Holden has been put out of its misery

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Nuggs Bunny

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Bathurst GTRs had RB26 engines with stock drivetrain. Just like the Holden V8s they had upgraded dog gearboxes, fuel management systems, suspension etc. Probably more in common with a R32 roadcar then the VN V8 supercar had with its road going sibling. The R32 Skyline platform certainly was not designed as a group a racing car from the ground up, that is absolutely not true. There were 313000 R32 Skyline series vehicles built with 43000 of them being GT-Rs. The R32 Skyline was an everyday run of the mill vehicle in every sense.
I don't know how much you know about Skylines or Group A rules but you're way off the mark here. Nissan openly admitted the GT-R was designed specifically to compete in Group A under Group A rules so this is no secret. The BNR32 chassis is very much different to the HR32 and ECR32 chassis of the lesser 2.0 and 2.5 litre models. The RB26 engine was specifically built for the GT-R, as was the ATESSA AWD system that was totally different to the lesser systems fitted in the basic Skylines. How many were built and whether you can buy a road-going version is irrelevant; the whole point of Group A rules was for companies to take their average, generic family car and turn it into a race-ready package with moderate and inexpensive modifications so that anybody could compete on a relatively even footing. Nissan and Ford spending tens of millions of dollars to create class-dominating vehicles made it all redundant.

Plenty of racing fans miss the variety of vehicles on show in Group A. V8 supercars become very generic & bland.
By the 90's, you knew who was going to win a Group A race before it even began, the exact same as F1 with Mercedes since 2014. V8SC had it's problems but parity within the field was not one of them and the racing is, and has always been, much more entertaining than some of the sh*te served up under Group A rules.
 

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Black_White

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The VL V8's were poor weren't they? On paper I think Brock's blue meanies had more power than the Walkinshaws.
Mine were both 6’s. I’ve never had a V8’s and really never would.
The reason I went from K to L was Holden black 6 compared to Nissan magnificent 6.
What an engine. Superb.
My only other engine that was as good was my Eunos 800M 2.3ltr Supercharged V6. Pity I popped a supercharger.......
 

edgie

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Mine were both 6’s. I’ve never had a V8’s and really never would.
The reason I went from K to L was Holden black 6 compared to Nissan magnificent 6.
What an engine. Superb.
My only other engine that was as good was my Eunos 800M 2.3ltr Supercharged V6. Pity I popped a supercharger.......
Ah.

Yes the 202 was past it used by date by then. Was a while before Holden developed its own engine again.

I think the 304 was a better engine than the 308 which was rebranded as the 5L but that went when Brock went. I have experience with neither though so only what I deduce from the various sources I listen to. Who would want too as well when you can just settle for the mighty 253.

Would have been interesting to see what HDT could have done with the Nissan engine.

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Zidane98

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Ah.

Yes the 202 was past it used by date by then. Was a while before Holden developed its own engine again.

I think the 304 was a better engine than the 308 which was rebranded as the 5L but that went when Brock went. I have experience with neither though so only what I deduce from the various sources I listen to. Who would want too as well when you can just settle for the mighty 253.

Would have been interesting to see what HDT could have done with the Nissan engine.

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Best mates old man when we werek kids had a VH SLE 4.2 V8, nice car but horribly underpowered for a V8 (96kw).
 

edgie

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Best mates old man when we werek kids had a VH SLE 4.2 V8, nice car but horribly underpowered for a V8 (96kw).
They were killed by poor adaption to emission regulations, but so was the 308. Actually every Holden and GM motor of the era. There's absolutely no way my 253 in the HQ is only making that.

They used 253 for a race series and they got much more out of them, but they were never intended as the performance engine of choice anyway. Good cruiser, almost impossible to break, nice sound.

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deanc

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The change to unleaded fuel, low compression, sure did kill them. As said though, emissions mean't they were all under powered.

Not at all, in fact my pop 'accidentally' bought a new VL turbo back in the day, which still remains one the fastest cars I've ever driven on the public road.

Story goes; a bloke at the dealership sold him a model with the Nissan turbo engine, after pop had simply asked for some extra grunt to tow his trailers around.
I recall I laughed when I first saw pops new car and asked him who stuck that silly 'Turbo' badge on the back, thinking it was one of my cousins taking the p..s - then I opened the bonnet...

Anyway, a few months later I'm driving pop back to the farm, after he'd just had an ingrown toenail removed and we get to a new stretch of road on the midlands highway which was a dual lane straight section about 4-5 k's long.
Suddenly he says; "Rightio boy, pull up the anchor, let's see what these Japs have stuck in a Holden..!"

So I put the foot down and with the turbo whistling away, to my surprise, we go from 110 to 200 kph (off the clock) in no time at all, but the increasing wind noise and rattles starts to worry me so I ease off the throttle.
Pop looks at me and says; "Is that it...?", I reply; "Well, that's as quick as I wanna go today."

He replies; "Really, Jesus, guess I'll have to get Lyn (my younger sister) to drive me next time then...!"

A few months later I read the police had recently commissioned the same models for their new highway patrol 'interceptors', which obviously was no surprise to me...
 
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edgie

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Not at all, in fact my pop 'accidentally' bought a new VL turbo back in the day, which still remains one the fastest cars I've ever driven on the public road.

Story goes; a bloke at the dealership sold him a model with the Nissan turbo engine, after pop had simply asked for some extra grunt to tow his trailers around.
I recall I laughed when I first saw pops new car and asked him who stuck that silly 'Turbo' badge on the back, thinking it was one of my cousins taking the p..s - then I opened the bonnet...

Anyway, a few months later I'm driving pop back to the farm, after he'd just had an ingrown toenail removed and we get to a new stretch of road on the midlands highway which was a dual lane straight section about 4-5 k's long.
Suddenly he says; "Rightio boy, pull up the anchor, let's see what these Japs have stuck in a Holden..!"

So I put the foot down and with the turbo whistling away, to my surprise, we go from 110 to 200 kph (off the clock) in no time at all, but the increasing wind noise and rattles starts to worry me so I ease off the throttle.
Pop looks at me and says; "Is that it...?", I reply; "Well, that's as quick as I wanna go today."

He replies; "Really, Jesus, guess I'll have to get Lyn (my younger sister) to drive me next time then...!"

A few months later I read the police had recently commissioned the same models for their new highway 'interceptors', which obviously was no surprise to me...
VL don't have the motors we were talking about...

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deanc

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VL don't have the motors we were talking about...

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Really, several previous posts mention the VL's Nissan engine, so I thought I'd share my experience - and if you're referring to V8's, then the VL Commodore was rather significant as it was the last V8 powered Holden production model to use a carburetor...
 
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edgie

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Really, several previous posts mention the VL's Nissan engine, so I thought I'd share my experience - and if you're referring to V8's, then the VL Commodore was rather significant as it was the last V8 powered Holden production model to use a carburetor...
Yeah mostly the Holden engines being underpowered. I don't think anyone here was dissing the Nissan motor?
 

BomberFan355

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Really, several previous posts mention the VL's Nissan engine, so I thought I'd share my experience - and if you're referring to V8's, then the VL Commodore was rather significant as it was the last V8 powered Holden production model to use a carburetor...
Which produced a whopping 122kw, less power and torque than a red motor 253...!
 

Black_White

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Which produced a whopping 122kw, less power and torque than a red motor 253...!
Figures never reflect the seat of the pants feeling though.
I had a Eunos 800M that was 2.5ltr V6 supercharged. It was a heavy car but when you put the boot in and used all of that 149kw, it felt fast. Never had to back off on sweeping bends because of the 4 wheel steering.
But compared to a lot of today’s offerings, it was simply underpowered.
 

edgie

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The HQ feels quick because it's old and loud and not terrible wind proof or smooth, when you put the foot down and roars it feels like you're going somewhere. The inertia is far more noticeable.

But you really aren't. The stock VY V6 Commodore would smoke it no worries.

I think the Ecotec is rated around 150kw which would roughly be the same or a little more than the 253, which was about 130kw stock, done some modifications though which hopefully added a bit bringing it closer to 150.

Strange enough I feel more in control driving the HQ at 100mph+ than the VY. I don't know why this is.

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