How do we take the next step to a premiership?

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twhowler

Debutant
Jul 15, 2020
88
170
AFL Club
Brisbane Lions
Reading Damo's sliding doors (i know, i know, what can i say I was bored) and his entry on the lions got me thinking. His analysis was, to dumb it down, lions got way closer to Melbourne than any other side in the finals.

On the one hand, Melbourne's dominance in the second quarter should have got them further in front. But on the other we got well on top in the third quarter, didn't capitalise, and still got within 3 goals and stayed there until midway through the last. Without Hipwood and then losing McStay in the first quarter.

The dogs final again down 2 key forwards, losing one of their replacement and Berry. And dominating inside 50s but not making the most of it with the missing key forwards.

In short - we really were not that far away. Such a shame to not get at least one finals win to improve our record. We don't have any obvious players who will fall of the perch, maybe Zorko but we need others in midfield anyway. Lots of players who should improve. Biggest thing we could get is more luck on the injury front. But we're right in the hunt.
 

scoman

Norm Smith Medallist
Sep 19, 2013
6,069
6,811
AFL Club
Brisbane Lions
Reading Damo's sliding doors (i know, i know, what can i say I was bored) and his entry on the lions got me thinking. His analysis was, to dumb it down, lions got way closer to Melbourne than any other side in the finals.

On the one hand, Melbourne's dominance in the second quarter should have got them further in front. But on the other we got well on top in the third quarter, didn't capitalise, and still got within 3 goals and stayed there until midway through the last. Without Hipwood and then losing McStay in the first quarter.

The dogs final again down 2 key forwards, losing one of their replacement and Berry. And dominating inside 50s but not making the most of it with the missing key forwards.

In short - we really were not that far away. Such a shame to not get at least one finals win to improve our record. We don't have any obvious players who will fall of the perch, maybe Zorko but we need others in midfield anyway. Lots of players who should improve. Biggest thing we could get is more luck on the injury front. But we're right in the hunt.
Exactly. It really is such a close run thing. Once the results fall and sporting history is made the fallout is always exaggerated.
You should always look to improve a side, but the idea that it never would have happened/ never will with that list, that coach, that game plan is a bit of a joke really. Because the reality is it almost did, not just for us but for teams like Geelong and Port last year in particular.
 

martinson

Premiership Player
Apr 4, 2015
4,838
7,462
AFL Club
Brisbane Lions
Exactly. It really is such a close run thing. Once the results fall and sporting history is made the fallout is always exaggerated.
You should always look to improve a side, but the idea that it never would have happened/ never will with that list, that coach, that game plan is a bit of a joke really. Because the reality is it almost did, not just for us but for teams like Geelong and Port last year in particular.
Winners are grinners as the saying goes.

The sporting world is full of coulda/shouldabeens every year.

Reality is that once you get to a certain competitive level in professional sport a little luck goes a long way.

Having said that no one would've beaten Melbourne this year. They were brilliantly prepared and coached , not too many missing through injury , and too talented . Had they had injuries they could've covered when you look at those who didn't get a game . Of course you get two of Gawn, Oliver or Petracca go down for the year and it's a much harder battle for them.

McStay out and Payne down early in the Dogs game really cost us . But we still had our chances to win it and didn't do it.
 

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BangyBangy

BangyBangyMightyLoins
Oct 16, 2013
3,546
8,225
Melbourne
AFL Club
Brisbane Lions
Reading Damo's sliding doors (i know, i know, what can i say I was bored) and his entry on the lions got me thinking. His analysis was, to dumb it down, lions got way closer to Melbourne than any other side in the finals.

On the one hand, Melbourne's dominance in the second quarter should have got them further in front. But on the other we got well on top in the third quarter, didn't capitalise, and still got within 3 goals and stayed there until midway through the last. Without Hipwood and then losing McStay in the first quarter.

The dogs final again down 2 key forwards, losing one of their replacement and Berry. And dominating inside 50s but not making the most of it with the missing key forwards.

In short - we really were not that far away. Such a shame to not get at least one finals win to improve our record. We don't have any obvious players who will fall of the perch, maybe Zorko but we need others in midfield anyway. Lots of players who should improve. Biggest thing we could get is more luck on the injury front. But we're right in the hunt.

You're not the only one twhowler I read it too. Don't feel bad.

For once I agree with purple's analysis, but you could spin it further too.

I know that the media will focus on the negative, because I guess that just sells, the lions going out in straight sets two out of the last three years is their focus. But another spin on that could easily be that the only teams to beat us in finals since we re-emerged in 2019 have been the eventual grand finalists.

We're not far off it at all.
 

Viceregal

Norm Smith Medallist
Aug 11, 2006
5,877
4,960
Brisbane
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Brisbane Lions
Would the pain of 'that could of / should of been us' watching other teams fail miserably where we would believe we would have given a decent fight steel us to put our foot on other teams' necks 'cause percentage does matter, inspire us to do that extra percent of effort that lifts the whole team when we came so close, make us determined to fix the lapses in our game that other teams exploited etc coupled with the proper pre-seasons into Nakia/Joe etc and the development of our younger regulars be enough to help us to inspire fear in our foes and move us from 'happy we are playing finals' to 'this is ours and we are going to take it from whoever's cold dead hands we need to wrench victory from'?
 
Oct 2, 2021
10
8
AFL Club
Brisbane Lions
I'd say at worst we are the no.3 seed going into 2022 just need to change some things like:

Making sure our foot is strictly on the necks of our opponents when we are the dominant team in the match too many examples where we turn what should've been a 50+ point win back down to 25-30 points by simply not putting the opposition to the sword

Need buy in from the midfield group defensively they got shown up multiple times this season not sticking tackles and inadequate pressure on the ball
 

Lace Out

Full of it.
Nov 25, 2006
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General good fitness across the board obv. Nakia up 30%..Rayner top 10 b and f ..Clug and Bailey going up a small notch..as in not dropping off..Zorko stable..first round draft pick coming fifth in Rising Star
 

Johnny Bananas

Norm Smith Medallist
Sep 10, 2010
8,786
11,656
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Matt Rendell raised an interesting idea on trade radio: Zorko to the half-back line to be our run and carry player. Could this bring us a step closer, by solving a need while allowing more space in the midfield and forward line for Rayner and others?
 

mattsmob

All Australian
Feb 14, 2020
735
1,192
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Matt Rendell raised an interesting idea on trade radio: Zorko to the half-back line to be our run and carry player. Could this bring us a step closer, by solving a need while allowing more space in the midfield and forward line for Rayner and others?
I don't think Zorko is capable of the run and carry that we would need anymore, also his skills haven't been up to it lately and defensively would be an absolute nightmare imo.
 

Hollow Knight

Imperfect vessel
May 3, 2005
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I don't think Zorko is capable of the run and carry that we would need anymore, also his skills haven't been up to it lately and defensively would be an absolute nightmare imo.
His disposal has become iffy but I’d back him in defensively on an opposition small forward. His pressuring is elite.
 

Dalions

Brownlow Medallist
Aug 12, 2016
11,712
16,004
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Brisbane Lions
Matt Rendell raised an interesting idea on trade radio: Zorko to the half-back line to be our run and carry player. Could this bring us a step closer, by solving a need while allowing more space in the midfield and forward line for Rayner and others?
His ball use is woeful at times, so a big no from me.
Would much prefer to give Keadien and Madden or even Michael a shot. Or a fresh draftee in Wilmot.
 

martinson

Premiership Player
Apr 4, 2015
4,838
7,462
AFL Club
Brisbane Lions
I don't think Zorko is capable of the run and carry that we would need anymore, also his skills haven't been up to it lately and defensively would be an absolute nightmare imo.
I can see both sides. I don't think it's an outstanding idea and would only be a stop gap for a year preventing younger players from developing in the role but his disposal would lift exponentially if he wasn't so tired and rushed from all those M/F minutes and he's our best tackler and best pressurer.

Actually wouldn't mind seeing it tried during a game if the circumstances lined up. You never know.
 

mattsmob

All Australian
Feb 14, 2020
735
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His disposal has become iffy but I’d back him in defensively on an opposition small forward. His pressuring is elite.
I agree his pressuring is elite in the midfield but is he disciplined enough to stick with his man throughout a game? Also he'd get caught out on switches pretty often just because of his size. Why not try it in the preseason I guess but I think we have better options for the position.
 

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jackess

Hall of Famer
Aug 10, 2005
46,309
42,169
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Matt Rendell raised an interesting idea on trade radio: Zorko to the half-back line to be our run and carry player. Could this bring us a step closer, by solving a need while allowing more space in the midfield and forward line for Rayner and others?
Would be good if he could run or carry
 

jackess

Hall of Famer
Aug 10, 2005
46,309
42,169
AFL Club
Brisbane Lions
He can run and carry as he has quite often shown, it’s what happens at the end of that, that usually lets him down.
Nah he’s well and truly lost it. That Achilles injury was the end of it. Much more of a no step hack kick type player now.
 

scoman

Norm Smith Medallist
Sep 19, 2013
6,069
6,811
AFL Club
Brisbane Lions
Does anyone think it's time J. Berry locks down the opposite wing position to Hugh as opposed to Robinson?
Yep I've suggested this before a couple times. Im a bit torn as I always imagined him in the middle fighting for clearances. The difficulty has been that he tends to lack a little bit of awareness when it's tight. It could just be the lack of footy though and with a good run at it he might return/ make it as an inside mid.

I see the defensive wing as his fallback position and one he could play very well. He is a very good runner and pretty courageous/ selfless. I wouldn't mind if the coaches primed him for that defensive (fat side) winger this year.
 

Jason mp

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Aug 31, 2015
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I like the idea of Jarrod Berry having a fair dinkum crack as a full time wing, has the endurance that the position requires and seems to lack the awareness to play in tight, McCluggage to play more as a balanced inside/outside mid and Harry Sharp to eventually(2023-24?) be another wing option.
 

mpal6

Norm Smith Medallist
Apr 13, 2008
5,627
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Sydney
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Does anyone think it's time J. Berry locks down the opposite wing position to Hugh as opposed to Robinson?
Nah, wing should go to Sharp. I'd even suggest pushing Madden in there if he has the tank to do it.

Berry should be our bigger body mid in the middle. We need him there to control the likes of Libba, Oliver etc.
 

mattsmob

All Australian
Feb 14, 2020
735
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I like the idea of Jarrod Berry having a fair dinkum crack as a full time wing, has the endurance that the position requires and seems to lack the awareness to play in tight, McCluggage to play more as a balanced inside/outside mid and Harry Sharp to eventually(2023-24?) be another wing option.
Personally I'd like to see what Berry can do as an inside mid full-time first as I believe that's where his highest ceiling is. I'd be going with a 3 man wing rotation of McCluggage, Ah Chee and Robinson with Sharp and Prior (if he's not picked in the back 7) to be pushing to take one of their spots, ideally Hugh can play 50/50 wing and midfield.
 
Oct 2, 2021
10
8
AFL Club
Brisbane Lions
Another few questions i've got actually for me I still believe Noah Answerth is in our best 22 as a back pocket so I was wondering if people still feel the same way?

And will the coaching staff pick up where they left off last season and plan to have Rayner playing more midfield minutes as I think the next evolution of the team comes with him having to make a pretty significant leap?
 

luthor

Brownlow Medallist
Oct 13, 2001
15,006
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Another few questions i've got actually for me I still believe Noah Answerth is in our best 22 as a back pocket so I was wondering if people still feel the same way?

And will the coaching staff pick up where they left off last season and plan to have Rayner playing more midfield minutes as I think the next evolution of the team comes with him having to make a pretty significant leap?
Answerth is in my best 22 if fit.

Just has had a wretched run with injury to the point of being forgotten about.
 

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