Bumped Hawthorn - the beginning of the end? Will they make the fnals in 2017?

[RUNVS]

Funny thing, this isn't the beginning of the end.

The end has come and gone.

This is the beginning of the beginning for Hawthorn. It's the new normal, and because of its approach to list management it'll likely be normal for quite some time.

"Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is, perhaps, the end of the beginning."

 

[RUNVS]

Abasi all good if I start the 'Sydney - beginning of the end?' thread?

Surely Longmire has to go..

Not while he still has potentially good sons we might want to get through the academy he doesn't.

 

[Jade]

You mean the approach to list management that netted us 3 consecutive premierships?

And there it is again - like clockwork.

There are two things that I would suggest the vast majority of Hawthorn fans just aren't getting.

1) The fact that you won flags in the past has no relevance to how your list management team is currently performing.
2) This isn't the approach that 'netted us 3 consecutive premierships'.

The word 'delusional' was thrown at Essendon fans on occasion through the saga, and I think it is applicable now.

If you are a Hawthorn fan and you don't realise that a) your list is completely cooked and b) this is not the type of list management that made you a premiership side, you are flat out delusional.

 

[cryptor]

How come your most viewed/replied thread was about Essendon saga? Lots of wasted energy spent on us too.

One fish...

******* lol, during your 3peat what was consistently your most viewed and biggest thread on the Hawthorn board?

It was a thread on Essendon.

Thread on Essendon.

ESSENDON.

lolololol

Two fish...

The lack of self-awareness is astounding.

Hawthorn supporters have well and truly head****ed themselves.

Beerfish...

...more?

Big LOL at genuinely arguing that a highly topical multi-year drug cheating saga is at all comparable to what essentially boils down to 'previously very successful club is now not very successful'.

If there's any interesting story here it's the big surprise that the AFL's equalisation strategy has finally worked with 3 teams that have been finals staples in recent years sitting 0-4 in the bottom 3.

 

[Boxhead_31]

Clarko's PC reminded me of Wayne Brittain in 2002 when defending Carlton headed for their first spoon.

When coaches start defending the strength of their team based on past glory then they're usually trying to convince themselves rather than the fans. I'm starting to believe this Hawthorn team is shot mentally as much as anything.

The AFL should introduce trading for contracted coaches like they have in the NFL. Hawthorn need picks & Clarko doesn't want to go through a rebuild. A trade with a team like GC or a Collingwood/Carlton would be a win-win for both parties.

is there any rule preventing it in the AFL?
Would be up to one of those sides to try it

 

[Jaeger]

And there it is again - like clockwork.

There are two things that I would suggest the vast majority of Hawthorn fans just aren't getting.

1) The fact that you won flags in the past has no relevance to how your list management team is currently performing.
2) This isn't the approach that 'netted us 3 consecutive premierships'.

So the fact that we've finished top four every year since 2011, traded out all our first round picks for ready made stars that all played a huge part in us winning three consecutive premierships, has no relevance to where are list is now? How so exactly? Keen on your thoughts.

Our approach to trading out two of our older players was aimed to soften the blow of the reality that in two-three years none of them will be there. We traded out picks for Mitchell & O'Meara who will be A grade mids for the next 10 years.

The word 'delusional' was thrown at Essendon fans on occasion through the saga, and I think it is applicable now.

Oh dear.

If you are a Hawthorn fan and you don't realise that a) your list is completely cooked and b) this is not the type of list management that made you a premiership side, you are flat out delusional.

Four time premiership side*.

The list isn't cooked. It's weaker than previous seasons but the side is well down on confidence at the moment. We'll continue to trade aggressively over the next few years to have us back in premiership contention for a sustained period.

If only we could have the Dodoro approach to list management. No flags in 17 years and still a middle of the road club.

 

[hoianbulldog]

For all their talk of "any team would love to have won these flags and be s**t for a bit" the Hawks fans are obviously hurting.

And why not. Following a s**t footy team is crap. Who the **** cares if you won a flag even last year, the past is for old people, those in the moment want to be good now.

I know I didn't sit back feeling great for all the years post 2000 because I'd just seen the best individual season of all time. I cared far far more about the next game, and next flag, and winning it. And not winning it sucked.

And fact is Hawks at the moment, recent flags or otherwise, look ******* awful.

I am truly greatful i don't feel this way. As supporters we should bask in success for as long as possible. I still watch last years GF and live every minute of it.
I hope ine day you can enjiy success rather than immediately looking for the next fix.

 

[hoianbulldog]

When clarkdon arrived at Hawthorn they cleaned out almost all older players. Out went Croad, Hay, Rawlings, Thompson etc. They kept Crawford but loaded up on draft picks. I expect they will do the same at years end, hope they can get some high first rounders and pray there is a Roughie and Franklin in the top 5 of the draft.

It worked okay last time.

 

[Dave]

We'll continue to trade aggressively over the next few years to have us back in premiership contention for a sustained period.

With what. You have no decent picks and no players that you would trade that anyone wants. You only get one Alan Bond in a lifetime and you had yours with Freo in 01.

If only we could have the Dodoro approach to list management. No flags in 17 years and still a middle of the road club.

Can't attack the argument so go for the team supported. Never change figbooty.

 

[Jaeger]

With what. You have no decent picks and no players that you would trade that anyone wants. You only get one Alan Bond in a lifetime and you had yours with Freo in 01.

Everyone said the same thing last year. Nobody thought we would be able to land both O'Meara and Mitchell.

We'll find a way. The tricky part is getting players to nominate us, but once they do we always get the deals done somehow.

 

[lamaros]

I am truly greatful i don't feel this way. As supporters we should bask in success for as long as possible. I still watch last years GF and live every minute of it.
I hope ine day you can enjiy success rather than immediately looking for the next fix.

I enjoy it, then I move on.

 

[SA HAWK]

Everyone said the same thing last year. Nobody thought we would be able to land both O'Meara and Mitchell.

We'll find a way. The tricky part is getting players to nominate us, but once they do we always get the deals done somehow.

Are you happy for us to keep trading away future 1st round picks?

 

[Jaeger]

Are you happy for us to keep trading away future 1st round picks?

Sure, if we're trading them for quality players.

No guarantees at the draft.

 

[RUNVS]

Sure, if we're trading them for quality players.

No guarantees at the draft.

You have a pick between 1 and 5 and it is pretty much a guarantee these days. Short of injuries teams are not making Richard Tambling type mistakes anymore.

 

[SA HAWK]

Sure, if we're trading them for quality players.

No guarantees at the draft.

What players would you be thinking of?

 

[Jaeger]

What players would you be thinking of?

Steven May and another midfielder.

 

[Dave]

Everyone said the same thing last year. Nobody thought we would be able to land both O'Meara and Mitchell.

We'll find a way. The tricky part is getting players to nominate us, but once they do we always get the deals done somehow.

You had picks last year. You don't have them this year.

 

[SA HAWK]

You had picks last year. You don't have them this year.

We could trade our 2018 future 1st rounder I believe.

 

[RUNVS]

Steven May and another midfielder.

How could you afford May though, he is quite important to the Suns and the Suns are not that accommodating anymore to teams trying to pick off their players?

 

[Dave]

We could trade our 2018 future 1st rounder I believe.

You've already traded this years, not sure you can trade 2 years running away.

 

[Forward Press]

You've already traded this years, not sure you can trade 2 years running away.

Geelong have been able to do so. Fairly sure the AFL rules will allow Hawthorn to trade away their 2018 first rounder if they so wish.

 

[Stax on the mill]

Not having a crack at Hawthorn as I admire them greatly However I reckon they are in for a fair few years of pain. 4 flags in the past 9 seasons is a fantastic effort. If my team had achieved that I'd be more than happy for a few lean years to follow.

A large part of the Hawks success was driven by a group of tough, talented, hard nosed " warrior " type players, supported by capable, but lesser individuals. They've lost a couple of those warriors in Sam Mitchell and Jordan Lewis. The end is fast approaching for a few more in Hodge, Gibson, Burgoyne, Roughead and Birchall.

This group of hard nosed players made the lesser individuals walk tall, and appear to be better players than they actually are. They are now starting to be found out as just ordinary players. I cannot see amongst Hawthorn's younger brigade too many who are capable of stepping up and becoming the ruthless tough nuts that have been a hallmark of Hawthorn's success over the past decade.

Would be interested in others thoughts on this.

 

[Jaeger]

How could you afford May though, he is quite important to the Suns and the Suns are not that accommodating anymore to teams trying to pick off their players?

We have room in the salary cap plus older players retiring will free up more space.

 

[yeee_haaaa!!!!!]

The problem the Hawks now have with bringing in players - why the hell would anyone want to go there and spend the next 5 years minimum rebuilding with no hope of finals? O'meara will already be thinking what have I done , even more so when the Suns are top 4 in s couple of years and he's spending September in Bali

 

[yeee_haaaa!!!!!]

Steven May and another midfielder.

Steven May is co-captain at Gold Coast and in talks to ink a new long term deal with them. He's done the hard yards, as if he's going to give up playing finals with the Suns to spend the rest of his career in the cellar with the Hawks. Please