Herald sun investigation into dees tanking saga

[gingernuts]

We can bang on about culure at Melbourne and poor performance by those who instructed the tanking, however the Herald Sun have missed the point on this issue. The real story is about the Taurus excreta culture at the AFL. Dictatorship, cover ups, sex scandals and more. It is a fooking disgrace how Gillon McLachan has not been given the Tijuana brass.

 

[rocket18]

If you wish to claim a moral high ground here - no, the official findings were that they were not guilty of tanking.

However, they were fined 500k anyway - it would be prudent to factor that in to your own personal assessment of whether they were guilty or not, since a penalty isn't levied without cause.

This saga is a great example of the AFL straddling the twin horses of justice and public relations.

The only club punished for Melbourne "not tanking" was Adelaide.

Bailey was our senior assistant coach and the AFL suspended him, Melbourne got a $500k fine - which the AFL then paid on their behalf.

Corrupt AFL is corrupt.

 

[BRWB]

The only club punished for Melbourne "not tanking" was Adelaide.

Bailey was our senior assistant coach and the AFL suspended him, Melbourne got a $500k fine - which the AFL then paid on their behalf.

Corrupt AFL is corrupt.

And they did Melb a favour by ensuring that cancer Connolly had no future in footy.

 

[caspian]

Stuff

Haha, thanks man, but not quite what I was looking for. I'm aware of that stuff. Was hoping for some gameday anecdotes, any really puzzling tactics, any really awful plays of the day, any particularly spicy media coverage on it etc.

 

[estibador]

This is actually the sort of journalism we should want though. Hold the AFL accountable. Cover ups are not an option. ******* scared of their betting stakeholders ffs. It's as much directed at the AFL covering it up and saying the Dees didn't set out to lose games, even though the coach and 7 others admitted that it had, as it is the Dees. They are hardly going to go rabidly after Dean Bailey and Jim Stynes are they? Mark it down, they are targeting the AFL the headline is even literally about a cover-up. I`d be surprised if the Herald Sun goes “oh well they've got Jonesy still, better distract him with the tanking days!”. To write this off as simply pro-Essendon conspiracy is moronic, ignores the s**t way the AFL handled it. Just like with Essendon, there is doubt over every investigation the AFL has undertaken because of this.

Exactly. Everyone knows Melbourne tanked, that's not the story here.

The story is it's now been revealed that the AFL uncovered overwhelming evidence during their investigation and then covered it up.

 

[Jim Prideaux]

Didn’t Caroline Wilson write some articles slamming Melbourne and the AFL for this whole episode?

Yup, but it wouldn’t allow old mate to throw his thinly veiled misogyny in to the debate.

 

[BRWB]

Yup, but it wouldn’t allow old mate to throw his thinly veiled misogyny in to the debate.

Cheap shot garbage without foundation. People can read Wilson's post penalty article for themselves.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.th...mons-cleared-guilty-fined-20130219-2epm0.html

Wilson very pro Gillon IMO. And praises the AFL when it was an obvious cover up and at a time where Gillon was criticised heavily for his refusal to acknowledge tanking. Caro went soft as a deal to keep getting fed stories by Gillon IMO. She was even more supportive of Gillon and the AFL on Classified. Wilson has always gone easy on Gill IMO. A materstroke by Gil to get her on side.

 

[Norwegian Blue]

Haha, thanks man, but not quite what I was looking for. I'm aware of that stuff. Was hoping for some gameday anecdotes, any really puzzling tactics, any really awful plays of the day, any particularly spicy media coverage on it etc.

Sorry I misunderstood. My bad.

You mean did we play Eddie Betts in the ruck? That sort of stuff? Nothing like that. Just the usual: players off early for surgery, players played out of position for "development", limited interchanges, kids who weren't ready played to gain experience, etc.

The same stuff Melbourne did. Only difference is we did it for six games, they did it for a season.

 

[Nugett]

have any of the players in the club at that time come out and talked about the tanking stuff? dont know what they would have been thinking, get to play at the highest level and then get told that they had to not try. imagine getting delisted at the end of the year from a club that tanked. you wouldnt know if it was a compliment or not cause if they wanted to lose surely they would just keep there s**t players and delist the ones that actually want to win.

Didn’t the investigation happen after Brock McClean say it was the main reason why he left Melbourne for Carlton?

 

[Nugett]

Wonder if the hun will do an investigation into the drug saga? Guessing that they won’t with Slibbi’s bias...

 

[wagstaff]

As needless as rehashing this investigation was, I read the HS articles; doesn't really reveal anything new but underlines what a massive idiot Connolly was, not just for pushing this scheme but doing so in such a heavy-handed manner.

Felt sorry for how Bailey got the brunt of the punishment and even more so now.

But as others have said, the HS pushing this story so hard now is very strange; clearly there are agendas behind the scenes for it. Perhaps there is a push within a section of the AFL establishment to bring back a stronger version of the priority pick and this is a push back against it.

 

[Toump Ass]

Didn’t the investigation happen after Brock McClean say it was the main reason why he left Melbourne for Carlton?

Correct. Shows how useless the AFL are- why wait until an ex-player aired his grievances years after he left? Bailey admitted to tanking in his post-sacking presser (as did Terry Wallace at Richmond).

It was obvious what we were doing (reduced interchanges, reversed field positions, good players dropped for untested and under-developed kids) and the media definitely picked up on it. The AFL could have asked us what we were doing at the time but they didn't.

Only difference is we did it for six games, they did it for a season.

Maybe, but we were a genuinely s**t side and the "vault" meeting where Connolly threatened everyone with their jobs was after we won against Port Adelaide in Round 15... prior to that, we might have actually just sucked.

 

[Nugett]

Correct. Shows how useless the AFL are- why wait until an ex-player aired his grievances years after he left? Bailey admitted to tanking in his post-sacking presser (as did Terry Wallace at Richmond).

It was obvious what we were doing (reduced interchanges, reversed field positions, good players dropped for untested and under-developed kids) and the media definitely picked up on it. The AFL could have asked us what we were doing at the time but they didn't.

Maybe, but we were a genuinely s**t side and the "vault" meeting where Connolly threatened everyone with their jobs was after we won against Port Adelaide in Round 15... prior to that, we might have actually just sucked.

In all honesty don’t think that Melbourne club. There were other situations which was highlighted by the media, such as the Bryce Gibbs cup among others. I remember an interview years ago with Ken Judge where he said in an interview with his time as coach at hawthorn Don Scott told him to lose the rest of the games in the late 98. It turned out to be a non issue as the hawks won their last 5 matches. So I think the issue of tanking was prevelant for a long time.

https://www.google.com.au/amp/s/amp...ns-match-throwing-stance-20030527-gdgtww.html

 

[Blue1980]

In all honesty don’t think that Melbourne club. There were other situations which was highlighted by the media, such as the Bryce Gibbs cup among others. I remember an interview years ago with Ken Judge where he said in an interview with his time as coach at hawthorn Don Scott told him to lose the rest of the games in the late 98. It turned out to be a non issue as the hawks won their last 5 matches. So I think the issue of tanking was prevelant for a long time.

https://www.google.com.au/amp/s/amp...ns-match-throwing-stance-20030527-gdgtww.html

Of course it was, it’s just from this distance many have forgotten the earlier examples, even our 2007 one is somewhat forgotten due to the focus on the Dees in 2009.

But yes next to no one was wanting us to win the last round in 2007, myself included.

It was pick 1 and 3 instead of pick 2, just to win a middling match.

Very glad the AFL got rid of priority picks, though a lot of numpties still criticize clubs for tanking now when I don’t really think it’s worthwhile just to go up one pick in the draft order

 

[Nugett]

Of course it was, it’s just from this distance many have forgotten the earlier examples, even our 2007 one is somewhat forgotten due to the focus on the Dees in 2009.

But yes next to no one was wanting us to win the last round in 2007, myself included.

It was pick 1 and 3 instead of pick 2, just to win a middling match.

Very glad the AFL got rid of priority picks, though a lot of numpties still criticize clubs for tanking now when I don’t really think it’s worthwhile just to go up one pick in the draft order

Agree, think a lot of the tanking issues have gone. Would like to see some kind of lottery system put in place though, just to remove all doubts though.

 

[Blue1980]

Agree, think a lot of the tanking issues have gone. Would like to see some kind of lottery system put in place though, just to remove all doubts though.

Agree on that as well, though you would still get conspiracy theorists about it.

How far would you make it a lottery though? I think regardless of the lottery you shouldn’t be able to fall more than 4 spots back from where you finished.

In other words if you finish last, the lowest pick you can get is 4, 2nd last 5 etc

 

[Nugett]

Agree on that as well, though you would still get conspiracy theorists about it.

How far would you make it a lottery though? I think regardless of the lottery you shouldn’t be able to fall more than 4 spots back from where you finished.

In other words if you finish last, the lowest pick you can get is 4, 2nd last 5 etc

I think there are numerous possibilities, you could have the lottery for the bottom 4 teams, which gives the bottom team a 25% chance of getting the first draft pick. Or have have the 10 non finalists involved, and have it so the bottom placed team can only drop as far as 4th which then still gives them a 25% chance. If by some random chance pick number 1 is still in play for the teams that finished 9th and 10th I still think it would be great, as I think that pick 1 would be more available to trade, or would help them teams to become a premiership contender the following year, instead of another potential finalist team the following year.

 

[Jim Prideaux]

Cheap shot garbage without foundation. People can read Wilson's post penalty article for themselves.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.th...mons-cleared-guilty-fined-20130219-2epm0.html

Wilson very pro Gillon IMO. And praises the AFL when it was an obvious cover up and at a time where Gillon was criticised heavily for his refusal to acknowledge tanking. Caro went soft as a deal to keep getting fed stories by Gillon IMO. She was even more supportive of Gillon and the AFL on Classified. Wilson has always gone easy on Gill IMO. A materstroke by Gil to get her on side.

Did you actually read that article?

 

[Supercoach Bargain]

Dees have lost most of the players since then, the coach has passed (R.I.P) and Connelly and Schwab have long gone. Let it go.

They are just poo now.

 

[Toump Ass]

Agree, think a lot of the tanking issues have gone. Would like to see some kind of lottery system put in place though, just to remove all doubts though.

Yeah I reckon the success of Carlton and Melbourne have already put the nail in that coffin.

I think clubs realise that pick 1 is rarely the best player of a draft. The element of luck already exists.

 

[The King!]

good to see a quick response to current events from the herald sun

 

[The Passenger]

Haven't gone through the thread, but am I the only one who couldn't give a crap about this?
It was 10 years ago.
Most of the players and coaches from then have moved on.
Dean Bailey is dead.
Take out the first two rounds and Melbourne are finally back to being a proper, competitive football club. Their dire past decade and this issue are both long dead and buried.

It's at the stage where it's too far in the past to look at it through a media/news lens, but not far enough to look at it from a historical point of view.

Just let it be. I don't see anything positive that can come from bringing this into the public consciousness right now.

 

[reincarnated]

This is 10 times worse than anything Melbourne did.

Interesting...you don't think draft pick tampering when your club got JOM, Scully and Scrimshaw isn't worse?

 

[Black Stripe]

Not sure why people are saying Melbourne are still benefiting from tanking when the player they got as a result of tanking for an extra pick was Jack Trengove and he was delisted 2 years ago.

 

[Thegibbsgamble]

Not sure why people are saying Melbourne are still benefiting from tanking when the player they got as a result of tanking for an extra pick was Jack Trengove and he was delisted 2 years ago.

The only acceptable punishment was relagation.

So they are benefiting.