Hawthorn’s 2019 Trade/FA Incoming players discussion

OnceKicked50

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Aug 15, 2015
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Agree re: O’Rourke, Lovell (terrible), but Greenwood isn’t nearly quick enough to be that defensive presence that Popeye is. Can’t get from possession to possession to keep pressuring & cause turnovers (or 2nd options) like Popeye does.
I absolutely agree regarding his pace. It’s more about his total commitment and endeavour I guess. Love his determination and just feel his manic nature would have backs mindful of his presence.

It’s also that he is dangerous overhead and could exploit a favourable matchup.

But yeah, lacks the pace so fair con.

He isn’t a midfield need for mine.
 

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Hawk_francais

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If the club is targeting a big key forward then...


In order of preference


1. Patton










Daylight









2. Casboult















More daylight
































3. Jenkins
Look I don't want to start anything with you but that is a head-scratcher of a post.

While Jenkins may not be the best key forward (doesn't really compete well in packs, which is a bizarre limitation for a 200cm player, but Buddy also gets away with it), he's kicked a lot more goals and played a lot more footy than both the others you mentioned. Jenkins has averaged 2 goals a game through his career which puts him in the upper echelon for forwards, key position or otherwise. He's badly out of form now, but he kicked 46 goals just last year.

If our club picked him up I would understand, even though he's 30 - he could help us out big time over the next two years while Mitch Lewis develops. He's certainly a safer bet that a player on his 2nd (or 3rd) ACL or a forward who will be best remembered for his poor set-shot routine.
 

Brant

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While Jenkins may not be the best key forward (doesn't really compete well in packs, which is a bizarre limitation for a 200cm player


If our club picked him up I would understand, even though he's 30 - he could help us out big time over the next two years while Mitch Lewis develops. He's certainly a safer bet that a player on his 2nd (or 3rd) ACL or a forward who will be best remembered for his poor set-shot routine.
Your 1st paragraph undoes your 2nd paragraph.

The only safe thing about Jenkins is that it's safe to say that he'll neither be the leading FF or the strong-marking FF that we need. His goals are more in the mould of Stephen Milne than that of a KPF.

We need a big, leading*/marking KPF that demands oppositions double-team him or let him play 1-on-1 at their peril. Now maybe Patton breaks down again - maybe he doesn't, but at 30/31 years of age, there is 0% chance Jenkins suddenly becomes that player.


*leading, of course, relies on us picking up Cogs + Mitchell returning
 

HODGEYROAD

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Look I don't want to start anything with you but that is a head-scratcher of a post.

While Jenkins may not be the best key forward (doesn't really compete well in packs, which is a bizarre limitation for a 200cm player, but Buddy also gets away with it), he's kicked a lot more goals and played a lot more footy than both the others you mentioned. Jenkins has averaged 2 goals a game through his career which puts him in the upper echelon for forwards, key position or otherwise. He's badly out of form now, but he kicked 46 goals just last year.

If our club picked him up I would understand, even though he's 30 - he could help us out big time over the next two years while Mitch Lewis develops. He's certainly a safer bet that a player on his 2nd (or 3rd) ACL or a forward who will be best remembered for his poor set-shot routine.
You really think it's wise for a non contending team to be adding more 30+ players in our best 22 ? We have too many 30 + players in our best 22 for a middle tier team as it is.
 

PhatHQ

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https://www.bigfooty.com/forum/threads/hypothetical-trades-and-wishlists-thread.1167875/post-52238254

Can someone link us to Callum Coleman-Jones?

My hypothetical from 2017 is stirring...

Fogarty is a beast. No chance on getting from the crows IMO.
Would absolutely love the idea of him & Lewis teaming up for 8 years!

Jenkins... pass < Patton

Bonar would sure fill a need left in the wake of delisting Lovell & O’rouke as “top end talent ” & get some quality depth on the list
 

cb16

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Be nice to get another first through a trade, as well as trading our 2020 first and have three to play with !!!!! Mmmm, then you can afford to be bold.

I understand we want to be aggressive. We are working on a short list of top ten Draft candidates. We would like to grab two.

And then there is the ramifications of Cogs and no Cogs.
If we get Cogs, then I see it far more likely we go for a Jenkins, etc as well because with Tom Mitchell coming back, the premiership window suddenly appears a lot closer. Much like Geelong with Gary Rohan, we all rolled our eyes at that.

However, no Cogs means I'd be more confident aggressively going for 2 early draft picks...
 

Wandering Hawk

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Bringing in an old KPF as a place holder makes sense if there's no better option for 1-3 years. Allows us to rebuild other areas and bide our time on the KPF.

A place holder aging KPF means that we can develop surrounding kids with the structures with a big KPF, and means that a potential FA KPF can see what we offer, rather than running a desperate 'kick it to KPF Puopolo' type failplan.

Rebuilds need to get value from placeholding players who won't get to a flag themselves due to age, but who can both mentor and defend kids, plus give them a reasonable structure to develop in, and prevent a developing team from getting reamed so hard that players get mental scars or seek to depart. They also keep us fans engaged by showing great heart, whilst allowing the coach to trial new tactics with the developing group.

Henderson is a great example. Imagine just how much trouble our midfield would have been this year without him. He's too old to survive until a flag, but he's a great example of a rebuild value placeholder that keeps us competitive enough to evaluate the developing kids.

So yeah, I'm very happy with recruiting Patton or Jenkins or whoever Clarko and co. reckon.
 

Spursfan

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Bringing in an old KPF as a place holder makes sense if there's no better option for 1-3 years. Allows us to rebuild other areas and bide our time on the KPF.

A place holder aging KPF means that we can develop surrounding kids with the structures with a big KPF, and means that a potential FA KPF can see what we offer, rather than running a desperate 'kick it to KPF Puopolo' type failplan.

Rebuilds need to get value from placeholding players who won't get to a flag themselves due to age, but who can both mentor and defend kids, plus give them a reasonable structure to develop in, and prevent a developing team from getting reamed so hard that players get mental scars or seek to depart. They also keep us fans engaged by showing great heart, whilst allowing the coach to trial new tactics with the developing group.

Henderson is a great example. Imagine just how much trouble our midfield would have been this year without him. He's too old to survive until a flag, but he's a great example of a rebuild value placeholder that keeps us competitive enough to evaluate the developing kids.

So yeah, I'm very happy with recruiting Patton or Jenkins or whoever Clarko and co. reckon.
Great post, need to stay competitive whilst developing/rebuilding the team.
 

Topiary

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Bringing in an old KPF as a place holder makes sense if there's no better option for 1-3 years. Allows us to rebuild other areas and bide our time on the KPF.

A place holder aging KPF means that we can develop surrounding kids with the structures with a big KPF, and means that a potential FA KPF can see what we offer, rather than running a desperate 'kick it to KPF Puopolo' type failplan.

Rebuilds need to get value from placeholding players who won't get to a flag themselves due to age, but who can both mentor and defend kids, plus give them a reasonable structure to develop in, and prevent a developing team from getting reamed so hard that players get mental scars or seek to depart. They also keep us fans engaged by showing great heart, whilst allowing the coach to trial new tactics with the developing group.

Henderson is a great example. Imagine just how much trouble our midfield would have been this year without him. He's too old to survive until a flag, but he's a great example of a rebuild value placeholder that keeps us competitive enough to evaluate the developing kids.

So yeah, I'm very happy with recruiting Patton or Jenkins or whoever Clarko and co. reckon.
I worry when I read such common sense !!!
 

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TylerDurden

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Bringing in an old KPF as a place holder makes sense if there's no better option for 1-3 years. Allows us to rebuild other areas and bide our time on the KPF.

A place holder aging KPF means that we can develop surrounding kids with the structures with a big KPF, and means that a potential FA KPF can see what we offer, rather than running a desperate 'kick it to KPF Puopolo' type failplan.

Rebuilds need to get value from placeholding players who won't get to a flag themselves due to age, but who can both mentor and defend kids, plus give them a reasonable structure to develop in, and prevent a developing team from getting reamed so hard that players get mental scars or seek to depart. They also keep us fans engaged by showing great heart, whilst allowing the coach to trial new tactics with the developing group.

Henderson is a great example. Imagine just how much trouble our midfield would have been this year without him. He's too old to survive until a flag, but he's a great example of a rebuild value placeholder that keeps us competitive enough to evaluate the developing kids.

So yeah, I'm very happy with recruiting Patton or Jenkins or whoever Clarko and co. reckon.
Correct. As they say, everything in moderation. It's all a balance.

Too many kids and you become Carlton. Too old and you're faced with a full rebuild anyway.

The team needs a blend of quality youth and experienced heads. I've heard all year that us coughing up leads is due to a lack of leadership. That we should've kept Hodge. The same blokes would bleat that we're too old in the next breath.

We all know, landing a gun free agent gives you instant relief. Unfortunately the whole comp is on to that plan too.

We bottom out, and we can't attract free agents.

Chicken or the egg? It's a game of moving parts. Trade for established guns or keep your early picks? It's fluid. Perhaps this year we keep our first. If we land Cogs we certainly will. If we don't, do we trade it again? Some would say commit to the top end of the draft regardless.

So many theories. The game changes weekly. We need to be ready for anything.

A long way to go still.
 

Mrzohs

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I'd take Lynch over Brown any day of the week. Scimshaw was also a real steal for us with Scully. Bit worried about Wingard to be honest. We gave up a heap for him and also did not like the way we treated Burton, which is for mine, against the family club values.
spot on with scrimshaw! Wingard we will have to wait and see he did no preseason i will reserve judgment till the end of next year but i am not convinced at all, alot of our recruits under the clarko system take a whole season before they excel, i think of hale,gibson, recently impey.
Burton i think there was more to it a few rumblings with other players.
 

Bugs1977

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The bald headed flog and his partner in clown Barrett suggesting on Footy Classified that Geelong is the front runner for Cogs if he decides to leave GWS - Hawks now a certainty to land him.
Well to be fair the Handbaggers might need to fill the void for Tim Kelly after he recently put contract talks on hold till seasons end 😂
 

rogiebear93

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Jenkins would be a good get providing he comes cheap, as he fills an immediate need and could very much be a Podsiadly for Geelong Circa 2010.

The thing that I do worry about is the suggestion of aggressively bringing in large amounts of best 22 players this year, similar to the previous couple of years. Continuity is important.
 

AlwaysHawks15

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Roughandlove is a bloke with very good mail, doubt he'd come in and drop Fogarty with no backing.

Honestly, I'd really like him as a player - but I really can't get past how we get him as a South Aussie.
In regards to Fogerty maybe he has matured enough to consider moving interstate to continue his career as a realistic option. Guess who else made that decision last trade period?. The guy is built like a tank already even if he doesn't have a big influence on games initially from what I saw he is a competitive beast who has a bit of mongrel in him already. Exactly the type of bull we need to get the unsociable culture back that we need.
 
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