Harry Hook
Team Captain
- Sep 30, 2016
- 375
- 119
- AFL Club
- North Melbourne
Dick Casey remains the VFL man of mystery.
Played in 2 losing grand finals for South Melbourne in the 1900s and suspended for 16 weeks yet no one has been able to track this bloke down.
I've done some preliminary research on the Inaccuracy thread but still no further. So I've started a thread for this particular bloke.
This is the stuff that is has been discovered so far:
Stephen Rodgers from the AFL said this:
"1. "Dick" Richard James Casey
Born between 25/5/1881 and 8/7/1881. Died aged 16/4/1919. Age 37 (Flu)
Whilst Col has got born between 25-5-1881 and 8-7-1881, I've actually got in my remarks born between 17-4-1881 and 9-19-1881
I did a heap of research on him years ago, and don't know where those notes are now - but seem to recall an adopted name, that could have been part of the puzzle - it may be Carrick, but again, not sure."
Croucher said this:
Casey was in Tas for 1913 season - arrival to coach City in the NTFA
http://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/152890995
note from early in 1914 season that he'd been cleared back to Victoria
http://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/152709615
I said this:
"I think I've the skeleton of Casey's family tree ( from Casey's time at least).
Richard \Dick Casey marries Mary Catherine Goodwin
cf notice in the Age in 1940 recording Mrs Casey's death at age 55, which suggests she was born in 1885
http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article204421281
This notice refers to her brother Thomas and her sister Alice O'Laughlin.
This notice also records that she had 8 children
Mary (said to be one Mrs McPerson, another notice credits Agnes to be Mrs McPerson but that variation is of little import)
Alice who marries the son of Billy Gent, W Gent, and has 4 children and dies in 1945 ( Record 2 June 1945 )
James Thomas who is made executor of his mother's will and whose name is recorded as James Thomas Casey). He is also active in Labour Party politics.
Agnes
Catherine
Josephine
Eileen
Teresa
Now the oddities.
If you look at the death notice of Dick Casey set out a post or two above, daughters Eileen and Teresa are not mentioned. This may be because she was pregnant at the time. She may have remarried although there is nothing to suggest this. I cannot supply the answer.
A mother with 6 kids and 2 on the way may indeed be the subject of some support as it is recorded the VFL and other organisations provided. She may also have then, as it may be the case from the address in Dick's death notice have moved under the wing of the greater Casey family at Moray Street in South Melbourne as a result of the untimely death of her husband due to influenza.
The death notice for Dick Casey records no siblings of Dick which is strange.
Besides being a tragic story ( probably no less tragic than any other from the flu at that time, this offers us some clues as to how to get Dick's details of date of birth and parentage, if it is possible, being:
(a) Birth certificates of the respective children will record particulars of the father. There are 8 children so there should be ample evidence there.
(b) Family trees, to the extent any have been done;
(c) Probate details in relation to the death of Mrs Casey;
(d) Post office directories\electoral roll searches of the individual and his family and of those living at 126 Moray Street.
Now I found this intriguing, possibly incorrect or irrelevant post,on geneological forum in relation to the Casy family, which I reproduce below in its entirety:
"Hello From NZ
My Great Granny had a half brother Richard Baxter Casey born in Cork
Ireland. I have recently traced him to Australia where he married Mary
Elizabeth Chaplin--( Born Cork--) in 1873.
They had 6 children that I know of
Edward Chaplin Casey 1874 Beechworth
Henrietta Casey 1875 Worhouly
Ada Mary Casey 1878 Whorhouly
Leslie Walter Casey
Richard Baxter Casey 1885 Melbourne
Frederick George Casey 1888 Richmond"
For those interested Worhouly is in the Wangaratta area.
What interested me was in the Ancestry searches ( such as I could do them on Casey and 126 Moray Street South Melbourne. the first 2 entries were the gravestone of Leslie Walter Casey 1883 -1949 and the death certificate ( which I could not read as I do not have access to Ancestry) of one Lesley Walter Casey 1882 -1949) which would appear to be the same person and those two references, could match the above post which I've set out.
Incidentally that search also comes up with electoral roll searches of Mary Catherine Casey in about 1927 and James Thomas Joseph Casey.
The answer to Dick Casey's date of birth is likely not found in his football career. That tells you only that he played for South Melbourne and before that Brunswick ( and first appears , it is assumed, for Brunswick in 1899).
Even if he started at 17 in 1899, that would suggest a birthdate of 1882."
I also said this:
"On Dick Casey, I've approached his case from a different angle.
Firstly look at the death notice dated 17 April 1919 again:
http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article155208883
It says he was 37 at his date of death. All Wikipedia records state he was born in circa 1883 when mathematically there is much chance or more that he was born in 1882.
Why is that important? It puts his start date at Brunswick at age 17 not 16 which in my view is far more logical.
Now also look at the address nominated in the death notice of 126 Moray Street South Melbourne. That in my view adds an addition tool for us.
I don't have full ancestry access but when I searched the name Casey with the address 126 Moray Street South Melbourne there came up a number of references including birth details of one Leslie Walter Casey (1883 to 1949) and his death certificate.
Again why is this significant. From recollection, in one of my previous posts, I pointed out that a W Casey (not the Carlton player, I'm assuming) played with R Casey in the Brunswick team in years 1901 onwards. If there is family link, the death certificate of LW would give additional detail as to parentage as well as may disprove the 1883 date.
Moreover the Death Notice lists his children as, presumably in descending age order as Mary, Alice, James, Agnes, Katie, Eileen, and Josie(I think). If one does the ancestry search using the address 126 Moray Street as the filter with the name Casey, some of these names of the children appear. I've also posted details of one of his children's deaths in 1945 earlier that correlates with this.
Interestingly Richard James Casey is listed in the free searches I do, in his electoral roll searches as living at an address in the City and not South Melbourne. This also may be consistent with his family returning to the family home when he (Dick) got influenza.
What is crucial though is the address nominated by Casey's wife of Moray Street. It appears to have been the family home.
What then makes the debate a little more interesting is the funeral notice of our man in the Age of 17 April 1919
http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article155208968
which lists his name as James Richard Casey while giving the same address and football playing background ( and not Richard James Casey)."
I also said this:
"Had another run at Dick Casey focussing on when he started at Brunswick. According to my searches today a Casey was amongst the best players for Brunswick in 1899 but was not there in 1898.
Moreover, a Casey for Carlton ( William O Casey) from Brunswick played in 1899 so that eliminates the possibility he returned.
Also interesting is the fact that in 1898, Brunswick struggled for numbers but that in 1899, when Casey arrived, their improvement was noted as a club.
Also I ran a search on whether William O Casey was connected to Dick Casey, ie as a brother but there were no references to that either.
Lastly I happened upon a story about one Robertson of Brunswick in 1899 who was so keen to play he walked 5 miles and took a train to play. This indicates that Brunswick were casting a wide net.
So if Casey did start in 1899, he would have been 15 to 16 if his dob was 1883 and his youth is never remarked upon either.
What this establishes in my mind is we have to cast our net wider. We have focussed on Casey the South Melbourne player but he was already experienced by then. His Brunswick history may be the key to establishing his background.
Then I did a specific search of 2 Brunswick newspapers during World War 1 for references to Casey in football. The references I found were to William O Casey and I couldn't find any to D Casey or R Casey or brother footballers."
I also said this:
"Did another battery of searches for Dick Casey. From 1900 it seems that he was involved in a competitive cricket, football, politics and was closely aligned to the Brunswick area as well as being involved in one or two incidents\scandals along the way. But one thing that was absent was any real biographical reports and even the the reports of his death are relatively sparse with it becoming of some interest only as a result of him living a widow and 4 children.
There are no reports of him having a brother or sister or even his place of birth.
After his death you get a few retrospectives but again little that can give one a clue as to who he was besides one "Dick Casey". It is almost as if it was planned.
But he is likely to have had family who were resident in Melbourne at that time and it may be easier to locate his dob through his family, ie through a family address crossreferenced with his electoral role.
Bottom line is he didn't leave Melbourne until a stint in Tasmania in the 1910s."
I also said this:
"A "Casey" was involved with Brunswick football club as early as 1892.
A J Casey was awarded a silver pot for Forward play to one J Casey.
http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article66900059
It's not our man who would then have been playing from 1892 to 1910 plus. Is it a coincidence then?
The Coburg Leader which runs from 1890 to 1913 covers Brunswick football. A Casey is mentioned in a match report in 1890 and appears to continues until at least 1895.
http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article66896306
A John Casey carter of Champ Street Coburg is mentioned in this report of the CL in 1893
http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article66901840
A W Casey is mentioned in this report in the CL in 1895
http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article66814161
There then seems to be a gap and then a Casey appears in the Brunswick team in 1899 (presumably R):
http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article66816414
Then a JF Casey is listed as making a donation to Brunswick in 1900
http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article66818044
Interestingly 2 Caseys a "W", a defender, and a "R" , a forward and presumably our man, appear for Brunswick in 1902
http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article67425214
In 1903 the forward Casey, presumably our man, was Brunswick Captain
http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article67427025
Casey was playing in 1904 as this reference to R Caseyin relation to a report suggests
http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article67429374
Intriguingly the Mayor of Brunswick weighs in with this report about Jim Casey, who may be our 1890 man.
http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article66825447
Other newspapers suggest a Casey was at South Brunswick in 1889
http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article197324703
The Age
So what does this all prove?
It establishes that Casey as he called himself was at Brunswick from possibly 1900 and that previous Caseys were at Brunswick.
I'm assuming that Casey in 1900 was living with his relatives so we possibly have an area connection of Brunswick with Casey."
More data to follow in the next post.
Played in 2 losing grand finals for South Melbourne in the 1900s and suspended for 16 weeks yet no one has been able to track this bloke down.
I've done some preliminary research on the Inaccuracy thread but still no further. So I've started a thread for this particular bloke.
This is the stuff that is has been discovered so far:
Stephen Rodgers from the AFL said this:
"1. "Dick" Richard James Casey
Born between 25/5/1881 and 8/7/1881. Died aged 16/4/1919. Age 37 (Flu)
Whilst Col has got born between 25-5-1881 and 8-7-1881, I've actually got in my remarks born between 17-4-1881 and 9-19-1881
I did a heap of research on him years ago, and don't know where those notes are now - but seem to recall an adopted name, that could have been part of the puzzle - it may be Carrick, but again, not sure."
Croucher said this:
Casey was in Tas for 1913 season - arrival to coach City in the NTFA
http://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/152890995
note from early in 1914 season that he'd been cleared back to Victoria
http://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/152709615
I said this:
"I think I've the skeleton of Casey's family tree ( from Casey's time at least).
Richard \Dick Casey marries Mary Catherine Goodwin
cf notice in the Age in 1940 recording Mrs Casey's death at age 55, which suggests she was born in 1885
http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article204421281
This notice refers to her brother Thomas and her sister Alice O'Laughlin.
This notice also records that she had 8 children
Mary (said to be one Mrs McPerson, another notice credits Agnes to be Mrs McPerson but that variation is of little import)
Alice who marries the son of Billy Gent, W Gent, and has 4 children and dies in 1945 ( Record 2 June 1945 )
James Thomas who is made executor of his mother's will and whose name is recorded as James Thomas Casey). He is also active in Labour Party politics.
Agnes
Catherine
Josephine
Eileen
Teresa
Now the oddities.
If you look at the death notice of Dick Casey set out a post or two above, daughters Eileen and Teresa are not mentioned. This may be because she was pregnant at the time. She may have remarried although there is nothing to suggest this. I cannot supply the answer.
A mother with 6 kids and 2 on the way may indeed be the subject of some support as it is recorded the VFL and other organisations provided. She may also have then, as it may be the case from the address in Dick's death notice have moved under the wing of the greater Casey family at Moray Street in South Melbourne as a result of the untimely death of her husband due to influenza.
The death notice for Dick Casey records no siblings of Dick which is strange.
Besides being a tragic story ( probably no less tragic than any other from the flu at that time, this offers us some clues as to how to get Dick's details of date of birth and parentage, if it is possible, being:
(a) Birth certificates of the respective children will record particulars of the father. There are 8 children so there should be ample evidence there.
(b) Family trees, to the extent any have been done;
(c) Probate details in relation to the death of Mrs Casey;
(d) Post office directories\electoral roll searches of the individual and his family and of those living at 126 Moray Street.
Now I found this intriguing, possibly incorrect or irrelevant post,on geneological forum in relation to the Casy family, which I reproduce below in its entirety:
"Hello From NZ
My Great Granny had a half brother Richard Baxter Casey born in Cork
Ireland. I have recently traced him to Australia where he married Mary
Elizabeth Chaplin--( Born Cork--) in 1873.
They had 6 children that I know of
Edward Chaplin Casey 1874 Beechworth
Henrietta Casey 1875 Worhouly
Ada Mary Casey 1878 Whorhouly
Leslie Walter Casey
Richard Baxter Casey 1885 Melbourne
Frederick George Casey 1888 Richmond"
For those interested Worhouly is in the Wangaratta area.
What interested me was in the Ancestry searches ( such as I could do them on Casey and 126 Moray Street South Melbourne. the first 2 entries were the gravestone of Leslie Walter Casey 1883 -1949 and the death certificate ( which I could not read as I do not have access to Ancestry) of one Lesley Walter Casey 1882 -1949) which would appear to be the same person and those two references, could match the above post which I've set out.
Incidentally that search also comes up with electoral roll searches of Mary Catherine Casey in about 1927 and James Thomas Joseph Casey.
The answer to Dick Casey's date of birth is likely not found in his football career. That tells you only that he played for South Melbourne and before that Brunswick ( and first appears , it is assumed, for Brunswick in 1899).
Even if he started at 17 in 1899, that would suggest a birthdate of 1882."
I also said this:
"On Dick Casey, I've approached his case from a different angle.
Firstly look at the death notice dated 17 April 1919 again:
http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article155208883
It says he was 37 at his date of death. All Wikipedia records state he was born in circa 1883 when mathematically there is much chance or more that he was born in 1882.
Why is that important? It puts his start date at Brunswick at age 17 not 16 which in my view is far more logical.
Now also look at the address nominated in the death notice of 126 Moray Street South Melbourne. That in my view adds an addition tool for us.
I don't have full ancestry access but when I searched the name Casey with the address 126 Moray Street South Melbourne there came up a number of references including birth details of one Leslie Walter Casey (1883 to 1949) and his death certificate.
Again why is this significant. From recollection, in one of my previous posts, I pointed out that a W Casey (not the Carlton player, I'm assuming) played with R Casey in the Brunswick team in years 1901 onwards. If there is family link, the death certificate of LW would give additional detail as to parentage as well as may disprove the 1883 date.
Moreover the Death Notice lists his children as, presumably in descending age order as Mary, Alice, James, Agnes, Katie, Eileen, and Josie(I think). If one does the ancestry search using the address 126 Moray Street as the filter with the name Casey, some of these names of the children appear. I've also posted details of one of his children's deaths in 1945 earlier that correlates with this.
Interestingly Richard James Casey is listed in the free searches I do, in his electoral roll searches as living at an address in the City and not South Melbourne. This also may be consistent with his family returning to the family home when he (Dick) got influenza.
What is crucial though is the address nominated by Casey's wife of Moray Street. It appears to have been the family home.
What then makes the debate a little more interesting is the funeral notice of our man in the Age of 17 April 1919
http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article155208968
which lists his name as James Richard Casey while giving the same address and football playing background ( and not Richard James Casey)."
I also said this:
"Had another run at Dick Casey focussing on when he started at Brunswick. According to my searches today a Casey was amongst the best players for Brunswick in 1899 but was not there in 1898.
Moreover, a Casey for Carlton ( William O Casey) from Brunswick played in 1899 so that eliminates the possibility he returned.
Also interesting is the fact that in 1898, Brunswick struggled for numbers but that in 1899, when Casey arrived, their improvement was noted as a club.
Also I ran a search on whether William O Casey was connected to Dick Casey, ie as a brother but there were no references to that either.
Lastly I happened upon a story about one Robertson of Brunswick in 1899 who was so keen to play he walked 5 miles and took a train to play. This indicates that Brunswick were casting a wide net.
So if Casey did start in 1899, he would have been 15 to 16 if his dob was 1883 and his youth is never remarked upon either.
What this establishes in my mind is we have to cast our net wider. We have focussed on Casey the South Melbourne player but he was already experienced by then. His Brunswick history may be the key to establishing his background.
Then I did a specific search of 2 Brunswick newspapers during World War 1 for references to Casey in football. The references I found were to William O Casey and I couldn't find any to D Casey or R Casey or brother footballers."
I also said this:
"Did another battery of searches for Dick Casey. From 1900 it seems that he was involved in a competitive cricket, football, politics and was closely aligned to the Brunswick area as well as being involved in one or two incidents\scandals along the way. But one thing that was absent was any real biographical reports and even the the reports of his death are relatively sparse with it becoming of some interest only as a result of him living a widow and 4 children.
There are no reports of him having a brother or sister or even his place of birth.
After his death you get a few retrospectives but again little that can give one a clue as to who he was besides one "Dick Casey". It is almost as if it was planned.
But he is likely to have had family who were resident in Melbourne at that time and it may be easier to locate his dob through his family, ie through a family address crossreferenced with his electoral role.
Bottom line is he didn't leave Melbourne until a stint in Tasmania in the 1910s."
I also said this:
"A "Casey" was involved with Brunswick football club as early as 1892.
A J Casey was awarded a silver pot for Forward play to one J Casey.
http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article66900059
It's not our man who would then have been playing from 1892 to 1910 plus. Is it a coincidence then?
The Coburg Leader which runs from 1890 to 1913 covers Brunswick football. A Casey is mentioned in a match report in 1890 and appears to continues until at least 1895.
http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article66896306
A John Casey carter of Champ Street Coburg is mentioned in this report of the CL in 1893
http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article66901840
A W Casey is mentioned in this report in the CL in 1895
http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article66814161
There then seems to be a gap and then a Casey appears in the Brunswick team in 1899 (presumably R):
http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article66816414
Then a JF Casey is listed as making a donation to Brunswick in 1900
http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article66818044
Interestingly 2 Caseys a "W", a defender, and a "R" , a forward and presumably our man, appear for Brunswick in 1902
http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article67425214
In 1903 the forward Casey, presumably our man, was Brunswick Captain
http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article67427025
Casey was playing in 1904 as this reference to R Caseyin relation to a report suggests
http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article67429374
Intriguingly the Mayor of Brunswick weighs in with this report about Jim Casey, who may be our 1890 man.
http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article66825447
Other newspapers suggest a Casey was at South Brunswick in 1889
http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article197324703
The Age
So what does this all prove?
It establishes that Casey as he called himself was at Brunswick from possibly 1900 and that previous Caseys were at Brunswick.
I'm assuming that Casey in 1900 was living with his relatives so we possibly have an area connection of Brunswick with Casey."
More data to follow in the next post.
"
