Is Ken Judge next?

[daddy_4_eyes]

First Freo sacked Drum, now the saints sacked Blight. Is Judgey next?

The eagles have had a pathetic season, and despite improved performances in recent weeks few would credit Ken Judge with it. The eagles have the worst percentage in recent AFL history and are easy beats.

What are Ken Judges chances of lasting the season if a higher profile coach who hasn't done much worse than Judge got sacked?

 

[Visro]

Judge wont go this season though don't be surprised if he isn't here in 2003. Several reasons:

1. Two clubs are allready looking for new experienced coaches when no experienced coaches want to leave their clubs. If WC sack KJ, then they will find it very difficult to get a new coach.

2. In the time he has been here, WC have started to blood good youngsters. It has to do something with KJ cause you look at the drafting previous to him and it hasn't been great.

3. He only has one more year on the contract to run. Its not like we have signed him up again for 4 years. The club should be willing to wait for his term to be over.

4. Bluey is not ready to be an AFL coach yet. I would love to see Worsfold and Bluey as coach and assistant coach respectively at this club but at the moment they both probably still need one more season under their belts.

Those are the reasons I think we will have him at the club for next year at least. Then we can perhaps get a strategist coach instead of a rebuilding coach.

Vis

 

[Mr Eagle]

Originally posted by daddy_4_eyes
The eagles have the worst percentage in recent AFL history and are easy beats.

Tell that to Freo, Melbourne, and SouthKildaport

Judge will see out his contract, and the club will use the time to blood our young'uns. After that, I reckon the club will look to draw Worsfold back home. Judge would either be kept on as a specialist coach for our younger players (a la Parkin's director role) or will get the boot.

 

[tjrra]

Good comments, I think that Jugde is safe at the Eagles for a while anyway.
Given they have had success in the past they know what it takes to get to that level again, he will build a team and it will take a while to get there.

 

[Frodo]

I think he will stay another season although I would prefer otherwise

Vis, you said

2. In the time he has been here, WC have started to blood good youngsters. It has to do something with KJ cause you look at the drafting previous to him and it hasn't been great.


But all the players he is bloding, other than Kerr, were not drafted by him!!! So if they turn out good, and I believe they will, we can only give recruiting credit to Matlhouse.

 

[eagleskickass]

These are the players currently on our list that have been drafted SINCE KJ came here.
In Just 2 seasons

Darren Glass
Travis Gaspar
David Haynes
Adam Hunter
Kane Munro
Andrew McDougall
Daniel Kerr
Jeremy Humm
Dean Cox
Kasey Green

And from 95-98 (99 KJ didn't coach, but helped pick the recruits)

Chad Morrison
Ben Cousins
David Wirrpunda
Michael Gardiner
Josh Wooden
Michael Braun
Callum Chambers
Rowan Jones
Andrew Williams
David Antonowicz
Phil Read
Andrew Embley
Chad Fletcher

So, In KJ's 2 seasons, 10 Quality youngsters have already been recruited, in the previous 4 seasons before KJ only 13 are still at the club

Why the previous 4 seasons drafting bad, these are drafted players from these 4 seaons that are no longer at the club

Brendon Fewster (#3)
Luke Trew (#14)
Craig Smoker(#30)
Nick Stone(#39)
Jaxon Crabb(#12)
Tod Holmes(#37)
Brandon Hill (0 games)(#10)
Michael O'brien (0 games)(#26)

Thats just to name the highly picked ones

Also recruited since KJ came
David Seirakowski
Mark Merrenda
Michael Prior
Trent Carroll
Greg Harding

Of which has hardly been seen, and 1 is a dud, the other 3 (prior till injury) have been good for us.

I don't think that is bad rebuilding at all. Also, the drafted players before KJ came are only now getting a go.

 

[Frodo]

Last years recruits were KJ's but the season before's recruiting decisions were based on MM's recruiting teams decisions.

 

[Mr Eagle]

Not to mention that he helped us get Collica and Taylor as well, two of our best for the year so far...

 

[eagleskickass]

Thats Who I missed, thanks Mr Eagle, I knew I missed a couple.
Frodo, KJ acyually did have a say in the 99 Draft, he was asked to have a look at a couple of players they had already had a look at. He pretty much said which ones he thought we should go for, and added 1 or 2 himself!

 

[McKenna for PM]

eagleskickass, forgive a poor Brisbane based supporter from the ignorance, but which of them is the dud? It is testament to how starved of coverage we are out here that I don't know.

And Visro, just a query - what makes you suggest that Woosh should be head coach and Bluey assistant?

It should be the other way round IMHO.

 

[Visro]

He is referring to Harding who has played barely any games for us this year.

Woosha has more coaching experience than Bluey, simple as that.

 

[eagleskickass]

yep, Harding is who I was talking about
and yes, Woosha as Coach, Bluey as Assistant

 

[Frodo]

I don't like doing this but I predict that KJ will be with us for5-6 years!

Something happenned a few weeks ago when German was booted out the box and Bluey got more influence. The result is that we're not far away from having a strong list as our young players are really developing and the trading we did has turned out really well.

I think we will trade for an on baller. In fact to give KJ his dues Daniel Chick did agree to come and reneged. Chick is the sort of player we need to supplement Cuz.

So this year we have got very good players in Prior, Collica, Merenda, Taylor, Kerr and Carrol plus Cox and Gaspar have shown that they are good AFL material. Chambers, Munro, Hunter, Haynes, Humm and Buszan may well make it next year too along with Antonowitz

We also gained a fit Wirrapunda.

We lost Milli, Tommy, Donners, Sierra, Read, Banners, Brauny, Morrisson and Jako with injury but apart from the first Tommy and Donners all should be back for next season.

There is no reason at all why we should not make the finals next year with our list.

And if we do KJ will be offerred a new contract.

 

[daddy_4_eyes]

Originally posted by Frodo
.....Daniel Chick did agree to come and reneged.....

You wanna know how close we were to getting Chick? Apparently he was ready to sign with us and was prepearing to leave Victoria. A week before he was to leave for WA his wife got offered a "once in a lifetime" job, he decided not to be selfish and stayed for his wife. We had him, the deal was almost complete. All that was missing was the legal stuff(contract).

Also, apparently we were on the verge of signing Scott Lucas from the bombers, but they managed to squeeze him into the salary cap and we ended up with Prior.

 

[Frodo]

Not a bad way of cheating the cap eh!! get some rich supporter to employ the wife at an inflated salary!

 

[WA]

2003 (worse case = 2004)

Worsfold - Coach
McKenna - Assistant

 

[Voice of Reason]

My prediction/guess - we will win 2 or 3 more games this year, but have a slightly disappointing season next year and just miss the Finals. Judge will blame injuries, bad luck and anything else on offer.

The board will not be satisfied with that, blame Judge and will go for a Woosha/Bluey combination.

 

[McKenna for PM]

I agree that KJ may be here for five or so years. He's still learning and we are starting to see some improvement.

But regarding the Woosh Bluey coaching roles - I believe McKenna has the better footy brain. He's more the tactician and strategist, whereas Woosh is more of a leader. But surely the Tony Shaw saga demonstrated in no uncertain terms that champion players do not always make great coaches?

I would be inclined to push for KJ for a while yet. These guys have to prove that they are really worth the club's attention. Simply paying homage to former greats is no reason to employ them as coaches without question.

 

[Voice of Reason]

McKenna for PM said "

But regarding the Woosh Bluey coaching roles - I believe McKenna has the better footy brain. He's more the tactician and strategist, whereas Woosh is more of a leader. But surely the Tony Shaw saga demonstrated in no uncertain terms that champion players do not always make great coaches?

Good points both, even if the latter is based on the dubious premise that Tony Shaw was a champion player (cheap shot against a Norm Smith medallist, but really he was just a little collingwood bloke who tried really hard).

Do we yet have any idea about how good Woosha and Bluey are as coaches - or even what type of coach they would be? Your comments fit the two as players, yes, but players don't always coach how they played - Blight is/was in many ways the exception. eg Ken Judge - skilful, attacking, not necessarily hugely consistent over a long time, forward pocket as a player, but one of the most defensive, man on man accountable footy coaches of the modern game. eg Kevin Sheedy - sniping, evil back pocket thug, who has coached very innovative and often attacking footy.

For all we know, Woosha may have the better footy brain in a coaching sense (I don't know yet). He'll certainly have learnt more under David Parkin and now Wayne Brittain in a different club environment than Bluey will have done by staying at home (though we love him for it).

I do agree with your point about champion players not necessarily making it as coaches. I'd love to see Brereton give it a go - just to see.

 

[ONE EYE]

I agree with EAGLESKICKASS. I feel KJ has drafted well and brought good trades to the club. I believe to a certain extent that players make the coach. And to that end Judge has started to build the raw ingrediants that will bring success. Part of being a good Coach is creating/developing the player group. I think this is happening.

I think most of the comments have agreed with my view. If we were to sack KJ partway through this development stage we would start to look like St Kilda or Richmond.

I say let KJ run out his contract and lets Judge him then. If we are not playing finals footy in 2003 then something has gone wrong. I think we should win 8 - 10 games next year if we recruit well and the youngsters continue to develop. This wont be enough to play finals footy.

Just be patient. Having attended all Eagle shome games this year you can see a transition occurring. We beat the Demons and ran with the Kangaroos until halfway through the last quarter. We may beat Geelong tomorrow. The player group is starting to play with passion and committment. Personally I believe this is partly due to not playing the Champions when they are obviously not fit. I bet it must be devestating to a young player to see that by quarter time there is three injured players on the bench. Say a Kemp, Matera, McIntosh, Cummings etc. This hasnt occurred recently . Play the kids I reckon.

GO EAGLES!

 

[WA]

I also agree about champion players not necessarily making the best coaches.

On the Worsfold/McKenna thing - my first thought has always been Worsfold with McKenna as an assistant (even though McKenna is my all time fav'!), purely because of the extra experience Worsfold should have gained at Carlton. Whilst McKenna may have the better 'footy brain', I seriously doubt Worsfold would ever come back in an asssitants capacity. Basically, I think that IF we see the Worsfold/McKenna coaching combination at West Coast, Worsfold will have the top job.

 

[McKenna for PM]

i appreciate these points - I guess I just assumed that these comments were based on the mindset of McKenna being Woosh's deputy in accordance with their situation as players. But yep, fair enough, I agree that Woosha will probably get more out of being an assistant at Carlton. How does the saying go? To beat the enemy one must think like the enemy or something along those lines. So I guess you can't get a bigger enemy than Carlton can you?