- Jul 30, 2018
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if the nation state collapses who funds Medicare / NHS? The welfare state requires the nation state. Arguing for its collapse asserts a dog-eat-dog libertarian position.
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#indyref2 Scotland and the second independence referendum
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Wow you are right out there aren't you?
One of the truely evil parts of the EU is its CAP subsidies that make up about 1/2 its budget of the EU at 60 billion, so the UK is hardly the biggest recipient, which like most of your post is wrong.
It causes famine and poverty in the third world and rewards mostly Dukes like the Duke of Norfolk in the uk the largest landholder in the UK and he very rich as well. It causes environmental damage and rewards the Mafia
Don't believe me? Believe king of the lefties
The one good thing about Brexit? Leaving the EU’s disgraceful farming system | George Monbiot
The government’s proposals are a big improvement, but still fatally flawed, says Guardian columnist George Monbiotwww.theguardian.com
So no the UK shouldn't continue this stoopid scheme.
Again nothing you have said disputes Billions of pounds bleeds to the EU from the UK
You simply do not know enough to make a comment on CAP. You just trawled the internet for an article and pasted it here. The situation regarding CAP in the UK and CAP in general is entirely UK's fault. The EC is pressing for a reform in CAP for the past 15 years, without success. This is my argument with meds where i showed the evidence of corruption in West Minister which is entirely responsible for the disgrace of CAP in the UK
Brexit - The UK referendum on leaving the EU - Reneging, reshmeging!
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The EU commission has repeatedly asked England to apply a ceiling on CAP payments to prevent wealthy people from exploiting the system in England, Westminister has reportedly rejected the EC recommendations. The EC can only recommend, it doesnt have a mandate to force the decision. Most of the lands controlled by rich Saudis and Qataris get the subsidies, in England. The system works perfectly fine in Scotland/Wales and N.I where the ceiling is applied.
This is the exact debate medusala was making eventually he left the argument knowing he was wrong. The situation with CAP in the ENGLAND is indeed terrible, thanks to the English government ignoring the EC policy recommendations.
You have actually proven why EC policy recommendations should be taken seriously actually.
If you wish to rant about the money UK pays to the EU, then lets do it, sector by sector. You want to rant about evil EU ignoring the corruption in west minister? why doesn't west minister apply a ceiling on CAP payments letting bigger landowners exploit the system? ask yourself that first.
A reform in CAP is indeed needed, blind googling won't lead you anywhere. Learn why and how CAP was introduced. Why CAP works pefectly fine france, germany and spain but not in the UK???
Why is that every single attempt at reforming CAP been vetoed by the UK? nothing to do with lobbying is it??? politicans in bed with rich Saudis and you don't see it?
And i am right, UK is the top 5 receipent in CAP payments in the EU
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- Jul 13, 2015
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But there will be a negative economic impact. Between 1 and 5% of GDP seems the economic consensus.
Brexit - the economic impact: A meta-analysis
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It's not a smart economic decision.
What is Europe's economy like in 10 years? At the moment Germany and UK and to an extent France sustains the entire lot. When the UK goes if there is no open market for trade then Europe loses badly too.
And how do Germans react when asked to shoulder even more of the load?
Both sides lose massively if sensible agreements cant be made. And they will be made. Once the grandstanding politicians stop beating their chests.
I do not mean that nation states will completely cease to exist literally. I mean they will exist in an union or orbit. If you combine US/EU/China/India, these countries make up more than 60 percent of the population and more than 65 percent of the worlds GDP. What do you think the US is? an empire. So are the EU. It is unlikely that any other entity is going to make an appearance at this late stage. Africa is too weak, Japan too disliked, Russia too moribund and disliked, South America too disorganised. So these four are the regional hubs that will exert an inexorable and increasing economic gravity on their locale and the wider world.
Eventually, every nation state in the world will be directly absorbed by one of the regional entities above, or orbit them so closely, that it’s fate will be almost indistinguishable from absorbtion; just as Norway, Iceland, Switzerland and Turkey (and of course soon the UK) orbit the EU and align to it’s rules just like Mehico and canda does with the US.
- Jul 30, 2018
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The US is not an empire in the classical sense, only in a figurative sense in that it is a sole hegemon that occasionally projects its power through warfare. But places like Iraq and Afghanistan aren’t subjugated the way the Khans and Caesars did it, nor do they earn the status of “American” as a result of their conquest.
The question in hand was whether there is a difference between the British Union (ie. the United Kingdom of Great Britain and [Northern] Ireland) and the European Union. How you can think that generations upon generations understanding themselves as part of a British nation is irrelevant is beyond me.
They have far reaching influences almost everywhere in the world. Cue the WTO, there is no arbitration court anymore, thanks to the US, which poses a massive problem for the UK incase EU vetoes any proposal, UK is literally stuffed there.
No one said it's irrelevant and i am not talking about the result. I am saying people have voted to stay in the EU and they must be given a chance to decide their own fate. If they wish to leave so be it, but they can't do so without West Ministers approval. That's the very point. Same gripe as Britishers have against the EU, sovereignty.
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The history of the WTO/GATT and the TP trade deals show that they merely formalise cashflow in favour of the bigger trading blocs. We have decades of precedent here.
Given it's taken 3 years just to get to a point where Brexit negotiations can re-start, the idea that the UK can simply negotiate hundreds of trade deals, quickly, at terms better than they currently can in a trading bloc is optimistic in the extreme.
Liam Fox promised to sign 50 MOU's before 2020! at present they have 5 and none with countries that actually matter.
The fact that BoJo wants to sign a trade deal by 2020 shows he has NFI. Any trade deal atleast takes 48 months to negotiate and sign and EU follows a 33 step negotiation process and calculations which atleast takes 3 years. Australia is still waiting for an EU response for 6 years now, it might be signed by 2020. These morons have no practical experience, just fooling the public.
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it’s very funny that the EU’s Byzantine, inefficient and intractable bureaucracy is an argument for remaining in it.
Then you had no basis for picking an argument with me. Go do something more useful with my time.
A bureaucratic government, who would have thought? still the arguments for EU are far stronger than against! except for Greece all nations have majority supporting the EU , so your opinion matters less.
You have zero ability to understand anything. If people want a referendum, they should get it. Circumstances have changed and they can choose to remain or leave, is not the point but the OPTION to decide their own fate is the main point here. From my last few visits in Scotland, i think the opinions have changed drastically, it will be a lot closer than people think,
Are you linking popular support with the strength of the argument?
But but but...sovereignty, people power...remember? referendum blah blah...you were crying about it for 3 years.
Ah, I think you've just realised the hole you made for yourself with that one. As I'm sure you've figured out by now, your logic in that post would lead us to the conclusion that the leave campaign had the stronger argument in Britain. Don't worry, I won't tell anyone.
Ah, I think you've just realised the hole you made for yourself with that one. As I'm sure you've figured out by now, your logic in that post would lead us to the conclusion that the leave campaign had the stronger argument in Britain. Don't worry, I won't tell anyone.
Do you actually read the conversation or jump in the middle of an argument and start squealing? i made my Pro-EU argument in reply to IFRE above and in addition to that i also said, most people support the EU. I am for democracy, this is why i do not want a 2nd referendum , nor i want the UK to stay in the EU. However my argument was always against a no-deal (specially with meds), which they have zero mandate for.
It's okay, it'll be our secret. Well, ours and everyone that reads the forum, but still.
Go try your reverse psychology troll elsewhere, i am here to have a discussion, you want to piss higher up the wall go ahead.
Here's a difference
The UK union is a story of coersion
The Scots went along with it reluctantly, the Irish had it imposed on them
Every member of the EU has joined of their own free will, and has a voice regardless of size
It's not hard to understand yourself as part of something that supports you and protects your interests
But you knew that, right?
- Jul 30, 2018
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Vae victis.
Ok Boris
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