In my experience the FIFO crowd (most by car) tended to be politic related or Canberra based employees of multi nationals, out early Fri afternoon, back late Sunday or direct to work Monday. Maybe its gone, good for Canberra in the long run.
Is Canberra rugby league heartland?
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In my experience the FIFO crowd (most by car) tended to be politic related or Canberra based employees of multi nationals, out early Fri afternoon, back late Sunday or direct to work Monday. Maybe its gone, good for Canberra in the long run.
kaypee
All Australian
canberra has a city area? never noticed that before
Canberra is only an extension of NSW and a lot closer to Sydney than Melbourne so of course the Rugbys are popular sports for a lot of the population
Australian Football has always had a presence right from 1927 when Canberra replaced Melbourne as national Capital and because most of the public servants at the beginning transferred from Melbourne there was an initial focus on Aussie Rules.
Canberra has always had a pretty strong local league as well.I would think Canberra would be about a 50/50 split in support for the main footy codes.
Australian Football has always had a presence right from 1927 when Canberra replaced Melbourne as national Capital and because most of the public servants at the beginning transferred from Melbourne there was an initial focus on Aussie Rules.
Canberra has always had a pretty strong local league as well.I would think Canberra would be about a 50/50 split in support for the main footy codes.
Brumbies are the bigger fan base. They have been playing finals regularly, raiders only good year in the past decade is this year and they are still behind.
Four floors of whores mate, you haven't experienced the city until you've been there.
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INterestingly, when you read that roar article linked, and the comments, you get the impression that plenty have come across from LU to tell everyone that rugby league is really the bigger game.
I read the article from The Roar "expert" and wish I didn't. So many ill-educated clichés in one article...where does one begin?
For starters - if Canberra is "rugby league heartland" why do they only have one competition while football has four grades with about double the amount of teams?
(Australian) Football - seniors
1st grade - 6 teams
2nd grade - 6 teams
3rd Grade - 10 teams
4th Grade - 11 teams
plus the SEAFL teams...
But the problem is writers like the one on the Roar site deal in what they THINK is right without doing any RESEARCH. They then feed into general clichés that the majority of readers believe...
Rugby league
2 grades
1st grade - 9 teams
2nd grade - 9 teams
So there are 33 teams in Canberra and surrounding regions playing the Australian game and 18 playing the English introduced game.
So that means there are almost double the number of teams in footy....yet rugby writers like that twit from the Roar gets to write material as "an expert" dealing in cliché after cliché.
So according to The Roar expert Canberra and surrounding regions is "rugby league heartland" despite the FACT that there are less than half the amount of people playing it as adults than football. Yes, an expert indeed.
For starters - if Canberra is "rugby league heartland" why do they only have one competition while football has four grades with about double the amount of teams?
(Australian) Football - seniors
1st grade - 6 teams
2nd grade - 6 teams
3rd Grade - 10 teams
4th Grade - 11 teams
plus the SEAFL teams...
But the problem is writers like the one on the Roar site deal in what they THINK is right without doing any RESEARCH. They then feed into general clichés that the majority of readers believe...
Rugby league
2 grades
1st grade - 9 teams
2nd grade - 9 teams
So there are 33 teams in Canberra and surrounding regions playing the Australian game and 18 playing the English introduced game.
So that means there are almost double the number of teams in footy....yet rugby writers like that twit from the Roar gets to write material as "an expert" dealing in cliché after cliché.
So according to The Roar expert Canberra and surrounding regions is "rugby league heartland" despite the FACT that there are less than half the amount of people playing it as adults than football. Yes, an expert indeed.
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Garlic muncher
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Canberra itself is not RL heartland but the rural areas around it are, for example out of the 9 clubs that make up the CDRL, 4 are outside Canberra, they include 2 from QBYan and one each from Goulburn and Yass, Yass in particular is a pretty small town.
Who sits first and second on the ladder ATM - both QBYan teams.
It is really a staggering % considering the population difference between Canberra and the surrounding rural areas.
What Harmesy 37 above did not mention is that there is also a George Tooke shield which i guess is a bit of a pub league, that has 9 teams and out of the 9 teams 6 are outside Canberra, out of the 3 Canberra teams one is from ADFA which i would imagine has plenty of Northern state relocated players, one is called Boonamulla Raiders which is centered around Narrabundah and is primarily a Indigenous team, a indigenous team full of ex Sydneyites from around Redfern who were moved/relocated to Canberra around 20 years ago.
The other teams are Crookwell, Gunning, Bungendore, Harden, Braidwood, Boorawa all tiny rural hamlets.
So in essence, Canberra is far from RL heartland but is surrounded by it.
Who sits first and second on the ladder ATM - both QBYan teams.
It is really a staggering % considering the population difference between Canberra and the surrounding rural areas.
What Harmesy 37 above did not mention is that there is also a George Tooke shield which i guess is a bit of a pub league, that has 9 teams and out of the 9 teams 6 are outside Canberra, out of the 3 Canberra teams one is from ADFA which i would imagine has plenty of Northern state relocated players, one is called Boonamulla Raiders which is centered around Narrabundah and is primarily a Indigenous team, a indigenous team full of ex Sydneyites from around Redfern who were moved/relocated to Canberra around 20 years ago.
The other teams are Crookwell, Gunning, Bungendore, Harden, Braidwood, Boorawa all tiny rural hamlets.
So in essence, Canberra is far from RL heartland but is surrounded by it.
Garlic muncher
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Just to give people some idea ....
27 mens senior RL teams across Canberra district RL ( first, reserves and George tooke ) 14 senior mens teams are from outside Canberra. ( more than 50%)
33 mens senior AF teams across 4 divisions in AFL Canberra, 8 teams from outside Canberra, ( 2 from Batemans bay, Cootamundra, Yass, Goulburn, Cooma, 2 from QBYan) ( less than 25%)
27 mens senior RL teams across Canberra district RL ( first, reserves and George tooke ) 14 senior mens teams are from outside Canberra. ( more than 50%)
33 mens senior AF teams across 4 divisions in AFL Canberra, 8 teams from outside Canberra, ( 2 from Batemans bay, Cootamundra, Yass, Goulburn, Cooma, 2 from QBYan) ( less than 25%)
There are three points - the writer is claiming that the area around Canberra is RL heartland.
Yet there are football teams in Yass, Goulburn and Queanbeyan as well so to claim they are RL heartland - one would expect for this claim to be accurate that they have 5 times the player numbers for league in each of these towns than footy and that isn't the case....that is unless the writer wants us to believe that for a town to be "rugby league heartland" it has less or similar numbers playing their game compared to footy.
I know Queanbeyan has more league players but it isn't as if there are 200 league players and just 20 footy players. His argument is a nonsensical argument...but the writer got his lie through on The Roar and the editor there let it pass through.
2nd point -
The towns you are referring to for the Tooke Shield are of such small population base - Crookwell, Gunning etc that I doubt those towns will be able to support league teams going forward anyway.
3rd point -
There are also other towns (eg Tumbarumba, Holbrook, Narooma etc) that are about the same distance to Canberra as some on your list so I could include them in any total of clubs in the "Canberra region". These towns all have football clubs, yet I didn't include them as they are in different comps.
Garlic muncher
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We were talking about teams that play in either the Canberra District Rugby League (CDRL) or AFL Canberra, RL has about half the senior mens teams that actually run out of Canberra compared to footy, and of course we know footy teams have more players per team than a RL team, however what these teams and numbers cant show us is how many people actually support each code, it is quite possible that many people who are in the demographic that can play RL choose for various reasons ( safety, work, family, injuries) to not play.
My experience of living in Canberra for many years is that it is split between the codes, however these team numbers show us that the rural surrounding areas are very pro RL, however if we move about an hour south of Canberra ( past Gundagai) once again it becomes quite split.
Rugby League also has the natural advantage in Canberra that people who have an interest in football will follow a local team ( Raiders), for all the good local work GWS has done everyone knows it is not a Canberra team.
1- agree that RL has about half the amount of teams as football in Canberra. This would confirm that Canberra is NOT rugby league "heartland".
2- If we looked at media support for league in Canberra then you would think it is a RL town. The newspapers and the tv stations consistently favour league even though they have less than half the player numbers than footy. The Canberra Times...I mean what is the point of that paper? I remember buying that paper and thinking it was a joke. The people in power in the media favour league, union, tiddlywinks to footy.
http://www.canberratimes.com.au/sport
look at this for confirmation - first four stories on their site - league.
Sports search options from top to bottom are in this order:
Rugby league
Rugby Union
cricket
"AFL" down the bottom.
Who do you think the editor of this paper would be? Someone who likes Aussie footy or someone who likes league/union etc?
3- when you say rural area "surrounding" Canberra- are you just looking at the areas to the north of Canberra? Surrounding means to the south of Canberra as well...surely? If that is the case then it is not RL heartland. Even the areas to the north of Canberra have footy teams anyway. Coota, Goulburn, Yass etc.
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Garlic muncher
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I agree that Canberra is not RL heartland, I think I have said it a couple of times in the last couple of posts.
The media report on a Canberra team in the NRL, sporting wise it is a pretty big deal for little old Canberra - so they carry on - plenty of people also remember the old green machine that first won the NSWRL Premiership, does not interest me but they gotta print something and the Raiders are local.
The immediate surrounding rural areas of Canberra are very pro RL and have been for 100 years, the further south and west you go the less RL it is.
Towns like Yass, Coota and Goulburn may have football teams but there is no doubt they are heartland RL towns, Yass and Goulburn play in the highest Canberra RL Comp ( seniors and reserves and under 18's)which is quite a decent standard, Coota plays in group 9, the footy teams are just single teams which play in either division 3 or 4 in the Canberra AFL.
At different times these towns have had juniors but AFAIK not ATM, but they do have RL juniors.
To my mind it actually proves the strength, far more even spread and appeal of football across this country that it has reasonably strong rural teams competing in what are RL heartlands.
Attendance is pretty good across all three sports in Canberra, we're a bit anomalous despite being on the northern side of the Barassi line. We'd also be the only part of the country where rugby union is a more popular spectator sport than both rugby league and aussie rules.
It's a genuinely mixed city and has high sport attendance rates for all three sports. In terms of attendance in 2009/10 the ABS had about 11% having attended Australian Rules, 14% having attended Rugby League and 15% at Rugby Union.
For comparison the NSW was 4% ARF, 14% RL, 4% RU and Queensland was 6%, 17%, 4%. Victoria was 33% and 1-2% for each of the rugbies. Western australia got up to 4% for rugby union.
Other posters are right, Queanbeyan and Yass and the rest of the capital region over the border are more RL-predominant as is typical for the towns north and east of about Wagga.
It's a genuinely mixed city and has high sport attendance rates for all three sports. In terms of attendance in 2009/10 the ABS had about 11% having attended Australian Rules, 14% having attended Rugby League and 15% at Rugby Union.
For comparison the NSW was 4% ARF, 14% RL, 4% RU and Queensland was 6%, 17%, 4%. Victoria was 33% and 1-2% for each of the rugbies. Western australia got up to 4% for rugby union.
Other posters are right, Queanbeyan and Yass and the rest of the capital region over the border are more RL-predominant as is typical for the towns north and east of about Wagga.
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If we are talking WA and rugby union which does have a presence in WA this may interest you ....
Harry Brown, the crusader of ‘British’ sports in Perth.
Brown was President of both soccer and Rugby and the WACA around the early 1900's in Perth.
With his powerful links to sport still in tact, the 1907 Rugby Tour of the NSW Rugby Union tour showed the influence of Brown on Perth’s sporting landscape.
Soccer had suspended all fixtures for the game on the 3rd August 1907. Brown was determined that Australian Rules Football would do likewise.
In the lead up to the tour he combined the councils that hosted all Australian Rules Football teams to have a unison model of ground hire fees and charges, which across the city had largely been seen as revenue raisers for councils. He was aiming to compel Australian Rules Football to suspend their season for this Rugby Union match in Perth.
The Ground Combine through Harry Brown demanded that Australian Rules Football should postpone all Australian Rules fixtures for this NSW tour match. If they did not do so, the Grounds Combine would not allow access to their grounds for the WAFL season. According to Simmons the chairman of the Western Australian Football Association, Australian Rules Football would have been happy to suspend their games had their not been a compulsion, an arrogance to the order.
Through lobbying and protracted discussion, Australian Football was able to seek agreement to play games across the variant council run grounds without suspending all games on this first weekend of August.
Simmons mentions they were prepared to postpone their game on agreement that Rugby would do likewise for an exhibition of Australian Rules Football in Sydney. This was refuted and so Australian Rules Football played a game head to head with the State of Origin against NSW.
Harry Brown used his influence to try and change the status quo. He triggered antagonism both in council, in public and within the sporting community. His preference for British Sport would be at the contradiction of the highest gates being reserved for the Australian Game.
The conflicts of interest within Perth; a long with ground shortages; a battle between professionalism and amateurism, and strong population growth is reflected in the instability within the sporting landscape of Perth.
The heshen tents of the mulberry plantation across from the East Perth Cemetery were only a few hundred meters from the WACA, the bastion of gentry. Men who came to seek out their fortune in a city of high costs and lack of accommodation came with their game of preference – Australian Rules.
The gentry would do their up most to ensure that the capital was not run by this class. The actions of Brown, emphasise the power of the elite.
https://cegan.wordpress.com/
Bolded bit made me laugh
Sorry for not replying earlier.
The original writer of the article from The Roar said that Canberra is rugby league heartland. He didn't say Canberra and "surrounding regions".
We got a bit off track talking about Gundagai and other regional towns.
Canberra is clearly NOT rugby league heartland.
More people play football in Canberra (Australian football) than rugby league. Almost double just on senior player numbers alone.
Also, Aussie football is well established as a sporting option for juniors - with major private schools and also the public schools having a program.
Where league is ahead is with media support. Canberra should most definitely not be viewed as "league heartland" and the "journalist" who wrote it for The Roar did so as a result of lazy journalism.
The original writer of the article from The Roar said that Canberra is rugby league heartland. He didn't say Canberra and "surrounding regions".
We got a bit off track talking about Gundagai and other regional towns.
Canberra is clearly NOT rugby league heartland.
More people play football in Canberra (Australian football) than rugby league. Almost double just on senior player numbers alone.
Also, Aussie football is well established as a sporting option for juniors - with major private schools and also the public schools having a program.
Where league is ahead is with media support. Canberra should most definitely not be viewed as "league heartland" and the "journalist" who wrote it for The Roar did so as a result of lazy journalism.
Garlic muncher
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Garlic muncher
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I agree, it could be a case of wishful thinking by the journalist, could just be lazy reporting or could be deliberate.
Who knows.
Canberra is a interesting sporting mix, my feeling is that if a AFL/VFL team was relocated or a home grown AFL team was in Canberra, football would be ahead by a fair way, as it stands ATM without a team it does pretty well in the face of two competing codes ( RL, RU) in National and international comps.
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Junior Rugby Union is primarily school based in Canberra, Rugby League is solely club based and Footy is based from both, but more primarily club.
As an example, at under 15 level in Canberra there are 14 Rugby Union teams, 8 out of the 14 teams are school based, from Daramalan, Marist (2), St Eddies(2), Radford, Trinity and Grammar - there is also one from Broulee which is on the South Coast of NSW and a fair distance from Canberra, which probably means there is no depth of juniors playing rugby union on the South Coast.
Junior RL at that level does not have one school team
Junior AF has 2 school teams at under 15 level. ( St Edmunds, Marist)
At different times both Daramalan and Grammar have also had AF clubs and teams but these seem to come and go, going back to the late 1970-s early 1980's the then Principle of Daramalan College banned Australian Football.
As an example, at under 15 level in Canberra there are 14 Rugby Union teams, 8 out of the 14 teams are school based, from Daramalan, Marist (2), St Eddies(2), Radford, Trinity and Grammar - there is also one from Broulee which is on the South Coast of NSW and a fair distance from Canberra, which probably means there is no depth of juniors playing rugby union on the South Coast.
Junior RL at that level does not have one school team
Junior AF has 2 school teams at under 15 level. ( St Edmunds, Marist)
At different times both Daramalan and Grammar have also had AF clubs and teams but these seem to come and go, going back to the late 1970-s early 1980's the then Principle of Daramalan College banned Australian Football.
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Ok as a Sydney based Canberra Raiders fan I could not miss a response to this comment.
Canberra as a city is based of the federal public service with a shitload of people coming from Southern cities and northern cities.
They will bring whatever their preference is.
But keep in mind with crowds, it is freezing cold in canberra and nrl games are held predominately at night often on week nights. Rugby League does not have the same religous fan attendance culture as the AFL and probably never will.
They sold out their last two finals matches at canberra stadium and had to get temporary seating at one.
This year has been great, but (hopefully this record will be broken this year) the raiders are the only club in the NRL era not to have reached a preliminary final. It has been a particularly lean period.
That said this post imo says a lot more about the parochiality of individuals (especially those from southern states) then the support the raiders have in canberra.
do you include touch and tag in those numbers?
equally, if Rugby League didn't have the history it has and the state of play and financial situation it currently has.
With equal amount of resources to pump into juniors as what the AFL do rugby league would be doing far far far far better.
hypotheticals are a poor mans game.
this notion that AFL is an "Australian sport" whilst soccer, league, union are "british sports" therefore less deserving of an australians support is a weak argument which imo only works on weak pathetic minds.If we are talking WA and rugby union which does have a presence in WA this may interest you ....
Harry Brown, the crusader of ‘British’ sports in Perth.
Brown was President of both soccer and Rugby and the WACA around the early 1900's in Perth.
With his powerful links to sport still in tact, the 1907 Rugby Tour of the NSW Rugby Union tour showed the influence of Brown on Perth’s sporting landscape.
Soccer had suspended all fixtures for the game on the 3rd August 1907. Brown was determined that Australian Rules Football would do likewise.
In the lead up to the tour he combined the councils that hosted all Australian Rules Football teams to have a unison model of ground hire fees and charges, which across the city had largely been seen as revenue raisers for councils. He was aiming to compel Australian Rules Football to suspend their season for this Rugby Union match in Perth.
The Ground Combine through Harry Brown demanded that Australian Rules Football should postpone all Australian Rules fixtures for this NSW tour match. If they did not do so, the Grounds Combine would not allow access to their grounds for the WAFL season. According to Simmons the chairman of the Western Australian Football Association, Australian Rules Football would have been happy to suspend their games had their not been a compulsion, an arrogance to the order.
Through lobbying and protracted discussion, Australian Football was able to seek agreement to play games across the variant council run grounds without suspending all games on this first weekend of August.
Simmons mentions they were prepared to postpone their game on agreement that Rugby would do likewise for an exhibition of Australian Rules Football in Sydney. This was refuted and so Australian Rules Football played a game head to head with the State of Origin against NSW.
Harry Brown used his influence to try and change the status quo. He triggered antagonism both in council, in public and within the sporting community. His preference for British Sport would be at the contradiction of the highest gates being reserved for the Australian Game.
The conflicts of interest within Perth; a long with ground shortages; a battle between professionalism and amateurism, and strong population growth is reflected in the instability within the sporting landscape of Perth.
The heshen tents of the mulberry plantation across from the East Perth Cemetery were only a few hundred meters from the WACA, the bastion of gentry. Men who came to seek out their fortune in a city of high costs and lack of accommodation came with their game of preference – Australian Rules.
The gentry would do their up most to ensure that the capital was not run by this class. The actions of Brown, emphasise the power of the elite.
https://cegan.wordpress.com/
Bolded bit made me laugh
Also any argument that a sport should not upset the status quo to seek to grow its own game is a tad hypocritical if coming from an AFL person. Though it is an argument I disagree with strongly, each sport should do what is in its best interests.
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