Ins and Outs.. Captaincy?

[Darkhour]

With Harves out, a few players set for 'Tests' for the next match and Riewoldt set to play for Springy in a couple of weeks... If and who will we promote from the Rookie list and who will replace Harves?...

Also what do you think will happen to the Captaincy?

 

[samm]

Originally posted by Vaul Darkhour
With Harves out, a few players set for 'Tests' for the next match and Riewoldt set to play for Springy in a couple of weeks... If and who will we promote from the Rookie list and who will replace Harves?...

Also what do you think will happen to the Captaincy?

i can't see st kilda promoting anyone. Oliver, is on a 2 year rookie list and will be a rookie next year. wittison, from what i have heard is not playing well this year. whether it is becuase springvale has not given him enough time on the ground i don't know.
If cripps does not play for st kilda this year he should go. They should give him a chance before the year is out to see if it worth him being able to play again for st kilda next year., otherwise he is a liability.

milne should also keep on getting better, but his problem could be that he will have trouble doing the team things. eg handball to a better position player, and when he does try and do the right thing, as it is not natural he will keep on making mistakes, and therefore keep being sent off the ground. what do you think?

as to berry , i don't know enough about him.

the capitancy will be and should be thompson, but the leadership group should be gherig, everett, thompson, Hamill and it maybe good for Hall as well.

It will be a big learning curve for the guys for the rest of the season. i do not expect their to be many more st kilda victories, but i will be happy if they stay competitive in all the 4 quarters of each game and not give up.

 

[sainter]

Vaul,

Oliver is far and away the most exciting of the rookie listed players we have.

Still I don't think it is necessary to promote him at this stage. He is an 18 year old ruckman that needs some time to bulk up and develop. Like Samm said, because he is a rookie from interstate, he is automatically signed up for two years. Perhaps by the start of the next year, he may be worth adding to the senior list.

If Thommo's form from Saturday night is anything to go by, he is definitely worthy of the captaincy. I have the upmost respect for what he has gone through to even earn a spot on an AFL list, let alone become captain of an AFL club. Well done Thommo!

Samm,

I know that there is almost no place for sentiment in professional football but I still think your comments regarding Cripps were a little harsh. It's true, he has not played a senior AFL game since 1988. But he worked harder than anyone in the league to get himself back. And this year, he has finally been able to string together some matches for Springvale. Watching him play on Saturday, it was obvious that while he is not yet match fit or ready for an AFL berth, he was taking players on and starting to do some of the things that made him an integral player in our 1997 season.

 

[StrengthThroughLoyalty]

samm, agreed on cripps. as a bottom club we can not afford to carry anyone, everyone must be capable of contributing, if not get rid of them. crippa has only got a handful of games to prove himself, if he is not capable of playing to the capabilities he displayed in 97 then it's curtains for him, it will be a shame because he has worked so hard but thats professional sport.

i can't understand the reasoning for not elevating oliver off the rookie list. we now have a gilt edged opportunity to see who the next generation of st kilda footballers is going to be. oliver has been playing good football against men in a respectable league, so why not throw him in the deep end. we did it with kosi and i think we are all impressed with what he has shown so far, lets see what oliver is made of.

 

[samm]

RE PROMOTION OF ROOKIES

Originally posted by StrengthThroughLoyalty


i can't understand the reasoning for not elevating oliver off the rookie list. we now have a gilt edged opportunity to see who the next generation of st kilda footballers is going to be. oliver has been playing good football against men in a respectable league, so why not throw him in the deep end. we did it with kosi and i think we are all impressed with what he has shown so far, lets see what oliver is made of.

If you read today's AGE and the article by C. wilson we now know why st kilda will not be promoting any rooies. They have breached the salary cap by promoting Milne, all due to the abundance of injurys.

It is a pity. i don't think they should've promoting oliver, as he probably needs developing, and we probably need more people in the midfield , but maybe wittison, or berry?

but its now too late. and we will have to wait until next to see who stays. wittison is in his 2nd year, so unless he gets promoted to the senior list he will be gone.

what about Wulf. why not give him a game? not good enough? then why did we put him on the senior list?

 

[Savatage]

You're quick to say they've breached the salary cap Samm.

How would you know mate?

The problem is INJURY payments that have gone beyond the AFL's injury payment allocation. Not much ANY CLUB can do in this situation because injuries happen to EVERYONE & salary cap's are at the very least up to 95% of the total maximum anyway, making it VERY difficult for even a struggling club with crap players to get by.

If they didnt promote Milne, someone else would steal him.

 

[samm]

Originally posted by Savatage
You're quick to say they've breached the salary cap Samm.

How would you know mate?

The problem is INJURY payments that have gone beyond the AFL's injury payment allocation. Not much ANY CLUB can do in this situation because injuries happen to EVERYONE & salary cap's are at the very least up to 95% of the total maximum anyway, making it VERY difficult for even a struggling club with crap players to get by.

If they didnt promote Milne, someone else would steal him.

Yes they have breached it and what i said was "due to injury payments. "

am not having a go at them. understand why they have breached the cap. and i was saying its a pity. and yep you're right if not we didn't promote milne, some one would've grabbed him.

 

[Savatage]

Just please don't use the word "breached".

It makes us sound like cheats, we're not.

If Fremantle had as many injuries as us, they'd be in the same predicament, except nobody would hear about it.

Caro just likes putting us down. The dumb ****.

Next time Caro if you don't want to go to a FREE team of the century dinner for St.Kilda let me know so I can use it, don't misuse our club's good faith & then I wouldn't **** the club over with an article either, an article which I now have to defend from everyone out there who just waits for opportunities to kick us when we're "down". Which we're not by the way.

Go to www.afl.com.au and listen to Brian Waldron's interview.

Cheers.

 

[Darkhour]

So Oliver is the only real certainty... I thin kwe should leave him to bulk up.. I mean regardless of the injury payments etc.. we've got Elliot and Capuano who still might put their hands up... haven't seen much of wittison though... might be chopped...

 

[samm]

Originally posted by Vaul Darkhour
So Oliver is the only real certainty... I thin kwe should leave him to bulk up.. I mean regardless of the injury payments etc.. we've got Elliot and Capuano who still might put their hands up... haven't seen much of wittison though... might be chopped...

Well, in a way i would hope that we do not promote Oliver. why not give him the whole year at springvale. he plays most of the game, is probably improving, will probably balk up a bit over summer, and has been given the job as ruckman for the victoria (i hope)

as to elliot and capuano. i in one way i hope they both improve, but if they don't i hoppe that Blight certainly gets rid of elliot and if capuano is on a 1 year contract get rid of him (maybe) if on a 2 year contract, well we would not be able to afford to.

 

[All Saints]

Blight has gone on record he has had to select players who have not been in form in the VFL, or are too inexperienced to play at the top level. Thus another player fitting into the latter category will be no benefit to the team.
Players in the first category probably include Ryan,Elliott,Walton, and Knowles.
Those in the second category probably include Davis,Beetham,Baker,Blake and Schwarze.
I notice that the only Saints player in the best players for Springvale last weekend was Mattew Young so it is difficult to justify a Rookie promoted player such as Daniel Wulf on form.
The best 5 players on the track at present are Hamill,Gehrig,Everitt,Hall and Thompson. Of these only Thompson could be considered to take over the Captaincy.
We are tending to get more value out of experienced players taken higher in drafts such as Powell and Gale than younger guys at lower picks , over the past few years.

 

[Darkhour]

All Saints,

What does that say about our recruiting then?.. Does that mean we should keep doing what we're doing or start recruiting younger players at higher picks?..

 

[samm]

recruiting

Originally posted by Vaul Darkhour
All Saints,

What does that say about our recruiting then?.. Does that mean we should keep doing what we're doing or start recruiting younger players at higher picks?..

except for whentim watson was around, for the last few years have recruited the young people espeically in the 1st 3 draft picks. maybe why lots of clubs do not pick young pelop in the 4th or 5th etc round is that they will not get to the top level. and at least they have seen what the experienced guys can do.

 

[All Saints]

Dont get me wrong about the recruiting?
I wouldn`t give back Riewoldt or Koschitze. However these guys were from priority picks.
What I meant is that other clubs delisted players such as Gale and Powell (who are around 25 years old) were taken at 64 and 75 in last years national draft. They have proved serviceable players in 2001.Yet players such as Ryan,Walton and Knowles who were picked at a younger age as lower draft picks, after a few years are no further advanced.
We seem to have no really good players between24 to 26 years old to replace the likes of Loewe,Burke,Harvey and even Thompson and Everitt who are now past this age bracket.We cannot wait around for young Riewoldt and Koschitzke to develop their potential as this may take 3 or 4 years.
We need to target another good player for 2002 like we did with Hamill and Gehrig.Preferably an onballer.
There are salary cap restrictions so I would think that stewie will retire.

 

[Darkhour]

I agree with you there, I just hope Loewe isn't forced to retire because of the salary cap..

As for the onballer department.. I think we'll have to see how Beetham etc.. goes in the 2nd half of the year..

 

[sainter]

All Saints,

You said that we have few good players between 24 and 26 years of age.

That's why we set about recruiting experienced players, all of whom have their best football in front of them. Hamill, Gehrig, Voss, Lawrence, Powell, Gale and Capuano are all between the ages of 22 and 25.

I agree with you that after last year, we had some ageing champions and promising youngsters, yet not enough in between. That's why we recruited in the way that we did.

Of the players I have listed, I think it is fair to say that Hamill, Gehrig, Voss, Powell and Lawrence all have very bright futures. (Providing Steve and Robbie can overcome their injury problems). I'm not totally convinced about Gale yet while Capuano has to improve.

I don't think any of us disagree that changes need to be made at the end of the season but with the talent of our youngsters and some of our mid-range players, I think our list is in a relatively healthy position at this stage.

As for the salary cap restrictions, I'm led to believe that the salary cap will increase from it's current amount of $5.25 million to around $5.75 million next year. I don't think this figure has been set in stone yet. It's worth remembering that two of Harvey, Loewe and Burke will be on the Veteran's list and only half of their salaries will be included in the salary cap.

Good to have another saints supporter here by the way. Stick around, we need the presence on the main board too.

 

[sainter]

STL and Samm,

If it becomes clear that Jason Cripps is not up to it anymore, sure we will delist him.

However, you do not persist with a player for over 3 years for nothing. Many of us have been waiting for what seems like an eternity for him to return. And after two weeks into his promotion into the Springvale seniors, there is talk about getting rid of him.

No way!

I'm not sure if either of you saw any of the VFL game on Saturday afternoon but he really started to get a feel for the game that he has spent so much time away from. Seeing Crippa back himself against an opponent and take him on is something that we used to love back in 1997. His last quarter was excellent.

He looks to be getting his physical fitness back and then it will only be a case of retaining his match fitness and confidence in his body. Whether or not he can continue to improve of not, we can only pray.

What we all know is that there is barely a player in the AFL competition who has a heart the size of his and for that reason I do get a little annoyed hearing talk about delisting him at the very time that he is in the process of his comeback.

This is one time I sincerely hope I am right.

 

[Darkhour]

Sainter
As for the salary cap restrictions, I'm led to believe that the salary cap will increase from it's current amount of $5.25 million to around $5.75 million next year. I don't think this figure has been set in stone yet. It's worth remembering that two of Harvey, Loewe and Burke will be on the Veteran's list and only half of their salaries will be included in the salary cap

Good point Sainter..