Hypothetical: Next Collingwood coach? (Think this is disrespectful? OK, OK, we get it)

[Antz]

Should Bucks fail to coach us to the finals in 2017 then the club must make an offer to Clarkson. In the likely event that he says no then we should go for Roos. If he says no then we should go for Lyon. If that fails go for Longmire. All four are far better coaches than Buckley because they are able to create a culture of success.

Failing that we interview for a less experienced coach and hope for the best.

Roos rates himself highly and is overrated in my opinion. What did he do for Melbourne? Not much! The game is past him. Longmire would be a perfect fit.

 

[Dynamics]

Roos rates himself highly and is overrated in my opinion. What did he do for Melbourne? Not much! The game is past him. Longmire would be a perfect fit.

I'd take Longmire over both Roos and Lyon. Lyon can coach obviously but the man is yet to win a flag and I can't see past that.

 

[Countrypie]

Ok you have completely scuppered my argument about Mathews getting unfair advantage from the Fitzroy merger .. are you happy now?. In my defense, it was not my fault that Fitzroy obviously had the worst list in AFL history at the time. I feel I was entitled to assume there would be more than 3 players retained from a whole list. I mean it is a fair assumption isn't it? Jeebus how s**t would have Fitzroy been?

Very s**t indeed. 100 pt floggings every week were run of the mill.
It was sad to witness.

 

[loki04]

Except what happens when we make the 8
Kick on

Those poor vultures will remain hungry.

At least they can feast on Hardwick I guess or they'll be someone for a good feed

Enjoying the levity folks.

We will need to go into the break positive win loss to keep the wolves at bay or the knives will be well and truly out.

2016 saw us 4 wins 8 loss' by the bye, that happens in 2017 and I think it's when not if.

Assuming we have a 12 round pre bye again then 6 win 6 loss would be ok but not great either. (Haven't really looked at our draw yet).

7/5 or better would give him the breathing room from the media.

 

[Markfs]

This post is a real head scratcher. Firstly I had to read it expecting disingenuous sarcasm as you would understand Markfs, couldn't really find any so had to re-read it as if you meant what you were writing. Then I thought you were against sacking Buckley because it was too early and we'd regret it but then I changed my mind to thinking the whole point of your post was really contained in the last sentence. ie. we as fans will need closure to avoid endless recriminations and Richmondism if he's sacked.
I think I understand your fan psychology thesis but I really hope our board don't take that into account in the slightest when making their decisions. The clubs fortunes don't ride on how us fans are coping with decisions.
I'd say it's now much clearer and more like this: If Bucks misses finals.. no-one will complain about the board calling time on him. (not many anyway). If he makes finals.. he will remain as coach and we won't be complaining about that decision either (most of us anyway). If we miss finals and he is replaced with a dud coach.. we will complain about the new dud coach, not about Buckley going. If he is replaced by a great coach.. nobody will be complaining at all(except Bucksboys maybe). This is how it should go anyway.. you'd think.

if you dont think eddie is thinking about the fans on the buckley issue then i'm not sure if i live in the same universe as yourself....and if it isnt clearly demonstrated that buckley cant coach then the buckley fans will not like the sacking and will look like malthouse fans post 2011....

 

[doodles98]

if you dont think eddie is thinking about the fans on the buckley issue then i'm not sure if i live in the same universe as yourself....and if it isnt clearly demonstrated that buckley cant coach then the buckley fans will not like the sacking and will look like malthouse fans post 2011....

You think he just makes decisions to please fans? I am sure he keeps that in mind being the political beats he is but there's no way that would be a driving consideration for him in this. I don't think it's going to be at all comparable to Malthouse leaving given his last 2 years in the job.

 

[Saintly Viewed]

We will need to go into the break positive win loss to keep the wolves at bay or the knives will be well and truly out.

2016 saw us 4 wins 8 loss' by the bye, that happens in 2017 and I think it's when not if.

Assuming we have a 12 round pre bye again then 6 win 6 loss would be ok but not great either. (Haven't really looked at our draw yet).

7/5 or better would give him the breathing room from the media.

12 - 0

That would be ok

Doubt that's going to happen

 

[doodles98]

I thought the 'sheeple' were the ones who join in the chorus week after week to get rid of Buckley, but like cloved animals, have no further plan beyond that. If you want to go to the next stage and believe yourself informed on what went wrong, then do us all a favour and make some specific recommendations regarding the next coach and justify them.

Who are the coaches who will do better and what are the game-plans?

Do us a favor and tell us your thoughts and recommendations first.

 

[Old Spice]

Do us a favor and tell us your thoughts and recommendations first.

Why do you need me to do that? So you can slavishly follow me like a sheeple?

 

[Saintly Viewed]

Why do you need me to do that? So you can slavishly follow me like a sheeple?

I like Doodles, so notwithstanding the little back hander,
Gee that was a fiunny response.

 

[Carringbush2010]

The extrapolation on unknown you are making is because he succeeds at Hawthorn, he would be successful at Collingwood. And I don’t think he suitable for the political minefield that is our club. You might take him for his coaching ability but there is more than that needed at our club.

In that case some would argue that there is no coach that could take us to the promised land. IMO I think it's a stretch to say that his anger issues or other negatives would impede him from ultimate success with us. Personally if that's what we'd have to "pay" then that's what we should "pay", give a **** about culture, would you say we had the right culture when we won it? Media reports suggest otherwise but at least we got a flag out of it

Having said that getting Clarko or anyone else for that matter is all here say to begin with

 

[doodles98]

Why do you need me to do that? So you can slavishly follow me like a sheeple?

I'd like to know what you think. It'd be nice to know if you can express opinions freely and unencumbered by any personal interest you have at CFC.
If we miss finals and say finish 10th. What do you think should happen and why? Who are your recommended coaches in waiting? and (ahem LOL).. what are their game plans and how do you know they'd be a better coach?

 

[Carringbush2010]

Happy to defer this discussion till about August and if at that time Bucks tenure appears destined to end then start considering candidates.

Certainly wouldn't be thinking about Thompson and I'm not a Clarkson's fan. Even less a fan of Lyon who just destroys lists. Not sure Roos will again grace a senior coaching role. Of the remaining senior coaches, Bevo and Richo are the 2 most interesting and doubt they'll be lured away. That means you're either chasing a lesser current coach, an assistant, or a failed senior coach.

No doubt it'd be an attractive option for any candidate.

For a lesser current coach, an assistant, or a failed senior coach. Any coach worth chasing we'd have to convince not the other way round, remember we aren't the destination club we used to be even for coaches

 

[Saintly Viewed]

For a lesser current coach, an assistant, or a failed senior coach. Any coach worth chasing we'd have to convince not the other way round, remember we aren't the destination club we used to be even for coaches

At hundreds of thousands of dollars pay, we are a destination club.
It's really simple.
There are only 18 coaching gigs going.
You want a gig, you take what's on offer or tempt fate and get nothing at all.

 

[Cousin of Daicos]

I thought the 'sheeple' were the ones who join in the chorus week after week to get rid of Buckley, but like cloved animals, have no further plan beyond that. If you want to go to the next stage and believe yourself informed on what went wrong, then do us all a favour and make some specific recommendations regarding the next coach and justify them.

Who are the coaches who will do better and what are the game-plans?

Really?

In most cases I've seen plenty of posters (myself included) recommend replacements and discuss changes/gameplans a lot. Almost weekly.

I mean off the top of my head:

- Leave one forward inside 50 at ALL times would be a good start. No matter what.
- Ensure one small forward is at the feet of our key forward as often as possible
- Get a ruck coach to take Grundy from being great, to elite
- Teach defenders to play one on one at the very least as a fallback. Shouldn't have to ALWAYS rely on "team defence". At some point, you should be good enough to beat your man at least half the time

That's just a very quick lot of thoughts. Sure I could go deeper with more time.

 

[Carringbush2010]

At hundreds of thousands of dollars pay, we are a destination club.
It's really simple.
There are only 18 coaching gigs going.
You want a gig, you take what's on offer or tempt fate and get nothing at all.

Yeah point taken but it's not that simple and I'm pretty sure you'll agree with me when I say it's more than just the coin that a coach looks for in a potential position. For example I'm pretty sure any candidate would rather a list like the dogs or gws than ours. Point is (IMO) because we aren't as "attractive" for a coach (or players for that matter) as what we used to be - even with our facilities, media profile etc etc we definitely ain't gettin the pick of the bunch!(or who suits us best)

 

[Saintly Viewed]

Yeah point taken but it's not that simple and I'm pretty sure you'll agree with me when I say it's more than just the coin that a coach looks for in a potential position. For example I'm pretty sure any candidate would rather a list like the dogs or gws than ours. Point is (IMO) because we aren't as "attractive" for a coach (or players for that matter) as what we used to be - even with our facilities, media profile etc etc we definitely ain't gettin the pick of the bunch!(or who suits us best)

Your point is valid.
About us you are pretty much right.

My point beyond merely the coin, is nearly every person that wants to coach senior AFL football will take pretty much any job that is offered if it's the main gig.

Why?

Because jobs are so scarce.

Clarkson if offered, say Melbourne, all those years ago, would have grabbed it in open arms.
If that happened barely anybody would even remember he was a coach... long forgotten in the sands of sacked coaches.

Same as Bevo (whatever happened to his surname?) he'd have taken say Brisbane, Melbourne, anything really.

Whilst ability, command, authority, game knowledge is all important, having the right list at the right time is the magic pudding that ultimately delivers results, in my view.

Eg Chris Scott, right place right time, has ability? Sure does, having the right List 2011 - priceless!

 

[jackcass]

How is it possible to be anything other than a fan of Clarkson? In a results-driven industry, Clarkson's results trump all others. Easily.

That I'm not a fan isn't a comment on his success or otherwise, just don't like the man insomuch as you can assess via media coverage.

 

[jackcass]

Yeah point taken but it's not that simple and I'm pretty sure you'll agree with me when I say it's more than just the coin that a coach looks for in a potential position. For example I'm pretty sure any candidate would rather a list like the dogs or gws than ours. Point is (IMO) because we aren't as "attractive" for a coach (or players for that matter) as what we used to be - even with our facilities, media profile etc etc we definitely ain't gettin the pick of the bunch!(or who suits us best)

Que? Aren't attractive to a potential coach... seriously?

 

[jackcass]

For a lesser current coach, an assistant, or a failed senior coach. Any coach worth chasing we'd have to convince not the other way round, remember we aren't the destination club we used to be even for coaches

Happy to agree to disagree. Talented young list and all the facilities a coach could want will make us a very attractive destination club. Your mistaking a potential inability to pry very good coaches out of equally good environments (i.e.: Bevo & Richo) with us not being an attractive destination.

 

[doodles98]

That I'm not a fan isn't a comment on his success or otherwise, just don't like the man insomuch as you can assess via media coverage.

Que? So you don't want him coaching at Collingwood because you don't like his personality?

 

[jackcass]

Que? So you don't want him coaching at Collingwood because you don't like his personality?

Among other things

 

[doodles98]

Among other things

what else? His hair?

 

[jackcass]

what else? His hair?

Yeah, that's it.

 

[PicaBoo]

In that case some would argue that there is no coach that could take us to the promised land. IMO I think it's a stretch to say that his anger issues or other negatives would impede him from ultimate success with us. Personally if that's what we'd have to "pay" then that's what we should "pay", give a **** about culture, would you say we had the right culture when we won it? Media reports suggest otherwise but at least we got a flag out of it

Having said that getting Clarko or anyone else for that matter is all here say to begin with

I am not so worried about internal factors if it is a coach with good credentials. That should silence most critcs.
But the fall out of Bucks end is something hardly touched upon.
Last year for Eddie perhaps, took us to the 125th and is running low on goodwill and motivation. Will he oversee a new head coach or will he take responsibility for a failed succession plan. Ditto for Pert. Is the board united on who should run next or will it be a messy campaign? In a years time, Gubby on the come back trail?
Those times of turnoil for our club will be a feast for the media.
One can easily see that a lesser candidate will be subject to speculation.
Can Clarkson be a figure that can take the team through those times? Personally, for all his footy nouse, I don’t think so. Having his team primed for a finals campaign is one thing, a season long of constant sniping and undermining by 'fans', ex players/coaches ( hi Mick), AFL and media is another.