Is Buckley A Good Coach?

[jathanas]

The senior coach is an important club figure and a legitimate topic of discussion. It's fair to do so and everyone has a right to express their view.

The mod team observed that the thread was dominated by a few protagonists and their points were repeated i.e. 8 years of regression vs marked improvement in 17,18 etc Pretty much everyone with a strong opinion has already expressed it here.

What further degraded discussion was the simplistic "sack FIGJAM" or "he's a legend" type posts.

This thread will remain open. If your view has slightly shifted or you have new thoughts please share. In an effort to encourage quality discussion repetitive statements and circular arguments will from now on be deleted as will silly posts suggesting that we sack a coach on match-day.

FYI Gone Critical Anzacday Maggie5

 

[doppleganger]

The difference is they were nullified and beaten on the day but were giving it their all, degoey in the dying minutes took the easy way out and was lazy.
He 100% played a big part in why we didn't hang on in that game, but as you state is one of many moments to go against us.

The difference is DeGoey actually was part of the reason we were in a position to win the GF.

It was a s**t kick from Treloar, it wasn't to the advantage of Checker or DeGoey.

If West Coast took their chances in Q4 none of it mattered anyway, we went 10minutes without even getting the ball inside our 50 after Cox's goal and West Coast just dominated kicking 1.5

Our engine room being badly beaten is what cost us the 2018 GF.

 

[Flags needed]

It’s already happening.
President gone.
New Football Manager.
New President coming and board changes.
New coaching panel for 2022.

good - hope it brings flags

 

[Flags needed]

The difference is DeGoey actually was part of the reason we were in a position to win the GF.
It was a sh*t kick from Treloar, it wasn't to the advantage of Checker or DeGoey.
If West Coast took their chances in Q4 none of it mattered anyway, we went 10minutes without even getting the ball inside our 50 after Cox's goal and West Coast just dominated kicking 1.5
Our engine room being badly beaten is what cost us the 2018 GF.

and someone thought it would be a good idea to get Beams back to fix that issue -

 

[loki04]

The difference is DeGoey actually was part of the reason we were in a position to win the GF.

It was a sh*t kick from Treloar, it wasn't to the advantage of Checker or DeGoey.

If West Coast took their chances in Q4 none of it mattered anyway, we went 10minutes without even getting the ball inside our 50 after Cox's goal and West Coast just dominated kicking 1.5

Our engine room being badly beaten is what cost us the 2018 GF.

As I said there are many moments within games that have a critical bearing on the outcome Degoeys was one.

Our midfield was also the reason we belted them off the park in the first quarter, wc should never of been in the game after that.

Each team held periods of time in control not just wc, Degoeys effort in the dying minutes, along with langdon laying meekly on the ground and not holding the pill harder when Ryan takes it and plays on, then the non free to Maynard and Sheeds man not running with him, are all moments in that same passage that are equally to blame for not hanging in there at the death.

It doesn't matter what happens in the first 3q if in the last 2 minutes you are up in a gf any poor efforts will be magnified as the TEAM was in a winning position even if against the momentum.
Just like 2010 draw could of had a similar result but the team grit held sway.

 

[jmac70]

and someone thought it would be a good idea to get Beams back to fix that issue -

And here we go again...

 

[Flags needed]

And here we go again...

 

[BringouttheGimp]

If that Murphy bloke gets the gig as president after conducting that so called 'independent review'.. imma put a 10 yr caveat on purchasing a membership.

I can't anymore man.. I'm done.

 

[ZEV]

The difference is DeGoey actually was part of the reason we were in a position to win the GF.

It was a sh*t kick from Treloar, it wasn't to the advantage of Checker or DeGoey.

If West Coast took their chances in Q4 none of it mattered anyway, we went 10minutes without even getting the ball inside our 50 after Cox's goal and West Coast just dominated kicking 1.5

Our engine room being badly beaten is what cost us the 2018 GF.

West Coast have been outrunning sides in the fourth quarter for many seasons.

The kick was poor from Treloar because of the outstanding pressure put on him by Cripps? (from memory). He wasnt able to get the handball over the top to WHE and was on his left on the boundary. It wasn't really bad footy from us just better from the eagles.

 

[No SPIN]

What was given to him was a mercedes silver arrows F1 car, he ditched that and built that V8 Monaro, don't forget that.

the Mercedes had crashed 3 times into the same driver - pretty banged up, lots of body filla and so definitely not in pristine condition.

 

[No SPIN]

No Spin

You're argument that Buckley is one of the better performing coaches over the past 3 years is statistically correct. However if I may, it is a little skewed and somewhat self serving. I'm not sure how you can have a meaningful debate about Buckley the coach without scrutinizing his entire tenure as coach. To discount the 1st 6 years is to effectively say that they were his apprenticeship years and hence don't count.

not sure I can see how it’s self serving - do you assess an employee on past poor performance or improvement more recently?
Clearly recent performance is far more relevant.
Why would you ignore improvement and focus on past failure- isn’t that “self serving” as it the only way to build the case against Buckley.
The statistical assessment since 2017 is sound IMO, in answering the critics, who believe he shouldn’t have been reappointed at the time.

 

[BringouttheGimp]

How does one gauge how good our players are when Buckley sends up s**t creek without a paddle.. week in.. week out.. the likes of whe and jt I've reserved judgement on over the last few yrs.. now we are in a predicament where under a new coach.. 4 yrs later.. is it a case that they've been ordinary all along.. or has age caught up with them.. do they have a disenchantment for this great all encompassing game of ours we call football.

 

[magpies42]

I’m a big Buckley fan, and I’d hate to see him go but if he’s lost the locker room then that’s it...you’re out. If Morris’ report is correct then that’s the end of Buckley’s tenure.

in 2017 when they reviewed the club and his coaching position I was adamant that he was the right choice, the players were playing for him that was evident.

our performances so far this year have been uninspiring, part of that is personnel based which is not Buckley’s doing. If they don’t come out on Friday all guns blazing it will be quite telling after all the media scrutiny this week!

Fingers crossed they turn it around. Buckley is the man.

 

[jmac70]

I’m a big Buckley fan, and I’d hate to see him go but if he’s lost the locker room then that’s it...you’re out. If Morris’ report is correct then that’s the end of Buckley’s tenure.

in 2017 when they reviewed the club and his coaching position I was adamant that he was the right choice, the players were playing for him that was evident.

our performances so far this year have been uninspiring, part of that is personnel based which is not Buckley’s doing. If they don’t come out on Friday all guns blazing it will be quite telling after all the media scrutiny this week!

Fingers crossed they turn it around. Buckley is the man.

I don’t know who Morris is but I’m confident Buckley has not lost the players.

 

[magpies42]

I don’t know who Morris is but I’m confident Buckley has not lost the players.

Tom Morris, Herald Sun journo.

 

[jmac70]

Tom Morris, Herald Sun journo.

Sounds like a git.

 

[Collingwood2022]

not sure I can see how it’s self serving - do you assess an employee on past poor performance or improvement more recently?
Clearly recent performance is far more relevant.
Why would you ignore improvement and focus on past failure- isn’t that “self serving” as it the only way to build the case against Buckley.
The statistical assessment since 2017 is sound IMO, in answering the critics, who believe he shouldn’t have been reappointed at the time.

Agreed more recent performance and in particular improvement is very relevant. However improvement has not occurred of late - quite the contrary. After a stellar 2018, the last 2 odd years have seen a gradual followed by significant decline. So I'm not sure the improvement argument has any real substance, wouldn't you agree?

 

[Carringbush2010]

What is your point?
Do you want to sack Buckley now?
What is it that you actually want to see happen?

What I'm saying is it may not be good pr if Buckley remains and we have a poor season. It'll look desperate not to sack.

 

[Carringbush2010]

the Mercedes had crashed 3 times into the same driver - pretty banged up, lots of body filla and so definitely not in pristine condition.

If you're talking immediately after 11 that's a rather dramatic assessment that rightly could be argued otherwise.

Even then that Monaro is laps behind and now in the fence.

 

[jmac70]

What I'm saying is it may not be good pr if Buckley remains and we have a poor season. It'll look desperate not to sack.

That doesn’t make a whole lot of sense mate.

 

[Collingwood2022]

I don’t know who Morris is but I’m confident Buckley has not lost the players.

It's hard to know. As a playing group they appear quite jaded and it's only Round 4. Maybe we can give the players a pass in Round 1 given the Treloar circumstances (personally I wouldn't give them a pass as they are well paid professionals who need to be above all that personal nonsense) but the performance against a very undermanned GWS was clearly insipid.

I have no problem with Buckley coaching out the year and certainly Harvey and Sanderson are not the interim solutions. It could be that the players have no issues with Buckley however are just done with the game plan. If so, in that case they may need a valve release and this is where short term change may be required or at least Buckley needs to let go and just let them be free to express themselves.

Fascinating times ahead.

 

[Carringbush2010]

That doesn’t make a whole lot of sense mate.

As expected you don't get it.

 

[doppleganger]

West Coast have been outrunning sides in the fourth quarter for many seasons.

The kick was poor from Treloar because of the outstanding pressure put on him by Cripps? (from memory). He wasnt able to get the handball over the top to WHE and was on his left on the boundary. It wasn't really bad footy from us just better from the eagles.

Yep, Eagles were just better for longer.

Similar happened in the QF, we were in front at 3/4 time, but Eagles mids got on top in Q4, dominated contested ball and possession and our undersized defenders couldn't hold out Darling, Kennedy etc.

DeGoey was our only goal scorer in Q4 of the QF too.

 

[No SPIN]

Agreed more recent performance and in particular improvement is very relevant. However improvement has not occurred of late - quite the contrary. After a stellar 2018, the last 2 odd years have seen a gradual followed by significant decline. So I'm not sure the improvement argument has any real substance, wouldn't you agree?

how can finishing Top 4 and losing the PF by less than a goal in 2019, be considered significant decline - 2020 yes, but huge asterisks for the majority of clubs given the dislocation.

 

[Carringbush2010]

It's hard to know. As a playing group they appear quite jaded and it's only Round 4. Maybe we can give the players a pass in Round 1 given the Treloar circumstances (personally I wouldn't give them a pass as they are well paid professionals who need to be above all that personal nonsense) but the performance against a very undermanned GWS was clearly insipid.

I have no problem with Buckley coaching out the year and certainly Harvey and Sanderson are not the interim solutions. It could be that the players have no issues with Buckley however are just done with the game plan. If so, in that case they may need a valve release and this is where short term change may be required or at least Buckley needs to let go and just let them be free to express themselves.

Fascinating times ahead.

Fascinating isn't the word I'd use.

 

[jmac70]

As expected you don't get it.

Why do you hurt my heart?