If the Late Great EJ was still alive none of this crap would be going on

[bulldogsouthern]

Does anyone agree with me that after the great EJ passed away the Footscray Football Club has gone from a club with a proud and hard working history into nothing more than a prideless money grubbing club with no passion for its supporters or history, and a totally disrespect for what made the Club so great,
Success isn't everything its the people at the club who make it great, the players officals etc and I feel over recent years the pride of the club has been abused by people who think they are bigger and better than the club its self.

 

[JUBJUB]

Spot on

------------------
"Kick the bloody thing"

 

[Olmy]

Not that I want to slag the Bullies off, cos I don't mind ya's, but one contention I'd have, is saying that the club was on a level of "greatness", in terms of success.

Perhaps a few years back, the club decided that it was do or die, time to take the initiative on and off the field, and hopefully win a few premierships along the way.

Perhaps the supporters don't like some of the changes, and I don't blame them. But it's got to be better than losing your club entirely.

If only the Bullies had won a premiership in the last few years. Things may have been different. Maybe they could have strung 2 together even, or a couple over a few years.

Certainly the premierships of '97 and '98 were wasted opportunities. Imagine if WB had pulled one, or even both, of those in!

It might be too early to say, but I think the WB are going to be in some form of on-field decline this season. They're starting to blood some good, young talent, but I think they'll struggle to make the eight. This season at least.

And as reported in the papers, off-field happenings haven't look that great either.

But what can you do? When you're the club, you have to try initiatives, or get shot like a duck in the water (ala Fitzroy).

Perhaps the answer is with the supporters. What was it about Footscray, that made the people rally in '89??? Was it the name, the players, the club, the history? What was it??

Perhaps you guys need to find what it was, so you can get behind the club again.

Good luck.

 

[Frodo]

If Adolf Hitler was alive and had won the war there would be none of this going on at all!!!!!

 

[Frodo]

If my Auntie had balls she'd be my uncle!!!

 

[bulldogsouthern]

2 main things come to mind when you ask that question, the Name change and the Western Oval,
Whats in a Name ? Its what people reconize its what people have been proud to shout out at the footy COME ON FOOTSCRAY and stuff like that, its more than just a name its a culture and for people who have never followed the club its hard for you to understand,
I feel its like someone telling you that you have to change your family name, Would you do it for a few dollars?
and the ground, For many people the Western Oval was nothing more then a scabby suburban ground with poor facilities and hardly any seats, But if you ask a Bulldog supporter what the ground means its a totally different story, Not everyone is concerned about a big screen tv, Plastic seats, perfect dunnies and so on, The Western Oval had a great atmosphere, I didn't see to many games when the dogs played there but I'll never forget the great roar and atmosphere that flooded the ground when the dogs ran on to it.
the MCG,Optus and Docklands dont possess that home ground feel,

and this has turned alot of people away,
you can stand where you want to at these grounds, you cant shout out something without sercuity guards watching over you waiting to grab you and throw you out,
There are too many snobs going to the football, Its the game that matters and if people are too worried about what the ground looks like then they don't deserve to go to the football,

 

[Olmy]

Bulldogsouthern - I agree with all of what you say. I certainly miss being able to yell out "Carn the Roys" like I used to.

I support the Brisbane Lions, and the Fitzroy Reds, but I guess I will always consider my favourite football memories as being those of Fitzroy up until '96 (even if we were getting pumped).

A lot of it has to do with becoming disillusioned. The "dream" has been broken. It's like the first time a girl breaks your heart - it's kinda never the same after that.

I'd love to see the name Footscray running around again. Just as much as I would North Melbourne, Fitzroy, and South Melbourne too (although I've only ever known them as Sydney).

I think it's a shame that this corporate focus in the game is changing things.

Realistically, all that's happening is that football is becoming a thing for business.

Liken the names, Footscray, Fitzroy, North and South Melbourne to the supporters. That's who those names represent.

Take those names away, or change them into something else, and you are going to be representing something else too. Business.

I would agree about suburban grounds too. I am not a fan of Colonial, although it is a decent place to view football in. The place has no soul though. You can't go there and say "hey this is where I saw . . . what a day that was!!". Perhaps this will change over time - but really, the whole focus of the place is different. It's all about supporters attending 'entertainment' and pumping money into the place, isn't it?? Rather than supporters going to be a PART of the whole bloody thing.

I guess the alternative, is to go and watch clubs like the Fitzroy Reds - I'm gratefull for that.

But what about clubs like Footscray/WB, North Melbourne/Kangaroos, and the others including St.Kilda and Geelong?? Those clubs still in the AFL - what can they do to maintain their history/heritage, and way of "being" that they've had for so long??

I've had this discussion heaps of times - and there's always a different answer.

I guess it all comes down to the supporters though. If the supporters can become involved, back their club, and tell it what they want from it, rather than letting big business do that, then maybe there is a chance.

Recently I've seen so many reports about clubs like WB, Roos, Geelong, St.Kilda, etc. They're all going on how they're "trying to keep their heads above water", and how they're sure that "a few teams will fail to survive in the next few seasons", and how they "don't want to be one of those teams".

Perhaps the Vic clubs, especially these ones in danger, need to get together, and look at strategies to help them stay as they are.

Geelong have the right idea, trying reasonably hard to maintain their indentity. But when you read that they're going to make a short-fall in revenue, and membership and crowds have been low at home games, you have to feel for those in charge - what decision do you make??

I say good luck to the likes of Western Bulldogs (Footscray), Kangaroos (North Melbourne), and Geelong. I hope they can keep afloat, and also keep their identities in tact.

 

[CJH]

Originally posted by Olmy:


...

Geelong have the right idea, trying reasonably hard to maintain their indentity. But when you read that they're going to make a short-fall in revenue, and membership and crowds have been low at home games, you have to feel for those in charge - what decision do you make??

I say good luck to the likes of Western Bulldogs ... and Geelong. I hope they can keep afloat, and also keep their identities in tact.

Olmy,

Reading about South / Sydney last week in the Sun (which was a good read) and looking at the continual battles of the Bulldogs and Kangaroos - which doesn't seem that different to what both Fitzroy and South went through - I had a thought and came to a conclusion.

Much space in the press is devoted to a Death Watch over the clubs most likely to keel over. In this regard, the Bulldogs and Kangaroos get more press than any of the other clubs (mostly negative), and in most cases they have this pervading sense of doom about them.

But, I don't think it will be the likes of the Bulldogs or 'Roos that fall over. Not first, anyway!

Why?

These clubs have had to struggle for years - as did South and Fitzroy - and it is an ingrained part of their culture, and oddly, it is something they do well! What I mean by this is they know how to exists tightly and scrape by.

Instead, I feel it will be more likely be one of the 'middle' clubs that fail first - clubs that don't have to scrape together a hand to mouth existence.

Geelong is the best example. Good facilities, strong supporter and sponsorship base, exclusive access to a whole - albeit small - city. And they very nearly have gone belly up once already in the last few years. Screw up again and the bank (Bendigo) may come in and wind the show up. It's all too easy!

The essential difference here is that I feel people are more complacent about Geelong surviving - "Oh, they're too strong, they won't go" - as opposed to the Dogs/Roos where nobody is in any doubt as to how perilous the situation is.

And of course, Richmond is not excluded from any of this!



------------------
Dutch Oven Tiger Tank tells why we shouldn't roast Ben HollandHow the West was won - West Coast Review

 

[bulldogsouthern]

I agree with what you say,
The dream has long been broken and sadly the game will never be the same again,
What football has become in recent years is everything that football didn't stand for in the past,

 

[Olmy]

CJH, yeah, I reckon clubs like Richmond, Melbourne, Geelong, and to a lesser extent Hawthorn (although, they could very well be the next Essendon), are in the danger line.

The first three of those mentioned, have all had long periods without a grand-final victory, or without finals success. Over time, this has to have some effect. Surely it was one of the factors in Fitzroy's low supporter base.

I think generally, if you look at clubs like Melbourne, Geelong, and perhaps Richmond, there is a supporter apathy. As you said, CJH, the supporters just expect to pull through.

It's certainly something to worry about when you realise that there's a fine line between breaking even, and cutting a huge loss in your annual budget. Do that a couple of years in a row - coupled with a lack of on-field success - and a club could be staring down the barrels of merge, relocate, or die.

It's certainly an interesting case to consider also, top clubs like Carlton and Collingwood. Although they have the numbers in supporters to pull them out of things, it's no secret that Collingwood have been in financial strife in the past, and Cartlon also put somewhat of a stone around their necks with their Optus Oval venture. Although this is a long, long way from crisis stations, you can see how a few stuff-ups, even to these clubs, could have some sort of an impact.

The problem with WB and Kangaroos is, that while they are a hardy bunch of supporters and club-people who have been through this type of before (just as Fitzroy and South), the football world is becoming less and less about the supporter.

In the cold world of "money means all", the indicator says that it will all come down to numbers.

Clubs like North and WB need to find ways of getting their supporters, the ones they have now, back to the club, as members. How they do this, is obviously down to the requirements/needs/desires of the supporters. From there, these clubs need to work at on-field success, as well as off-field stability, in order to build a serious supporter base - one that will ensure long term viability. From what it seems, neither of these teams have that, at this stage (unfortunately).

 

[Dogs_R_Us]

Originally posted by Olmy:
.

Perhaps the supporters don't like some of the changes, and I don't blame them. But it's got to be better than losing your club entirely.

But what can you do? When you're the club, you have to try initiatives, or get shot like a duck in the water (ala Fitzroy).

Perhaps the answer is with the supporters. What was it about Footscray, that made the people rally in '89??? Was it the name, the players, the club, the history? What was it??

Perhaps you guys need to find what it was, so you can get behind the club again.

Good luck.

Olmy, this is exactly the point. We can't do anything about the changes, and I reckon they were inevitable anyway. The only alternatives were merge or die.

I find it hard to believe that supporters really preferred the old regime. Sure the Western Oval had atmosphere but the lack of modern amenities would not be tolerated these days. Everyone hates the money driven commercialism of today's footy, but the Bulldogs are not the only team to have to keep up or perish. Equally we have to pay our good players comparative wages or they will leave, as did so many in the past.

I reckon that faced with the prospect of no more Bulldogs, supporters would once again rally to save the club.

bulldogsouthern, I sure hope you're a paid up member.

 

[bulldogsouthern_Nomore]

No Im not a paid up member anymore, I was back in 95-96-97, I can not afford to buy one, and even if I did have the money Im not sure that I would buy one, for the simple reasons I have emailed the club on serveral occasions and even written to them and have not yet had a reply, if they want my money then they can bloody well reply to me,
Im sick and tired of all the crap that the club constantly comes out with, oh we are in a great position money wise, then its oh we face folding if the supporters don't cought up, the club never even tried to Save Waverley Park (and they did play there each year at least twice) so much for looking after the clubs supporters in the South East!
so until they actually do something for the supporters and stop taking them for granted then I couldn't care less what happends, Im so pissed off with the current state of the game that I really don't care what happends anymore,

 

[Grendel]

Originally posted by Frodo:
If my Auntie had balls she'd be my uncle!!!

My Uncle had balls, now hes my Aunty!

 

[mr a]

ej was an arseh*le

 

[jaworski]

EJ an arseh*le?? Yeah, I'll go with that.

------------------
You only have one year to prove yourself.