Analysis Derek Hine

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One of my friends who is now a significant AFL recruiter, used to say the Tigers are the only club to recruit dickheads. His argument was supportive you can teach someone to be a better person but you cant coach natural talent. This was around the time of Daniel Conners. I think his attitude changed once he was working full time as a recruiter. The tigers were the example why not to recruit dickheads. 2019 and the Tigers with a great culture are the example of why to recruit dickheads "Sydney Stack". I feel bad saying this because from what I see is a happy kid just enjoying football but he did drop for a reason. Marlion Pickett will also likely make an impact. I am spewing we didnt pick Stack because you only had to watch 30 seconds of his highlights video to see he was a jet. Tigers have a great culture at the moment and Stack from what I am aware hasnt put a foot wrong. We spent two first rounders on Beams with a history of mental health issues and he is a player who has had all the support in the world. But we were not prepared to give a chance to a kid who probably hasnt had much support his whole life. Surely with the money we have and if they are confident in our culture you take a chance and could have picked him at 60!.

Re Hine; I think he does an excellent job picked Pendlebury against the grain, picked both Stephenson, De Goey and Sier against the grain. Even Sam Murray if he wasnt snorting grains. His misses could be argued because of injury Freeman and Scharenberg (although he can still go up a notch and is reaonably good). Keane and Wilson could potentially follow Cox snd Mihocek as bargain pick ups. Unless we get a bargain big monster i think it is mids and forwards we need to pick in the coming up draft and back our development of Kelly, Wilson and Keane who all look to be showing something.
 
jc37 said:
Re Hine; I think he does an excellent job picked Pendlebury against the grain, picked both Stephenson, De Goey and Sier against the grain. Even Sam Murray if he wasnt snorting grains. His misses could be argued because of injury Freeman and Scharenberg (although he can still go up a notch and is reaonably good). Keane and Wilson could potentially follow Cox snd Mihocek as bargain pick ups. Unless we get a bargain big monster i think it is mids and forwards we need to pick in the coming up draft and back our development of Kelly, Wilson and Keane who all look to be showing something.
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I think the worry is some of our best players are 28 and over.

Pendlebury Sidebottom Beams Roughead Howe Cox Wells Dunn Varcoe Mayne Greenwood Thomas Goldsack

I can't see any of Wilson, Keane or Kelly maturing in time for this window
 
Thatsmyname said:
I think the worry is some of our best players are 28 and over.

Pendlebury Sidebottom Beams Roughead Howe Cox Wells Dunn Varcoe Mayne Greenwood Thomas Goldsack

I can't see any of Wilson, Keane or Kelly maturing in time for this window
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Of the above players you mentioned, only Pendlebury, Sidebottom, Beams and Howe are worthy of note.

The others are role players who are just about done with respect to Roughead.
I wouldn’t be calling the others our best players especially when we have names such as JDG, Grundy, Treloar, Adams, Stephenson, Moore etc.
 

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HFF said:
Of the above players you mentioned, only Pendlebury, Sidebottom, Beams and Howe are worthy of note.

The others are role players who are just about done with respect to Roughead.
I wouldn’t be calling the others our best players especially when we have names such as JDG, Grundy, Treloar, Adams, Stephenson, Moore etc.
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To be fair the first 3 are a large part of our elite midfield and Howe and Roughy are simply our best tall defenders with Moore out so often (and probably coming back via the forward line now) take the 28+ out and we have virtually no keys and relying on the kids you mentioned, not ideal for a premiership window
 
Is it picking all the same types or of those picked it is the same types that tend to be the ones who Collingwood have had the most success picking? I tend to think the latter.

There is both speed and KPPs in the Pies range. A shame that first round pick isn't there as there is a particularly polished season one, game one ready ground level forward who Collingwood could have used that pick on. But still plenty of speedy/x-factor types and kpps who outside of the trade/free agent period can help balance the club's list.
 
How does this bloke not cop more criticism on here? hes been at the club for 16 years and and while granted we have won a flag in his tenure his past decade of list management has been absolute shizen at best lets look shall we.
Trades / FA

2010: Andrew Krakouer, Chris Tarrant, John Cegar - No problems with what he did here Ceglar was one we probably should have held on to in hindsight.
2011: Marty Clarke - Yeah that one didnt work out how we hoped
2012: Quinten Lynch, Clinton Young, Jordan Russel - putrid absolute putrid pickups all of them
2013: Taylor Adams, Tony Armstrong, Patrick Karnezis, Jessie White - 3 awful players who did nothing here
2014: Jack Crisp, Levi Greenwood, Trav Varcoe - easily the best crop of players here
2015: James Aish, Jeremy Howe - good players and one very good player no problems here
2016: Chris Mayne, Daniel Wells, Lynden Dunn, WHE - pretty bad here minimal return on output
2017: nil
2018: Dayne Beams, Jordan Roughead - roughie is a honest player at his best lets not talk about the other fellow
2019: Darcy Cameron - looks just a honest battler probably maxed out at age 25

Draft
2010: Had rubbish picks managed to find Fasolo the rest utter garbage.
2011: Again bad picks managed to find Witts but we gave him away for chump change
2012: Grundy followed by his two SA mates who are terrible one very very lucky to still be at the club terrible return for 3 top 20 picks
2013: This was nothing short of a total and utter failure by the club two top 10 picks and just wasted
2014: Nailed this draft far and away 3 excellent players you build a team around
2015: Had no picks again honest plodders some still at the club recruited
2016: Pretty disappointing pickup here again just the two father sons worth mentioning

Wont bother mentioning the rest because its a bit to early to tell with them.

Long story short he should absolutely hold no role or position at the club moving forward
 
Shade said:
2013: This was nothing short of a total and utter failure by the club two top 10 picks and just wasted
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Failure in hindsight. Shaz was highly touted at the time and Freeman was no slouch either. Both players were/have been cruelled by injuries, hard to predict that when they're 18.
 
I have told the story before of how I met Chris Hines' wife at an off-lead dog park after being lured into criticising him without knowing who I was addressing. I have since been reluctant to say anything negative about the man, particularly given the intimation that he is most likely a reader of bigfooty.

Having said this, I have to confess to enjoying your summary of our drafts and trades. I particularly liked your frank assessments of our crop of players over the last 10 years. You don't mince your words. "Putrid', 'rubbish', 'garbage', 'shizen', 'terrible', 'minimal return', 'absolutely putrid', 'chump change', 'terrible return', 'honest plodder' and 'won't bother mentioning the others' more than adequately reflected my own thoughts on the quality of our playing group of the last 10 years. If anything, I think you were too kind to some of them and glossed over the inadequacy of their contributions to the club.

Whenever I see you around the forum, I am reminded that given the loss of quality in my life orchestrated by the onset of middle age, I am indeed operating on borrowed time. The faded sun of my life is plummeting over a horizon that recedes with the passage of years. But that's another story not altogether relevant to this thread.

Let's hope our next crop of draft picks has us licking our lips in anticipation of their future output. ;)
 
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Moeydw said:
Failure in hindsight. Shaz was highly touted at the time and Freeman was no slouch either. Both players were/have been cruelled by injuries, hard to predict that when they're 18.
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Correct. Remember Scharenberg's form in 2018 before his ACL vs Richmond. Was tremendous. Should have been a club champion. Can't blame Dekka for that one.

We'll never know with Freeman, but one thing is for sure and that's that Hine can not be held accountable.
 

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Missing Cripps was a monstrous f up, which prob cost us two flags. Passing on jack riewoldt has also prob cost us two flags. Whilst Having recruited or traded for one Young key forward in the past 12 years - Sam McLarty - is bewildering, and could also have cost us Multiple flags.

Picking pendles Was inspiring, and has prob kept him his job all this time, along with wins like Beams, Daisy, Maynard, Elliott, Grundy and De Goey... and Smokey’s Goldy, Langdon, Howe, and Mihocek.

overall it’s a pass mark, but his reluctance to bring in a key forward, with the expectation that Reid and Cox would suffice, and the over confidence that we would instead land Lever or Tom Lynch, has hurt us badly.
 
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cityslick1 said:
Missing Cripps was a monstrous f up, which prob cost us two flags. Passing on jack riewoldt has also prob cost us two flags. Whilst Having recruited or traded for one Young key forward in the past 12 years - Sam McLarty - is bewildering, and could also have cost us Multiple flags.

Picking pendles Was inspiring, and has prob kept him his job all this time, along with wins like Beams, Daisy, Maynard, Elliott, Grundy and De Goey... along with Smokey’s Goldy, Langdon, Howe, and Mihocek.

overall it’s a pass mark, but his reluctance to bring in a key forward, with the expectation that Reid and Cox would suffice, and the over confidence that we would land Lever or Tom Lynch, has hurt us badly.
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That draft killed us we should have had 2 solid 200 game players instead we got freeman and sharenberg.

Cripps was a huge miss but remember 11 players went before him so it wasn’t just us
 
10571z said:
That draft killed us we should have had 2 solid 200 game players instead we got freeman and sharenberg.

Cripps was a huge miss but remember 11 players went before him so it wasn’t just us
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I highly doubt even Carlton knew the level Cripps was going to get to. Can’t hang out Hine to dry on that one imo.

FWIW I think people need someone to blame at a time like this. Everyone was quiet when we were doing well. My question is who’s the replacement for Hine? In recruiting it only take one trade and draft period to get things back on track. Let’s see what they can come up with at the end of the year imo.
 
Apart from a high level KPF I believe our list is up there. We are hampered by injury and poor coaching.
 
This isn’t about one player, Scharenberg.

This is about years of not addressing weaknesses in the list - KP stocks are just horrible.

- Brown and Reid were 2006 draft - both careers now finished
- Moore and Cloke father sons

Are there any I’m forgetting that he’s nailed?
 
AndrewShawble said:
This isn’t about one player, Scharenberg.

This is about years of not addressing weaknesses in the list - KP stocks are just horrible.

- Brown and Reid were 2006 draft - both careers now finished
- Moore and Cloke father sons

Are there any I’m forgetting that he’s nailed?
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Gault did well in some pre season matches
 
Kirby said:
Apart from a high level KPF I believe our list is up there. We are hampered by injury and poor coaching.
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Yes and no. We still have too many similar players, we’re too slow in the midfield, our skills are below average, and we obviously have a dearth of genuine KPFs. If you think a great list consists of players like Wills, varcoe, C Brown, Thomas, Cox, Mayne, Greenwood, Dunn, Phillips, Shaz, Reid, Cameron, Appelby, Madgen, Tohill, Keane, and R2... I’d say your standards aren’t high enough.

our shortfalls have been papered over by stars like Grundy, Pendles, De Goey, Sidey, Moore, Howe, Crisp... almost stars like Adams, Treloar, Elliott, Daicos and Stepho, and serviceable players like Roughead, Hoskin Elliott, Sier and Mihocek.

thats 16 best 22 players... and a sprinkling of young players still learning. We need 25 players that warrant a game every week. So our list isn’t in great shape
 
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I'm not sure that he's wholly responsible, but we seem to have fallen off in the list management department. We went from drafting the likes of Pendles, Daisy, Sidebottom and Beams alongside luring Jolly and Ball here to drafting Shaz, Freeman, Kennedy and Broomhead, alongside recruiting Mayne, Lynch, Wells and (ugh) Beams. Again, dunno if it's all on Hine, but there have been some huge blunders
 
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