Vic How would you rate Daniel Andrews' performance as Victorian Premier? - Part 7

[nobbyiscool]

Dim Tim Wilson, the RW apologist & EX member of the HoR, on Radio National this morning was offering up his usual BS as to why Dan Andrews, & also Albo won. Always the excuses. Blaming the (ALP inspired!) demise of home ownership & the new generations not taking enough personal responsibility for taking charge of their own lives. Also Billionaires buying seats.

If its the ALP plan to reduce home ownership to affect voting patterns, the NSW & Tas LNP Governments must also be in on it too! How stupid must they be!!


Billionares! No comment about Fatty Palmer pouring in $millions to try to unseat the ALP, No comment about media Moguls like Murdock through the print media total attacks on anything ALP. Nothing about Billionaires like Gina Rinehart, also the Lie (Sky) Channel complete biased & attacks.

It appears the Party of personal responsibility takes no personal responsibility at all.

Apparently he wrote all this garbage in the Fin Rev.

Self-delusion at its finest.

As long as they keep blaming voters rather than looking inwards, I think this lefty will enjoy a lot of elections in the coming years.

 

[The Punter]

But these are the people who are trying to set the future agenda for your party and I'm not sure even they know what they stand for.

They're not doing it without a counter-argument inside the party.

 

[Crankyhawk]

There's not doing it without a counter-argument inside the party.

And unfortunately the ones in charge of the media/ media commentary appear (to me) to be the reactionary types who are actively celebrating when those who raise the counter argument lose their seats

 

[GreyWind]

In my ignorant opinion, Libs win Vic AND Federal by doing one thing - finding a way to get the teals back into the Liberal tent

Also my ignorant opinion but the "broad church" moniker is coming back to bite them on the arse, especially in inner city seats where the majority of voters are socially progressive and believe in climate change. The LNP have to run moderates in these seats with a chance to win and when you have the loons repeating these far right talking points.

• no sex education in schools
• gender is determined at birth and nothing more
• hetro relationships are the norm and are what should be supported and condoned
• we are a white nation; we shouldnt be focusing on who we took the land from, and immigrants need to act like us or GTFO
• we are a christian nation, and the faith has a role in govt

They won't win the inner city and push former LNP voters towards the moderate Teals and even Independents potentially in rural seats.

 

[madmug]

As long as they keep blaming voters rather than looking inwards, I think this lefty will enjoy a lot of elections in the coming years.

Maybe, the problem is that we really need Political discussion over policy, not over ideology, religion & the new one, culture wars. Strong robust sensible policy discussion from all areas of the body politic. Thats best for the nation.

Having sensible policy discussion is the mature operation of our Parliamentary system. Thats what is missing in the LNP now.

Dim Tim & Lie Sky are all about blaming the LNP for not being RW Conservative enough!! ie Purge the party of the lefties!

FMD! yes let's narrow the RW gene pool even more. The broad church wants to lock its doors!!!

Sand, Head, in.

 

[Ned_Flanders]

They're not doing it without a counter-argument inside the party.

Q for you

if you were given the power to do something similar to a Macklin-Bracks review of the Vic Lib party structures and systems, what would you change to get the party membership and structures to a position you think it needs to be in?

 

[The Punter]

Q for you

if you were given the power to do something similar to a Macklin-Bracks review of the Vic Lib party structures and systems, what would you change to get the party membership and structures to a position you think it needs to be in?

I don't want to appear mean spirited, but I'll keep that for internal processes. But I will say this - there will be a review, and a lot of the issues from this election were highlighted in the review four years ago.

 

[Ned_Flanders]

I don't want to appear mean spirited, but I'll keep that for internal processes. But I will say this - there will be a review, and a lot of the issues from this election were highlighted in the review four years ago.

fair enough mate - i can appreciate your reasons for discretion

 

[nobbyiscool]

I don’t think any outsiders can answer that question, cos it goes right to the heart of internal structures, branch structures and policy development.

One thing they do need to realise is that listening to the Herald Sun & Sky on policy matters, then blaming the electorate for losing, will never win them another election again in Victoria.

It’s much harder, and it requires much more work, but you need to get out into communities and sub-branch meetings. There is an upper house member that represented my area who didn’t turn up to one particular sub branch for the last 4 years. (Presumably cos they’re home watching Sky AD for their ideas instead…)

That can’t happen, your policies will never reflect the community if you’re just listening to a vocal minority.

Edit: just further to that, I knew some people at level crossings and some people in the labor party during the last election. I use Steve Dimopoulos as a great example of being in the community. There was SO much vocal opposition to the sky rail project in his seat.

He didnt shirk it. He answered every email, turned up at every level crossings event, allowed whoever wanted to an opportunity to vent - and then he’d listen to their needs and advocate for them.

And in 2018 he got a swing better than 10%.

 

[Saint]

I don't want to appear mean spirited, but I'll keep that for internal processes. But I will say this - there will be a review, and a lot of the issues from this election were highlighted in the review four years ago.

I guess the point is: Now that you've done the same thing again and got the same result, do the Libs roll out the same playbook? It seems that even if they wanted to change, they're incapable.

How does the moderate part of the party counter the nonsense which is going to come from the mouths of Moira Deeming and Renee Heath which will be amplified by Sky News?

A big part of the problem for the Libs is that the news agencies which used to spout their lines (in lock-step) are now spouting lines even more crazy than mainstream Libs themselves. The Hun running a set of stairs on the front page as a wild conspiracy completely undermined any justified stories they could run on Health, spending or Governance. Unfortunately the steps sell papers to cookers who buy the paper. Sky are even worse. In the eyes of Sky and the Hun, moderates just aren't crazy enough.

They'll write another report with clear-eyed analysis and the conservatives will toss it in the bin because they don't believe in analysis or book learning (except the one New and one Old books).

 

[Not Important]

 

[kalex6251]

I don't want to appear mean spirited, but I'll keep that for internal processes. But I will say this - there will be a review, and a lot of the issues from this election were highlighted in the review four years ago.

if branch stacking by the religious right and the shameful legacy of krogers stewardship are not front and centre of this review then it will be another pointless exercise .... kroger, and the lickspittles like him that hold sway within the party machinery, should be banished forever (and yes, i know kroger no longer holds any position within the party - but he remains influential and that is problematic)

 

[geoffjennings79]

That Avi chap just doesn't understand preferential voting, does he? Poor sod, it's literally the bed-rock on which this country has chosen to base its democracy. He should stick to eating crayons.

 

[Brad Goodman]

If it was a two-horse race he might have a point. Stupid wife-bashing midget campaigner.

 

[FredLeDeux]

That Avi chap just doesn't understand preferential voting, does he? Poor sod, it's literally the bed-rock on which this country has chosen to base its democracy. He should stick to eating crayons.

Of course he understands it, he's just hoping his potential buyers victims don't.

 

[Ned_Flanders]

Of course he understands it, he's just hoping his potential buyers victims don't.

Avi must be on the verge of announcing his new:

- crypto coin that is 100% safe and is not a rug pull

- his collection of hand drawn Dan Andrews NFTs

- Avi University, the Discord education where you too can learn the truth of the secret ALP base for Chinese invasion forces at the Dromana drive in

 

[Crankyhawk]

I don’t think any outsiders can answer that question, cos it goes right to the heart of internal structures, branch structures and policy development.

One thing they do need to realise is that listening to the Herald Sun & Sky on policy matters, then blaming the electorate for losing, will never win them another election again in Victoria.

It’s much harder, and it requires much more work, but you need to get out into communities and sub-branch meetings. There is an upper house member that represented my area who didn’t turn up to one particular sub branch for the last 4 years. (Presumably cos they’re home watching Sky AD for their ideas instead…)

That can’t happen, your policies will never reflect the community if you’re just listening to a vocal minority.

Edit: just further to that, I knew some people at level crossings and some people in the labor party during the last election. I use Steve Dimopoulos as a great example of being in the community. There was SO much vocal opposition to the sky rail project in his seat.

He didnt shirk it. He answered every email, turned up at every level crossings event, allowed whoever wanted to an opportunity to vent - and then he’d listen to their needs and advocate for them.

And in 2018 he got a swing better than 10%.

Isn't part of the problem for the liberals that the sub branches have been captured by the hard right/ religious right? So getting into subbranch meetings won't necessarily help.

Getting into general community though would definitely help. But that's difficult to do if you aren't the incumbent in the seat (as you still have to negotiate preselection etc)

 

[Lethality]

People want better roads and rails, the only people upset by the “eyesore factor” are those who live next door to it.

I don't live next to them, I object because it's a ludicrous design.

 

[Achy Blakey Heart]

Billionares! No comment about Fatty Palmer pouring in $millions to try to unseat the ALP, No comment about media Moguls like Murdock through the print media total attacks on anything ALP.

Didn’t some rich billionaire fund the Teals and work with labour to unseat the LNP and Morrison?

 

[Ned_Flanders]

Didn’t some rich billionaire fund the Teals and work with labour to unseat the LNP and Morrison?

Sadly, no

The rich dude was actually a former liberal member and donor.

As for the money, the aec records show that he provided a minority of the funds the likes of Ryan and Daniels raised. Most of they money came from small donors.

The issues for the teals this election were three fold:

1) they were not as good as the ones in the fed - lacked the charisma and personality that they had and allowed them to grow their grassroots network

2) Vic libs signing onto a carbon reduction target eliminated the number issue they based the fed libs with (climate change inaction)

3) no Barnaby or scomo. The number one phrase they used was a vote for xxxx is a vote from Barnaby, and it worked. Here guy had issues, but nothing that resonates as much as what scomo and Barnaby did

 

[Kyptastic]

Sadly, no

The rich dude was actually a former liberal member and donor.

As for the money, the aec records show that he provided a minority of the funds the likes of Ryan and Daniels raised. Most of they money came from small donors.

The issues for the teals this election were three fold:

1) they were not as good as the ones in the fed - lacked the charisma and personality that they had and allowed them to grow their grassroots network

2) Vic libs signing onto a carbon reduction target eliminated the number issue they based the fed libs with (climate change inaction)

3) no Barnaby or scomo. The number one phrase they used was a vote for xxxx is a vote from Barnaby, and it worked. Here guy had issues, but nothing that resonates as much as what scomo and Barnaby did

They also started the process later in the election cycle than they did before the Federal election and the Victorian donation laws meant it was more difficult for them to raise the level of funds that their Federal counterparts had access to. Still, to come as close as they did is a fair effort and if the networks are willing to put in time over the next four years there's a good chance that some of those seats can be won next time around, especially if Ryan and Daniels get back up at the next Federal election, as that will help entrench the idea of voting 'teal' in the voters of those areas.

 

[Ned_Flanders]

They also started the process later in the election cycle than they did before the Federal election and the Victorian donation laws meant it was more difficult for them to raise the level of funds that their Federal counterparts had access to. Still, to come as close as they did is a fair effort and if the networks are willing to put in time over the next four years there's a good chance that some of those seats can be won next time around, especially if Ryan and Daniels get back up at the next Federal election, as that will help entrench the idea of voting 'teal' in the voters of those areas.

I still think their fate is in the libs hands.

Have a climate policy, stop saying racist s**t, and have candidates who are fair dinkum.

Frydo is a lock to win again if this happens. Goldie needs to stay away from Wilson and find someone who actually fits the area

 

[madmug]

Didn’t some rich billionaire fund the Teals and work with labour to unseat the LNP and Morrison?

If you think so, how many, how much compared to the work of the Murdock media, Rinehart & the Corporate suits?.

You can post the details rather just than ask me.

 

[fs88]

The height of desperation and really insulting your voters when you think the Teals were bought. If that were the case Palmer would have 10 seats in the country given the amount he’s spent.

Being far right is a genuine mental illness.

 

[Kyptastic]

I still think their fate is in the libs hands.

Have a climate policy, stop saying racist s**t, and have candidates who are fair dinkum.

Frydo is a lock to win again if this happens. Goldie needs to stay away from Wilson and find someone who actually fits the area

I disagree. Ryan and Daniel both have had 'wins' in parliament with the Climate Change and Anti-Corruption (hopefully) legislation. If they keep doing good things and engaging with their community I doubt Frydenberg or any other liberal will get back into those seats anytime soon. Especially if Dutton remains as leader and the Coalition still has the climate-phobic Nats howling at the moon.