Vic How would you rate Daniel Andrews' performance as Victorian Premier? - Part 3

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Todman

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That's all well and good to say, but the facts on the ground are that they have successfully resisted attempts at reform before, as have the Education Department.

we havent had a pandemic before to motivate the parliament to resist the pushback before
 
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we havent had a pandemic before to motivate the parliament to resist the pushback before

Reforming the structure of departments is solely the purview of the executive.

It's been attempted before but it has never succeeded, so I'll believe it when it happens.

Ditto the Education Department, although IBAC have done some of the heavy lifting there already.
 
Reforming the structure of departments is solely the purview of the executive.

It's been attempted before but it has never succeeded, so I'll believe it when it happens.

Ditto the Education Department, although IBAC have done some of the heavy lifting there already.

Kennett successfully neutered both in the 90s. It can be done
 
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idiot, ive been saying im in favour of ankle monitors long before i even replied to one of your posts. the reason i opposed your idea was resources because ankle monitors are a better alternative, something ive said to you ad nauseum
Double down on the name calling I see. Pathetic response to an opposing point of view.
 
Double down on the name calling I see. Pathetic response to an opposing point of view.

no issue with opposing views. you were just wasting time. anyway, focus on Treloar today
 
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said this before, but two issues hurt him on promoting this.

Firstly it was way too late. Rather than leading the discussion, it was a response to the alp plan. The fact the plan was basically a diet lite version of the ALP didn't help either (it came off a a duplication with fewer pain points)

Secondly, the Libs response had been dominated by the idiot brigade lead by Tim Smith. If the media want a reaction piece, they go to him because its good copy. Coming out with a plan is boring when compared to shadow ministers wanting andrews arrested

Unfortunately both are on O'Brien, he needed to control his idiots, and he needed to provide leadership when it was lacking in the state
Funnily enough they did come out early with the ankle bracelets which is a policy you agree with

Not being able to control his MPs has made O'Brien look very week
 
Funnily enough they did come out early with the ankle bracelets which is a policy you agree with

Not being able to control his MPs has made O'Brien look very week

I remember that, the issue was it got drowned out immediately by his looney sidekicks. Also he only came out and said "lets have ankle monitors", there was no comment on managing the civil rights concerns (which im happy to ignore, but many on here have concerns with), and no depth on why it would be a better arrangement. It came across as a thought bubble, and the media moved on pretty quickly.

what should have happened is his MP's (and the fed libs) hammering away asking "why are you not using ankle monitors in place of the current failing arrangement?". put the govt on defence to explain why not

similar to pink batts with rudd. the real issue was never the cost effectiveness of the program, it was the lack of compliance on those installing them. the libs successfully dovetailed a govt waste narrative into the worker safety/deaths one. if you ask people today about pink batts, their first comment isnt the deaths, its that it was a waste of money.

my guess is they didnt want to push it too hard because they were afraid of being seen to target innocent battlers. it could have been overcome with some smart politics though (just off the top of my head, offer double the covid quarantine compo to anyone who agrees to wear the monitors)
 

Juddism

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Funnily enough they did come out early with the ankle bracelets which is a policy you agree with

Not being able to control his MPs has made O'Brien look very week
O’Brien can’t even control his own message...and now that it is 0 per day they only thing he has to say is “it’s tone deaf to have a scotch.” * me, the bloke hasn’t learned that his reactionary behaviour is useless politics.

He still hasn’t articulated any plan at all..fact is, people did what the premier said and so far the plan has worked, we just need to keep our end of the bargain.
 

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:thumbsu:

Its going to very difficult for the DHHS & EMV structures not to be overhauled with the benefit of hindsight. After we stop thanking everyone we need to get dinkum, e.g are the best people in the jobs that count, the best people for the job, not some PC hybrid.
A quick read of some of the submissions to the Coate Inquiry suggests not.
Inside govt we heard of re-allignment of reporting lines 'to better deal with the pandemic' you wonder if that had any effect - some people not totally aware of the reporting lines
 

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I remember that, the issue was it got drowned out immediately by his looney sidekicks. Also he only came out and said "lets have ankle monitors", there was no comment on managing the civil rights concerns (which im happy to ignore, but many on here have concerns with), and no depth on why it would be a better arrangement. It came across as a thought bubble, and the media moved on pretty quickly.

what should have happened is his MP's (and the fed libs) hammering away asking "why are you not using ankle monitors in place of the current failing arrangement?". put the govt on defence to explain why not

similar to pink batts with rudd. the real issue was never the cost effectiveness of the program, it was the lack of compliance on those installing them. the libs successfully dovetailed a govt waste narrative into the worker safety/deaths one. if you ask people today about pink batts, their first comment isnt the deaths, its that it was a waste of money.

my guess is they didnt want to push it too hard because they were afraid of being seen to target innocent battlers. it could have been overcome with some smart politics though (just off the top of my head, offer double the covid quarantine compo to anyone who agrees to wear the monitors)

Pink Batts and the carbon tax (still waiting for my reduction) was classic Abbott/Credlin 'retail politics' "say it often enough it becomes truth - which Andrews referred to"
She admitted as much, then gets all antsy when we don't see her as some kind of joan of arc meets Bronwyn Bishop in this context

They do a great job of keeping Andrews as the 'least worst' option
 

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Kennett successfully neutered both in the 90s. It can be done
Not just that. Infectious diseases hospital? Waste of money!

Closure and redevelopment
In September 1991 the Report of the Reviews of Infectious Diseases in Victoria recommended the relocation of HIV/AIDS services to The Alfred Hospital. Other infectious disease patients were to be cared for by the Royal Melbourne Hospital. In the 1990s, the Victorian Liberal Government of Jeff Kennett pursued the rationalisation of hospital services.[15] Despite strong protests,[3][11][16] the specialised functions of the hospital were transferred to other hospitals and on 30 June 1996 Fairfield Infectious Diseases Hospital closed.[3]

Since closure in 1996 most of the hospital site has been redeveloped. The northern portion of the site including the majority of the hospital buildings were sold to NMIT. Redevelopment of the site was halted in September 2001 when workers found vials of E. coli and other bacteria in the ceiling of one of the buildings.[14] This resulted in industrial action, which was later addressed. Many of the remaining buildings have been adapted for use by Melbourne Polytechnic, then known as NMIT. Also using part of the site is the Disability Forensic Assessment and Treatment Service, operated by the Department of Human Services. The Victorian Institute of Forensic Mental Health, Thomas Embling Hospital occupies the southern portion of the site, adjacent to the area formerly occupied by Fairlea Women's Prison.

Wikipedia

And there you have it, but I suppose it was 25 years ago
 
Labor have been in power for 17 of the last 21 years.
I knew it was the fault of the Premier six Premier's ago.

this isnt a "blame it on the libs" thing, in fact quite the reverse

someone was stating that dhhs and dept of edu will resist any change and are impervious to reform. i pointed out kennett did this, to both, back in the 90's. yes 25 years ago, but its proof the depts can be reformed if the political will to do so is there

as ive already posted, a pandemic aftermath is all the political will that this will need to happen (good luck any dept head trying to protect their fiefdom after this)
 

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I knew it was the fault of the Premier six Premier's ago.

Once these things are gone, theyre hard to get back.
.

Can anyone comprehend why a Hotel is just not the same thing? Ok for general isolation, but for Hot cases? No.

I reckon if extra staff are employed and sent to 'Infectious diseases' hospital to work, the attitude would be substantially changed over just another Hotel.

And the recommendation (1991) would have been under the cain kirner govt.

The I dd read the Aflred was to be the main hospital if we had an outbreak. Makes you wonder why the Hot cases didnt get moved there.
 
Once these things are gone, theyre hard to get back.
.

Can anyone comprehend why a Hotel is just not the same thing? Ok for general isolation, but for Hot cases? No.

I reckon if extra staff are employed and sent to 'Infectious diseases' hospital to work, the attitude would be substantially changed over just another Hotel.

And the recommendation (1991) would have been under the cain kirner govt

I dont know the details of that site, but sometimes there are reasons facilities are shut down other than cost cutting

people have asked why the govt didnt reboot the quarantine facility at Portsea (instead of using hotels) for example. issue is of course the facility has not been maintained for this purpose since the army gave it up to be a national park, and its a 2 hour bus trip away.

kew cottages was killed because they were frankly horrible conditions for residents. Prince Henrys because it was in dire need of modernization but more importantly its resources were needed more elsewhere (as part of Monash)
 
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This red herring has reared its head again from dan cultists.

The second wave was caused by andrew’s mismanagement and that is an indisputable fact. Fact is when you compare him to the rest of the country consequently we are the only location which has such a bad second wave.

This comment you made is akin to saying that arsonist who started one of the bushfires should be commended for calling the fire into 000. The actions dan took to control the second wave were necessary due to himstuffing things multiple times

The second wave was caused by returned travellers being quarantined by a shoddily trained private security outfit, yeah? The first lesson to be learned is that all returned travellers in a pandemic/quarantine must be overseen by Border Force, which is a Federal branch as I understand it. The Feds control the air, land and sea border into this nation, not the States. Individual States should have no role in a national quarantine emergency except as support rendered under centralised Federal control.

This is a lesson that must be learned. Returned travellers are a Border Force responsibility. Shoddy private security hired by the State of Victoria should not have even been an option.

Yes, Andrews botched the initial quarantine selection. I think he handled the recovery as well as anyone could.

Us adults of voting age will be able to register our pleasure or displeasure of his government ant the next State election. I know who I will be voting for. So do you by the look of it. Fair enough, this is democracy.
 

bonddm

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I predicted prior to the second wave that we’ll still be wearing masks at the end of the 2021 flu season and got some quizzical looks from people I ran it past. Starting with my partner, some of ‘em are now starting to think I may not’ve totally lost my marbles after all!

 

Alesana

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I predicted prior to the second wave that we’ll still be wearing masks at the end of the 2021 flu season and got some quizzical looks from people I ran it past. Starting with my partner, some of ‘em are now starting to think I may not’ve totally lost my marbles after all!


Is he basing this on medical advice or his own opinion again?
 
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