Identical points- identical percentage, end of season?
- Thread starter Walt Kowalski
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- May 5, 2006
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Don't want to remind Melbourne fans of another WC related disappointment but 2017 finished with us in 8th in 12 wins 105.7% and them in 9th on 12 wins 105.2%.
This is the closest meaningful points/percentage finish I can remember in recent history, although Collingwood and Hawthorn did finish on 120.4 and 120.1 last year but both teams had hard Rd 23 games and were just focused on winning.
Even though WC were only a goal or two off finishing lower at no stage were the two percentages in line to be identical. You really need identical points for/against or both teams finishing with round numbers like 2000-1600 vs 2250-1800 so you get percentages that are only one or two decimal places. If we'd both finished on 105.2 it would've really been 105.18752525 vs 105.17353242 sort of thing anyway.
This is the closest meaningful points/percentage finish I can remember in recent history, although Collingwood and Hawthorn did finish on 120.4 and 120.1 last year but both teams had hard Rd 23 games and were just focused on winning.
Even though WC were only a goal or two off finishing lower at no stage were the two percentages in line to be identical. You really need identical points for/against or both teams finishing with round numbers like 2000-1600 vs 2250-1800 so you get percentages that are only one or two decimal places. If we'd both finished on 105.2 it would've really been 105.18752525 vs 105.17353242 sort of thing anyway.
- May 5, 2006
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Head to head is actually a poor tie breaker in the AFL because we don't play a H&A fixture.
We've beaten Geelong 4 of the last 5 at Subiaco/Optus Stadium. Geelong have beaten us 5/5 (more if you go back further) at Kardinia Park. Imagine those two teams finishing level on points, points for and percentage and the higher position going to the winning side who happened to host the home game that year.
gavaniacono
Cancelled
Reverse alphabetical order.
It would need to be a near miracle for teams to end up with same amount of wins AND exactly same percentages.
Which would explain why it's never happened before has it?
But if this was to occur, then maybe you can factor in how many wins against the final top 8 teams? eg. Team A wins against 3 of the Final top 8 and Team B wins 2 of the Final top 8 => Team A gets the better ranking.
Alternative humor response: Team A and Team B competes in an AFLX grudge match. Winner gets the better ranking, loser gets to host the first AFLX match the following year.
Which would explain why it's never happened before has it?
But if this was to occur, then maybe you can factor in how many wins against the final top 8 teams? eg. Team A wins against 3 of the Final top 8 and Team B wins 2 of the Final top 8 => Team A gets the better ranking.
Alternative humor response: Team A and Team B competes in an AFLX grudge match. Winner gets the better ranking, loser gets to host the first AFLX match the following year.
- Jul 30, 2018
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This question gets asked every couple of years and the real answer is never posted. If two teams tie on the same number of points and percentage the season is called off and replaced with an AFLX tournament.
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Play extra game in the pre finals bye
In 1993 Carlton went into the final round against Sydney 1 win behind first placed Essendon, who had the bye.
An exact score of 129-101 would have seen a tie for the McClelland Trophy. The final score was 111-110.
The end of year ladder was:
1. Essendon (13.5 wins), 2333 for, 1959 against, 119.09%
2. Carlton (13.5 wins), 2315 for, 1968 against, 117.63%
This and Sydney-West Coast 2009 were the 2 closest finishes between two sides since 1897. No other 2 sides have come within 40 points +/- of each other for both for and against. In both seasons one side had a better head-to-head record over the other (Sydney 1-0 over WCE, Essendon 1-0 + 1 draw over Carlton).
Goes to show how unlikely, although not impossible, the situation is where the two teams can't be split.
An exact score of 129-101 would have seen a tie for the McClelland Trophy. The final score was 111-110.
The end of year ladder was:
1. Essendon (13.5 wins), 2333 for, 1959 against, 119.09%
2. Carlton (13.5 wins), 2315 for, 1968 against, 117.63%
This and Sydney-West Coast 2009 were the 2 closest finishes between two sides since 1897. No other 2 sides have come within 40 points +/- of each other for both for and against. In both seasons one side had a better head-to-head record over the other (Sydney 1-0 over WCE, Essendon 1-0 + 1 draw over Carlton).
Goes to show how unlikely, although not impossible, the situation is where the two teams can't be split.
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The most likely way to have identical percentages would be for two teams to have a percentage of exactly 100.
Scanlens Man
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- Aug 10, 2017
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Thats a fair point so perhaps can only apply if the teams have met twice.
- May 5, 2006
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This is the official order:
1. Points
2. Percentage
3. Points for
4. Head to head
5. Coin toss
I doubt we'll ever get to point 3 let alone 4 or 5.
Well thats cleared that up.
- May 3, 2013
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What about aggregate Head to Head (rather than W-L) for 5. before coin toss?
- Aug 17, 2009
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That can't be right because the 50m arc came in in 1986. In 1987 Jim Stynes penalty for crossing the mark after the siren of the preliminary final was a 15m penalty. For some reason I have it in my head that the 50m penalty was introduced the following year, 1988.
- Jun 18, 2010
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how does that affect it?
- Aug 17, 2009
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Well it reads like the 50m arc was an adjunct to implementing the 50m penalty. But the VFL had 50m arcs at least a couple of years before 50m penalties.
- Jun 18, 2010
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interesting. I was fairly sure in the Wafl, where both came from, that the rationale for both lines was the penalty measurement i wonder
- Dec 17, 2006
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In the 2000 VFL season 6th placed Williamstown and 7th placed Box Hill both finished with 13 wins, the Seagulls having a percentage of 114.89 and the Hawks a percentage of 114.88.
They played each other in an Elimination Final but it wasn't a close match, the Seagulls thrashing the Hawks by 45 points in a one-sided game.
They played each other in an Elimination Final but it wasn't a close match, the Seagulls thrashing the Hawks by 45 points in a one-sided game.
Seven and Fox would have competing 3 hour lead-ups discussing the tactics behind calling heads or tails.
- Nov 27, 2000
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Just need to delete 3 and only use 4 if they've played each other twice.
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