due on the vets list the year after.

Hence, room in our salary cap.

 

[Danny Chook Fan Club]

Originally posted by carneagles
The lever is different - Hawthorn can force Chick into a lottery with the likely result that he may have to sit the year out, rather than drag him through the courts to enforce a contract. But it's leverage all the same, and Hawthorn has shown in the past that it is not shy about using that leverage.

Since so disgracefully and selfishly using that leverage (to enforce legally binding, court-tested contracts. The nerve of Hawthorn!), the following players have been allowed to 'go home':

Matthew Robran
Ben Allan
Darren Jarman
Luke McPharlin
and now Chick. The club is making every effort to accommodate him.

In all cases above, we received less than adequate compensation for five very good footballers.

We also organised a trade for an apparently homesick Nick Holland, until we found out he was money-sick instead of homesick.

At no stage has the AFL stepped in to assist, through salary cap increases or compensatory draft picks, depsite the same treatment being meted out to teams who have been in very similar circumstances

Time to draw the line, methinks.

 

[Pessimistic]

Originally posted by carneagles
The lever is different - Hawthorn can force Chick into a lottery with the likely result that he may have to sit the year out, rather than drag him through the courts to enforce a contract. But it's leverage all the same, and Hawthorn has shown in the past that it is not shy about using that leverage.

Really, you wouldn't expect any club to act any differently. All clubs have a tradition of treating players ruthlessly when required. As a result, though, you can't be too outraged when a player puts no. 1 before the club. [/B]

Given the recent circumstances I would expect hawthorn to assist Chick to move to WA and try to continue his career. Hawthorn is entitled to ask for a reasonable trade.

I would expect the hawks to put it to Chick to make sure the WA clubs really want him, and would give him a game (not the WAFL) as the signs they have been given do not bear that out.

 

[Dave]

Originally posted by Danny Chook Fan Club
Since so disgracefully and selfishly using that leverage (to enforce legally binding, court-tested contracts. The nerve of Hawthorn!), the following players have been allowed to 'go home':

Matthew Robran
Ben Allan

Didn't he leave as part of Freo's concessions? If so, Hawthorn didn't let him go???

Darren Jarman
...

In all cases above, we received less than adequate compensation for five very good footballers.

Salmon and Chick less than adequate?

 

[Pessimistic]

Originally posted by Dave


Didn't he leave as part of Freo's concessions? If so, Hawthorn didn't let him go???



Salmon and Chick less than adequate?

Maybe we can get Salmon and Jarman back ?

 

[Danny Chook Fan Club]

Allan essentially walked out.

Salmon - gone. Chick - gone.
versus
Jarman - two flags
versus
Wellman and Barnard - two flags.

 

[Pessimistic]

I tell you what is annoying. You guys think you are doing the actual negotiations. One even started using card playing analagies.

You all pretend you don't rate Chick when you really do, and are looking forward to rubbing our noses in it next year.

Meanwhile the guy is probably going throught the worst time of his life, and it's just a big game to some.

Maybe perhaps the Hawks are trying to settle this sooner rather than later (draft week) so the guy can get on with his life.

 

[Dave]

Originally posted by Danny Chook Fan Club
Allan essentially walked out.

So you didn't "let him go".

Salmon - gone. Chick - gone.
versus
Jarman - two flags
versus
Wellman and Barnard - two flags.

Salmon - best and fairest winner. Chick, best and fairest winner. That Hawthorn didn't have the other players to win a flag whilst these two were playing whilst the other clubs did with the ones they got doesn't mean that in terms of the trade itself what you got wasn't "adequate compensation".

 

[Danny Chook Fan Club]

Jarman was near enough to the best player in the league in 1995/6. Barnard was around the best 22. At the time, we received a draft pick and a 30 year old, broken down hack full forward.

Is that adequate compensation?

 

[Goldenblue]

Originally posted by Pessimistic
I tell you what is annoying. You guys think you are doing the actual negotiations. One even started using card playing analagies.

Its called discussion.

Originally posted by Pessimistic You all pretend you don't rate Chick when you really do, and are looking forward to rubbing our noses in it next year.[/B]

No pretence. Cousins / Kerr / Judd are enough for us. As for rubbing noses in it? What for? After all, it is Chick who wants to LEAVE your club. It's his decision. If he comes to us, good, if not, well, we wont miss him.

Originally posted by Pessimistic Meanwhile the guy is probably going throught the worst time of his life, and it's just a big game to some.[/B]

I feel sorry for the guy, I really do, but BOTH clubs have not helped with the deal and WC have walked away from it. We simply don't want him that bad.

Originally posted by Pessimistic Maybe perhaps the Hawks are trying to settle this sooner rather than later (draft week) so the guy can get on with his life. [/B]

True, but to ask for Gardy for him?
pffft.

The Freo deal stung your guys last year and it seems many at the hawks are still bitter over it.


Maybe Chick will retire, if so, I wish him well.