NO TROLLS Hawthorn Racism Review - Sensitive issues discussed. Part 2

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Wosh

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Don’t use this thread as an opportunity to troll North or any other clubs, you’ll be removed from the discussion. Stick to the topic and please keep it civil and respectful to those involved. Keep personal arguements out of this thread.
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Videos, statements etc in the OP here:



Link to Hawthorn Statement. - Link to ABC Sports article. - Leaked Report

Process Plan - https://resources.afl.com.au/afl/do...erms-of-Reference-and-Process-Plan-FINAL-.pdf
 
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demondavey

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If he's kicked off the AFL Commission for being racist in his dealings, his legacy is s**t.

This isn't me Norf nuffy Clarko lover, go back and read what Caro wrote when all this actually broke early in 2022.

The delegation of indigenous Hawthorn players going to him to plead for something to be done about the Goodes booing by Hawthorn fans
Peak boys club stuff. Will never happen, unfortunately.
 

SimpkinByTheDockOfTheBay

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Your so hypoctical , an allegation against Egan is absolute truth yet and allegation made by families at HFC are dubious. Pathetic.

No, I think they're both the same. Allegations yet to be proven.

You're the one who has taken the Allegations in Jackson's article as unimpeachable truth.
 

Slartibartfast

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Yep, the Bastiaan stuff. And I also know the mighty ABC lawyers that signed off Rusty's piece also signed off Macca's Chau Chak Wing piece he got done on too.

But it was you who brought him up as the example of journalistic best practice.

Don't dog him now ffs
You waxed lyrical about Nick citing him as the gold standard time and time again As a comparison to Rusty.
dont back away from it now.

Has Rusty settled with Clarkson yet??
 

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SimpkinByTheDockOfTheBay

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Peak boys club stuff. Will never happen, unfortunately.

The boys club was happy to tip the ultimate made guy in David Evans overboard.

As I said, Newbold is the only one in all this who was stood down that hasn't reclaimed his spot.

They'll likely let him resign before formally sacking him true.

But he's seriously in the gun.
 

Aristotle Pickett

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So has enough time past for this to be swept under the rug yet?
I was just going to ask tbe same thing.
This is typical AFL style , have an enquirey that never ends and announce in the middle of the night that's it's finalised with some recommendations and nothing happens.
Then apologise a year later saying we should have done more like with Adam Goodes.
Clarkson and Fagan get away with it and people cast aspirtions on the Indigenous people who Clarkson told to terminate their pregnancy.
What a joke.
 

SimpkinByTheDockOfTheBay

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You waxed lyrical about Nick citing him as the gold standard time and time again As a comparison to Rusty.
dont back away from it now.

Has Rusty settled with Clarkson yet??

Rusty has apologised to Sonja Hood. He will to Clarko too in time.

Macca does the work, as you described him doing with you. Our defamation laws are very strict though and biased against journalists.
 
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SimpkinByTheDockOfTheBay

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And Chief you said ages ago you don't think Clarkson should be allowed around young indigenous players, or if you had indigenous sons you wouldn't want Clarkson coaching them, words to that effect.

Do you think Jy Simpkin is wrong to want to be a co-captain under Clarko?

Should his family be worried?
 

Maddo11

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Simpkin putting his hand up for a captaincy spot isn't necessarily him saying "I vouch for Clarkos character 100%" anyway.

It's not beyond possibility that Simpkin realises that very few AFL footballers get the chance to captain their club and doesn't want to miss his chance regardless of who the coach is.

Or maybe he wants to put himself in a position to be able to look out for those less experienced players "in case of fire".
 

Chief

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And Chief you said ages ago you don't think Clarkson should be allowed around young indigenous players, or if you had indigenous sons you wouldn't want Clarkson coaching them, words to that effect.

Do you think Jy Simpkin is wrong to want to be a co-captain under Clarko?

Should his family be worried?
Many sources have said that their experience wasn't all positive, but that they would still be involved with the club.

You have a one-sided view of how people view the club and Clarko.

I've since heard from a person who works with Fagan that he is a fantastic influence, and a much needed change from the previous disciplinarian coaching methods at the Lions.

My view is that Fagan at least has possibly learned his lessons. Or that his methods coaching the group vary. Or any number of possibilities.

My views encompass more than just the one side that you seem to have clamped your teeth on.

Move on. Litigating the reactions from the first days of this saga don't help your cause.
 

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SimpkinByTheDockOfTheBay

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Many sources have said that their experience wasn't all positive, but that they would still be involved with the club.

You have a one-sided view of how people view the club and Clarko.

I've since heard from a person who works with Fagan that he is a fantastic influence, and a much needed change from the previous disciplinarian coaching methods at the Lions.

My view is that Fagan at least has possibly learned his lessons. Or that his methods coaching the group vary. Or any number of possibilities.

My views encompass more than just the one side that you seem to have clamped your teeth on.

Move on. Litigating the reactions from the first days of this saga don't help your cause.

A nice way to avoid the question but it does at least seem like an admission that there were huge overreactions initially from many including yourself
 

Chief

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A nice way to avoid the question but it does at least seem like an admission that there were huge overreactions initially from many including yourself
No there were appropriate reactions. Even from my Lions-supporting friends who were obviously quite low about the revelations.

Again: I still think there was inappropriate behaviour from the Hawks coaches.
 

mcnulty

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You're right, to suggest that Simpkin becoming captain says anything about Clarkson is an extremely grey area.
I think there is a broader point though. No indigenous players from the clubs these coaches now represent seem to have an issue. There has being nothing from the media or other quarter since the first week. Without doubt the clubs involved know FAR more than any of us, and they and their employees seem completely comfortable with who they have on board.

Now for mine it would be a huge stretch to think the AFL was orchestrating some sort of monumental cover up here, given the nature of the media and who they have commissioned to oversee this investigation. Far more likely, people are backing away from the report and the story as originally reported.
 

SimpkinByTheDockOfTheBay

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No there were appropriate reactions. Even from my Lions-supporting friends who were obviously quite low about the revelations.

Again: I still think there was inappropriate behaviour from the Hawks coaches.

I will happily agree there is no doubt there was deeply inappropriate and quite clearly racist behaviour happening at Hawthorn.

The investigation underway is going to demonstrate that.

But I strongly doubt the lurid and unsupported allegations Jackson printed are going to feature in its conclusions.
 

SimpkinByTheDockOfTheBay

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You're right, to suggest that Simpkin becoming captain says anything about Clarkson is an extremely grey area.

Not really, if the gravest allegations about Clarkson's mistreatment and bullying of indigenous players were true, I'd be stunned if a guy like Jy Simpkin wanted anything to do with him
 

SimpkinByTheDockOfTheBay

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I think there is a broader point though. No indigenous players from the clubs these coaches now represent seem to have an issue. There has being nothing from the media or other quarter since the first week. Without doubt the clubs involved know FAR more than any of us, and they and their employees seem completely comfortable with who they have on board.

Now for mine it would be a huge stretch to think the AFL was orchestrating some sort of monumental cover up here, given the nature of the media and who they have commissioned to oversee this investigation. Far more likely, people are backing away from the report and the story as originally reported.

Common sense would dictate as much.
 

Lavender Bushranger

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I think there is a broader point though. No indigenous players from the clubs these coaches now represent seem to have an issue.

The broader point is whether Clarkson and/or Fagan did anything wrong.

The point you raise, seems to be whether they're hardcore racists or not. That's not the broader point - it's a related point, but one that very few are arguing for.

Simpkin agreeing to be captain supports the argument that Clarkson is not a hardcore racist, sure. But as I'd said, very, very few are arguing that he is.

Does it support the argument that he did the nothing wrong in terms of the allegations? No.


The lunatic posting incessantly on here is constantly dreaming up related points that few people care about, whilst seemingly ignoring the main point - which is whether Clarkson did any of the things he's alleged to have done?

Was Jackson's article any good? Who cares. Is Clarkson an active member of the KKK? No. Should a journo act impeccably on Twitter? Who cares? Is Sonja Hood a goddess? Who cares? Is Egan a crook? Who cares? Why aren't some families taking part? Who knows? Is Kennett a jerk? Yes, but who cares?

None of that matters.
 

JackOutback

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Are we still peddling the lie that Jackson didn't give them an opportunity to respond, when 24 hours is pretty standard in the industry and he even offered to delay the story to get their response?
 

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