Expansion If the AFL expanded, where would the next team/s be?

[Papa G]

That's not it actually.

Even if you were starting from scratch, Tasmania wouldn't be one of the 18 best options. (well, 14 if you accept that 4 will be set aside for expansion, and thus operate under different criteria so only consider the heartland areas).

Says you. If North Melbourne put up their hand to relocate lock stock and barrel to Tassie, Gilligan would hire the Spirit of Tasmania and throw a week long party. He would be overjoyed.

If there was an easy way to make it happen, it would. North are unwilling and it is virtually impossible to shoot a side now, especially with the 2 new northern clubs stinking up the joint.

 

[Ned_Flanders]

Says you. If North Melbourne put up their hand to relocate lock stock and barrel to Tassie, Gilligan would hire the Spirit of Tasmania and throw a week long party. He would be overjoyed.

If there was an easy way to make it happen, it would. North are unwilling and it is virtually impossible to shoot a side now, especially with the 2 new northern clubs stinking up the joint.

For now

Frog has jumped into the pot for three games a year

Now Gilligan slowly turns up the heat

 

[telsor]

Says you. If North Melbourne put up their hand to relocate lock stock and barrel to Tassie, Gilligan would hire the Spirit of Tasmania and throw a week long party. He would be overjoyed.

If there was an easy way to make it happen, it would. North are unwilling and it is virtually impossible to shoot a side now, especially with the 2 new northern clubs stinking up the joint.

I'm sure he would be happy...

But madmug would have a fit about how a relocation wasn't a real tasmanian side, and the new entity would only get by on the back of the money received from the North supporters who stuck with 'their' club through the relocation because Tas, in itself, wouldn't make nearly as mcuh money without them.

In effect, you'll have gone from a Vic club FIFOing into Tas to get away from the docklands stadium deal to a hybrid club based in Tas and FIFOing into Vic in order to make enough money to survive.

 

[telsor]

For now

Frog has jumped into the pot for three games a year

Now Gilligan slowly turns up the heat

So long as Tas ups it's investment by another 30 million, and Tas contributes enough to the AFLs coffers to cover their dividend, they can have them...

Neither is especially likely though, is it.

 

[Balony_pony16]

Tassie & Darwin combined team... both will make it financially viable.

Monday: Recovery
Tuesday: Training Darwin
Wednesday: Team Meeting flying whilst flying to Tassie in the morning...Weight sessions in the afternoon
Thursday: Training Tassie
Friday: Training nearest to gameday ground
Weekend: (likely Sunday twilight) Play in Darwin, Tassie, Interstate, or away to a Vic club in NZ or Bangkok

How Likely...close right?

 

[Ned_Flanders]

So long as Tas ups it's investment by another 30 million, and Tas contributes enough to the AFLs coffers to cover their dividend, they can have them...

Neither is especially likely though, is it.

And how long do we keep propping up a club that can't even get its own members to bother rocking up to games?

 

[Slax]

The AFL won't expand beyond 18 teams and any new team will be the result of a relocation or replacement of an existing team merging or just collapsing all together.

The reason is participation rates for Australian Rules are pretty stagnant across the country so this means that the talent pool just isn't there. There is a clear problem now with the lack of depth and the problems it is creating in the bottom half of the ladder as teams are just so far off the pace it isn't funny, expansion would make this worse and damage the brand further making it less attractive to watch, thus making clubs less profitable.

 

[telsor]

And how long do we keep propping up a club that can't even get its own members to bother rocking up to games?

Doesn't mean we need to replace it with a Tas club that would be just as small and would bring in even less for the league.

 

[telsor]

The AFL won't expand beyond 18 teams and any new team will be the result of a relocation or replacement of an existing team merging or just collapsing all together.

The reason is participation rates for Australian Rules are pretty stagnant across the country so this means that the talent pool just isn't there. There is a clear problem now with the lack of depth and the problems it is creating in the bottom half of the ladder as teams are just so far off the pace it isn't funny, expansion would make this worse and damage the brand further making it less attractive to watch, thus making clubs less profitable.

Isn't increasing the participation rate in NSW & QLD the entire reason we subsidise the clubs up there?

If they're not making inroads, then they should abandon the experiment and just close them down.

 

[Ned_Flanders]

Doesn't mean we need to replace it with a Tas club that would be just as small and would bring in even less for the league.

How would it bring less to the league?

At a very minimum it expands the permanent footprint of the league. North is just the 9th team in a city with too many teams already

 

[Papa G]

Isn't increasing the participation rate in NSW & QLD the entire reason we subsidise the clubs up there?

If they're not making inroads, then they should abandon the experiment and just close them down.

The 2 new ones for sure. Even a broken clock is right twice a day.

 

[Papa G]

How would it bring less to the league?

At a very minimum it expands the permanent footprint of the league. North is just the 9th team in a city with too many teams already

A club in every state. Truly putting the A in AFL. Carn Telsor, turn that V upside down.

 

[Ned_Flanders]

A club in every state. Truly putting the A in AFL. Carn Telsor, turn that V upside down.

Gotta look after the heartland clubs first mate, except port who never make a profit

 

[Papa G]

Tasmania is just as much a "heartland" state as Victoria is. Something that seems lost on our silly parochial little mate.

 

[Ned_Flanders]

Tasmania is just as much a "heartland" state as Victoria is. Something that seems lost on our silly parochial little mate.

But the abs.....

 

[Colonial]

The 2 new ones for sure. Even a broken clock is right twice a day.

Wow your cocky now that port has gotten off deaths door.

 

[The_Wookie]

Wow your cocky now that port has gotten off deaths door.

Its one of the more curious facts about the industry board is Papa Gs approach to getting rid of teams in light of Ports run of losses. Never mind that just over two years ago, Port were the new favorites to be the new Tasmania license for a little while.

 

[Papa G]

Carlton now the front runner.

 

[The_Wookie]

Carlton now the front runner.

No they arent. Not even close, despite the hyperbole of the last week or so. If Brisbane arent going to the wall over 5.5 million in loans and 8.8 million in outstanding AFL debt, Carlton arent going anywhere soon because it maxed the credit card.

 

[Gibbke]

Isn't increasing the participation rate in NSW & QLD the entire reason we subsidise the clubs up there?

If they're not making inroads, then they should abandon the experiment and just close them down.

That's the front of the brochure you're quoting there...

It sounds a hell of a lot better than the disclaimer on the back page: "We're subsidising two teams to ensure that the three biggest tv markets in Australia have a live home game each week, which will make the commercial tv product more attractive to broadcasting customers and will enable the buying price to go up, therefore bringing in a return that will put every existing club on safe ground"...

$200m to set up two teams and lure 7, 9, 10 and Foxtel to commit to double the price of the previous tv rights (in this case more than a billion dollars extra) is spectacular business success in anyone's books...who gives a f### if the local bevans take up the sport or not...?

 

[Colonial]

That's the front of the brochure you're quoting there...

It sounds a hell of a lot better than the disclaimer on the back page: "We're subsidising two teams to ensure that the three biggest tv markets in Australia have a live home game each week, which will make the commercial tv product more attractive to broadcasting customers and will enable the buying price to go up, therefore bringing in a return that will put every existing club on safe ground"...

$200m to set up two teams and lure 7, 9, 10 and Foxtel to commit to double the price of the previous tv rights (in this case more than a billion dollars extra) is spectacular business success in anyone's books...who gives a f### if the local bevans take up the sport or not...?

So why is the money being spent on junior comps in sydney if its all tv rights and not boosting the participants and junior base?

 

[The_Wookie]

That's the front of the brochure you're quoting there...

It sounds a hell of a lot better than the disclaimer on the back page: "We're subsidising two teams to ensure that the three biggest tv markets in Australia have a live home game each week, which will make the commercial tv product more attractive to broadcasting customers and will enable the buying price to go up, therefore bringing in a return that will put every existing club on safe ground"...

$200m to set up two teams and lure 7, 9, 10 and Foxtel to commit to double the price of the previous tv rights (in this case more than a billion dollars extra) is spectacular business success in anyone's books...who gives a f### if the local bevans take up the sport or not...?

Figures in Queensland at least show the uptake has been pretty good in fact. Maybe you should have read the actual brochure instead of just the front and back pages.

 

[telsor]

A club in every state. Truly putting the A in AFL. Carn Telsor, turn that V upside down.

and if/when NT becomes a state, do they get a team too?


So basically your idea is that Tas should have a team for sentimental reasons...While at the same time thinking Vic club(s) should be dumped with no regard to sentiment.

 

[telsor]

That's the front of the brochure you're quoting there...

It sounds a hell of a lot better than the disclaimer on the back page: "We're subsidising two teams to ensure that the three biggest tv markets in Australia have a live home game each week, which will make the commercial tv product more attractive to broadcasting customers and will enable the buying price to go up, therefore bringing in a return that will put every existing club on safe ground"...

$200m to set up two teams and lure 7, 9, 10 and Foxtel to commit to double the price of the previous tv rights (in this case more than a billion dollars extra) is spectacular business success in anyone's books...who gives a f### if the local bevans take up the sport or not...?

a) look at the post I replied to and consider my comment in relation to that.

b) do you really think Ch7 pays massive amounts for the TV rights so they're required to broadcast many hours of content a weekend into those big markets and achieve ratings that are rates less than the VFL does in Victoria? Advertisers might like the 'national market' idea, but if nobody watches, they wont pay big money for it.

 

[Gibbke]

So why is the money being spent on junior comps in sydney if its all tv rights and not boosting the participants and junior base?

The entire country has been divided into zones for development. Of course you'd spend money on dragging talent out from wherever you can get it - if Ireland, the US, Safrica and New Zealand are in the radar for player development, then of course you'd spend what is still a small percentage of that on Auskick in the biggest population centre in Australia...seriously, does your question not answer itself? A few bucks telling the locals they are loved...

There is a romantic notion that expansion is all about flying the flag, showing the heathen the beauty of the great Australian game, telling Western Sydney they "deserve a team" (Andy's exact words), etc, etc...I call bullshit. If any of you were up here the memorable weekend in 2005 when Channel Ten announced gleefully that every Saturday Night would feature an AFL match regardless of the Lions fixture, and then got comprehensively belted in the ratings every week Brisbane didn't play, just before a mad rush to strongarm North into relocating on the GC, as well as a sudden and unprecedented interest in Western Sydney - at the same time as new tv rights were about to be negotiated and only a few years after the AFL told everyone they didn't want any more than 16 teams - then it all becomes very clear...

Sometime about ten years ago, one or more of the major networks got very forceful with the AFL and made it clear they wanted local content in all three big eastern cities if they were going to pay shitloads of cash for footy broadcasting. That meant two more teams. They don't need to make a killing on Saturday Night, which isn't the week's most important slot, they just need to be competitive against the odd rugby test and Saturday night kids movies, week in week out because advertisers want stability. Look at the draw from ten years ago up until GWS entered, and count the Saturday nighters in Qld and NSW...clear evidence of just how much tv dominates footy...