Analysis If Dustin Martin wins a 4th Norm Smith medal and premiership will he be regarded as the greatest player of all time?

[Aristotle Pickett]

It would be a compelling case I would have thought.
He went to another level in the 2020 GF.

 

[RUNVS]

No.

He is a great player for sure, but Richmond fans really do like to overrate him. He isn't even the greatest mid of his generation, much less the best player of all time.

 

[Art Vandelay_]

No.

From the last 20 years alone.

Ablett Jr
Judd









Dusty.

 

[Aristotle Pickett]

No.

From the last 20 years alone.

Ablett Jr
Judd









Dusty.

He's got Judd covered imo. It depends what weight you put on dominant grand final performances.

 

[Aristotle Pickett]

No.

He is a great player for sure, but Richmond fans really do like to overrate him. He isn't even the greatest mid of his generation, much less the best player of all time.

He's a mid/forward like Leigh Mathews was.

 

[RUNVS]

He's a mid/forward like Leigh Mathews was.

Doesn't matter. Gary Ablett Jnr's best was better than Martin and he sustained it over a much greater amount of his career. We only saw Martin's best for 4 or 5 years which isn't a long time over the course of an entire career.

 

[Aristotle Pickett]

Doesn't matter. Gary Ablett Jnr's best was better than Martin and he sustained it over a much greater amount of his career. We only saw Martin's best for 4 or 5 years which isn't a long time over the course of an entire career.

AFL is about winning grand finals not accumulating possesions in home and away games.
Ablett jnr was an AFL great but his father, Carey, Mathews and Lockett have him covered imo.

 

[RUNVS]

AFL is about winning grand finals not accumulating possesions in home and away games.
Ablett jnr was an AFL great but his father, Carey, Mathews and Lockett have him covered imo.

Yes, and Ablett Jnr is still better than Martin no matter what you say. Martin could not have done what Ablett did in a super crappy Gold Coast side.

Also don't think I love Ablett, I think he is a shitty person, but he was undoubtably a better player than Martin.

 

[Aristotle Pickett]

Yes, and Ablett Jnr is still better than Martin no matter what you say. Martin could not have done what Ablett did in a super crappy Gold Coast side.

Also don't think I love Ablett, I think he is a shitty person, but he was undoubtably a better player than Martin.

So if Dustin wins a 4th flag and Norm Smith where would you rate him?

 

[RUNVS]

So if Dustin wins a 4th flag and Norm Smith where would you rate him?

Still behind Ablett

Averaged 25 or more disposals in a season
Ablett - 11
Martin - 6

Averaged 30 or more disposals in a season
Ablett - 7
Martin - 1

Averaged 1 or more goals kicked in a game over the course of a season
Ablett - 13
Martin - 11

Averaged 1.2 or more goals kicked in a game over the course of a season
Ablett - 13
Martin - 7

 

[Aristotle Pickett]

Still behind Ablett

Averaged 25 or more disposals in a season
Ablett - 11
Martin - 6

Averaged 30 or more disposals in a season
Ablett - 7
Martin - 1

Averaged 1 or more goals kicked in a game over the course of a season
Ablett - 13
Martin - 11

Averaged 1.2 or more goals kicked in a game over the course of a season
Ablett - 13
Martin - 7

It's not just about disposals. It's about impact and finals as well.
You don't get a stat for fending off two players at once.

 

[RUNVS]

It's not just about disposals. It's about impact and finals as well.
You don't get a stat for fending off two players at once.

Yes, and Ablett was super effective with his disposals, him easily getting more than Martin and averaging more goals as well. So he not only got the ball more but he seemed to be more effective with it too.

 

[Aristotle Pickett]

Yes, and Ablett was super effective with his disposals, him easily getting more than Martin and averaging more goals as well. So he not only got the ball more but he seemed to be more effective with it too.

If you dominate 3 winning grand finals , that puts you on another level imo. No one has done that before.

 

[eaglespremiers]

He's got Judd covered imo. It depends what weight you put on dominant grand final performances.

Have him quite a distance behind Judd.
His H&A performances over the past three years have been decidedly average by his lofty standards.
There's no doubting his finals records.

I'd have him finishing somewhere in the 25-50 range at this time.
I know that Richmond fans would try and inflate this but that's comfortably within the ranks of Ben Cousins, Nick Riewoldt, Peter Matera, Nathan Buckley, James Hird, Robert Harvey etc and ahead of Jason Akermanis, Dean Cox, Mark Ricciuto, Adam Goodes, Andrew McLeod (just listing some recent players). I still think that's being held in the highest regard with only Buddy eclipsing him of the players currently playing (so far).

 

[Aristotle Pickett]

Have him quite a distance behind Judd.
His H&A performances over the past three years have been decidedly average by his lofty standards.
There's no doubting his finals records.
I'd have him finishing somewhere in the 25-50 range at this time.
I know that Richmond fans would try and inflate this but that's comfortably within the ranks of Ben Cousins, Nick Riewoldt, Peter Matera, Nathan Buckley, James Hird etc and ahead of Jason Akermanis, Dean Cox, Mark Ricciuto, Andrew McLeod (just listing some players from the turn of the century). I still think that's being held in the highest regard with only Buddy eclipsing him of the players currently playing (so far).

Come on. He's Richmond's greatest player above Kevin Bartlett and Bartlett is top 10 of all time.

 

[eaglespremiers]

Come on. He's Richmond's greatest player above Kevin Bartlett and Bartlett is top 10 of all time.

No, that's just an unreasonable opinion.
Ablett Jnr may fall into the 6-12 category, Judd and Buddy into the 10-20 category.
I have all three ahead of Martin.

 

[Aristotle Pickett]

No, that's just an unreasonable opinion.
Ablett Jnr may fall into the 7-10 category, Judd and Buddy into the 10-20 category.
I have all three ahead of Martin.

Leigh Mathews says he's as good as him

 

[RUNVS]

If you dominate 3 winning grand finals , that puts you on another level imo. No one has done that before.

None of those games were close. Richmond likely would have won easily even if Martin was not even there.

 

[Aristotle Pickett]

None of those games were close. Richmond likely would have won easily even if Martin was not even there.

Adelade and Geelong were in front in those GFs.
Richmond were only 2 points ahead of Geelong at 3/4 time , thanks to Dusty we won that game.

 

[SpiritOfCarlton]

Very much covid influenced. Hard to tell.

 

[Danw0w]

None of those games were close. Richmond likely would have won easily even if Martin was not even there.

Short memory

 

[Noidnadroj]

Still behind Ablett

Averaged 25 or more disposals in a season
Ablett - 11
Martin - 6

Averaged 30 or more disposals in a season
Ablett - 7
Martin - 1

Averaged 1 or more goals kicked in a game over the course of a season
Ablett - 13
Martin - 11

Averaged 1.2 or more goals kicked in a game over the course of a season
Ablett - 13
Martin - 7

Won a Norm Smith Medal:

Martin : 3
Ablett : 0

Won the Gary Ayres Medal:

Martin : 3
Ablett : 0

If he wins a 4th Norm Smith as much as oppo supporters would hate it the debate as GOAT will
become a new debate … “Who is the second greatest of all time”.

And before everyone goes off half cocked about consistency etc… Martin is going to end up with 200+ Brownlow votes and maybe finish top-5 all-time. That’s a H&A only award in case you’ve forgotten . He also has about 8 x top-3 finishes in the B&F. So yeah, he goes alright week to week.


Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com

 

[RUNVS]

Won a Norm Smith Medal:

Martin : 3
Ablett : 0

Won the Gary Ayres Medal:

Martin : 3
Ablett : 0

If he wins a 4th Norm Smith as much as oppo supporters would hate it the debate as GOAT will
become a new debate … “Who is the second greatest of all time”.

And before everyone goes off half cocked about consistency etc… Martin is going to end up with 200+ Brownlow votes and maybe finish top-5 all-time. That’s a H&A only award in case you’ve forgotten . He also has about 8 x top-3 finishes in the B&F. So yeah, he goes alright week to week.


Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com

A Norm Smith just means he was the best player in the Richmond team, which isn't exactly a shock. Most players in the AFL were not playing on those Grand Final days.

 

[Art Vandelay_]

A Norm Smith just means he was the best player in the Richmond team, which isn't exactly a shock. Most players in the AFL were not playing on those Grand Final days.

No!

Isaac Smith > Bob Skilton

Richmond fans have found a way to have someone as good as Martin justifiably classed as overrated.

Dusty over GAJ.

 

[WillHayward]

It would be a compelling case I would have thought.
He went to another level in the 2020 GF.

Sure but the chance of it happening is zero.

No chance.

Pointless OP..