Hypothetical: Next Collingwood coach? (Think this is disrespectful? OK, OK, we get it)

[jmac70]

I don't see him as a development coach. He does get the absolute most out of a playing group but I'll watch with interest how he goes rebuilding the Freo side as that's his signature for mine insomuch as he runs lists into the ground. Did it at the Saints, now done it at Freo. Signs are he is already trying to take shortcuts rebuilding via trades rather than via the draft and development. And ultimately his methods haven't won any silverware.

Ultimate means last, and IMO, Freo isn't his last coaching job. I believe that Lyon is capable of greatness, and I for one would be very happy to see him steering the ship at Collingwood.

 

[jackcass]

Ultimate means last, and IMO, Freo isn't his last coaching job. I believe that Lyon is capable of greatness, and I for one would be very happy to see him steering the ship at Collingwood.

Happy to agree to disagree

 

[TheGreatGrundy]

Ultimate means last, and IMO, Freo isn't his last coaching job. I believe that Lyon is capable of greatness, and I for one would be very happy to see him steering the ship at Collingwood.

Third time lucky, or so they say! I don't find him abhorrent as a potential coach.

 

[jmac70]

Third time lucky, or so they say! I don't find him abhorrent as a potential coach.

Exactly right mate. Lyon gets the best out of his teams. With the potential of our list I would be very confident of a return to September with him as coach. Makes me laugh how some people are so quick to dismiss him given our last three years of total crap.

 

[TheGreatGrundy]

Exactly right mate. Lyon gets the best out of his teams. With the potential of our list I would be very confident of a return to September with him as coach. Makes me laugh how some people are so quick to dismiss him given our last three years of total crap.

Buckley has one more year. Only success will keep the Lyon at bay.

 

[Saintly Viewed]

Yeah that's not actually an esoteric point at all Saintly and this is now about the 1500th time you've made it.

EVERYONE gets it.

My apologies for repeating myself as often as for example you repeat yourself.


Please note:

1501st time in making the point.
A good list helps a coach

 

[Saintly Viewed]

Yes I know. Team wins = good coach = good team = success, perhaps a premiership. You have previously shown us the simplicity of the steps that lead to premiership glory.

Indeed.

As I mentioned to Doodles, im a silly for repeating myself.

It's not like this thread, or many threads, aren't the same points regurgitated ad nauseam.....
Nah, that doesn't happen

 

[Mame]

Exactly right mate. Lyon gets the best out of his teams. With the potential of our list I would be very confident of a return to September with him as coach. Makes me laugh how some people are so quick to dismiss him given our last three years of total crap.

https://thearcfooty.com/2016/09/06/dockers-set-a-new-record-low-for-reigning-minor-premiers/

They did it! The Dockers set a new record for the worst season for a reigning minor premier in the entire history of AFL/VFL football.



If Buckley had tanked to a ladder position that low he'd have lasted one season.

 

[jmac70]

https://thearcfooty.com/2016/09/06/dockers-set-a-new-record-low-for-reigning-minor-premiers/

They did it! The Dockers set a new record for the worst season for a reigning minor premier in the entire history of AFL/VFL football.

View attachment 326936

If Buckley had tanked to a ladder position that low he'd have lasted one season.

I think you are correct that Freo tanked last season. As for Buckley, I'm not sure you can say he would have only lasted one season given he is still the coach after three years of being uncompetitive.

 

[jackcass]

Exactly right mate. Lyon gets the best out of his teams. With the potential of our list I would be very confident of a return to September with him as coach. Makes me laugh how some people are so quick to dismiss him given our last three years of total crap.

At nearly 57 I've seen worse than our last 3 years and I for 1 won't be satisfied with simply returning to September action, I want and expect silverware. The problem with Lyon is that he relies very heavily on a core group of absolute stars and pads his teams with some very average players (to allow the absolute stars to get paid what they merit) and then it's those very same average players who let him down come the big dance. I'm not a Clarkson fan but at least he manages to get his absolute stars to sacrifice earnings for the betterment of the team objectives.

Lyon's into his 11th season as a senior coach and has zero silverware.

Laugh all you like.

 

[jmac70]

At nearly 57 I've seen worse than our last 3 years and I for 1 won't be satisfied with simply returning to September action, I want and expect silverware. The problem with Lyon is that he relies very heavily on a core group of absolute stars and pads his teams with some very average players (to allow the absolute stars to get paid what they merit) and then it's those very same average players who let him down come the big dance. I'm not a Clarkson fan but at least he manages to get his absolute stars to sacrifice earnings for the betterment of the team objectives.

Lyon's into his 11th season as a senior coach and has zero silverware.

Laugh all you like.

Lyon was unlucky not to be a duel premiership coach with St Kilda and he has transformed Freo from a joke of a club to a legitimate top 4 club. As for Clarkson, how can you not be a fan?

 

[jackcass]

Lyon was unlucky not to be a duel premiership coach with St Kilda and he has transformed Freo from a joke of a club to a legitimate top 4 club. As for Clarkson, how can you not be a fan?

Unlucky or not good enough...

We all have our peccadilloes.

 

[doodles98]

Indeed.

As I mentioned to Doodles, im a silly for repeating myself.

It's not like this thread, or many threads, aren't the same points regurgitated ad nauseam.....
Nah, that doesn't happen

Sorry if cranky Saintly. Of course you can post what you like and however often you like.
But at the same time I am just respectfully pointing out that you saying "win games = everyone happy with coach; lose games = not happy with coach" or variations thereof 1000 times and calling it an "esoteric" point may have briefly caused one of my eye-lids to develop a tick yesterday, not to mention a throbbing vein in my forehead.
You didn't have to post it the first time, and it was the opposite of esoteric when you did. Now that you've re-posted it 1000 times I guess ironically perhaps it is esoteric .... but only because I don't get why you keep saying it.

ps.. again apologies for crankiness. I generally love your posting and attitude as you know.

 

[Mame]

I think you are correct that Freo tanked last season. As for Buckley, I'm not sure you can say he would have only lasted one season given he is still the coach after three years of being uncompetitive.

No one could be sure because we haven't finished lower than 12th. But you actually think Bucks would've survived Collingwood going from 2nd to 16th? No chance.

 

[Saintly Viewed]

Sorry if cranky Saintly. Of course you can post what you like and however often you like.
But at the same time I am just respectfully pointing out that you saying "win games = everyone happy with coach; lose games = not happy with coach" or variations thereof 1000 times and calling it an "esoteric" point may have briefly caused one of my eye-lids to develop a tick yesterday, not to mention a throbbing vein in my forehead.
You didn't have to post it the first time, and it was the opposite of esoteric when you did. Now that you've re-posted it 1000 times I guess ironically perhaps it is esoteric .... but only because I don't get why you keep saying it.

ps.. again apologies for crankiness. I generally love your posting and attitude as you know.

I was teasing back ofcourse, knew you wouldn't take it too seriously.
No issues at all.

And in ways ofcourse you are right.
And being repetitive can lose appeal after a while.

I probabaly used esoteric wrongly, sorry about that.

ps a little crankiness anyway, can add a little spice to these threads....

 

[DWil6]

I think Treloar will be our next coach. Not before he's a multiple premiership player. May do a year or 2 as an assistant at another club.

 

[Baltimore Jack]

Results are Everything and Bucks is NOT getting the Results

Maybe your definition of results is too narrow

 

[Two Eyes]

This may sound sacrilegious, but I'd strongly consider Brett Rattan. In hindsight he overperformed at Carlton with a substandard list and has since been at the Hawks with Clarko and played a big role in their 3-peat.

Still relatively young but with a wealth of experience.

 

[Hardas]

Exactly right mate. Lyon gets the best out of his teams. With the potential of our list I would be very confident of a return to September with him as coach. Makes me laugh how some people are so quick to dismiss him given our last three years of total crap.

Laugh all you want.

 

[LeverPuller]

IF he were to be replaced...

The best untried coach IMO is Blake Caracalla. Extraordinary pedigree. Played or coached under 4 different premiership coaches and was involved in flags at 3...ESS 2000, BL dynasty, Geelong & Scott. Also coached under Malthouse 2007-09. If Richmond has a tactical renaissance, he will have been heavily involved.

If you want untested, it's him.

 

[76woodenspooners]

This may sound sacrilegious, but I'd strongly consider Brett Rattan. In hindsight he overperformed at Carlton with a substandard list and has since been at the Hawks with Clarko and played a big role in their 3-peat.

Still relatively young but with a wealth of experience.

A coach needs breathing space to try different things, get some things right, and to get some things wrong. The problem with Rattan is that he won't get that breathing space, certainly not from the fans.

Hell, look at the nonsense we went through with the Malthouse / Buckley changeover, and that was with a favourite son coming in. With Rattan it has the potential to be oh so much worse. People dream it up now and imagine the silverware will follow, but when the reality happens and they don't get silverware they'll pull out the knives quicker than you can say "Buckley would have eventually won us a Premiership". To add fuel to the fire, Buckley would probably get another coaching gig and end up doing quite well.

Sure, the transition from Shaw to Malthouse was reasonably painless, but under Shaw we won the wooden spoon, and current day Collingwood would have to get a lot lot worse before we get to that stage.

 

[76woodenspooners]

IF he were to be replaced...

The best untried coach IMO is Blake Caracalla. Extraordinary pedigree. Played or coached under 4 different premiership coaches and was involved in flags at 3...ESS 2000, BL dynasty, Geelong & Scott. Also coached under Malthouse 2007-09. If Richmond has a tactical renaissance, he will have been heavily involved.

If you want untested, it's him.

Also previous involvement at Collingwood which is a handy '+'

 

[barrackers]

Also previous involvement at Collingwood which is a handy '+'

Was it Caracella or someone else who detailed our game plan to Geelong? Not like we can complain too much with Ball or Houghton doing similar for us and the saints.

 

[76woodenspooners]

Was it Caracella or someone else who detailed our game plan to Geelong? Not like we can complain too much with Ball or Houghton doing similar for us and the saints.

It seems he went to Geelong after the 2009 season, so it's a bit moot.

 

[doodles98]

Maybe your definition of results is too narrow

Maybe your definition of results is too broad!

Webster Dictionary:
Result =
That which results; the conclusion or end to which any course or condition of things leads, or which is obtained by any process or operation; consequence or effect; as, the result of a course of action

Results are results. You can look them up. They are not, and will never be, reflected in your personal hopes, optimism and opinions about how the "progress" towards achieving results is progressing.