Is Nick Daicos The Best First Year Player Of All Time?

[theyellowsash]

I am not watching every week

Lol. "I've seen his highlights and I'm assuming that's ever time he touches the ball"

 

[gouki88]

Rhys palmer also averaged 23+ disposals a game.

Just getting the ball on a flank doesn't necessarily mean best.

Agreed. It's about damage done with ball in hand. And none of the recent top young players like Walsh or Greene have been as damaging.

 

[theyellowsash]

Agreed. It's about damage done with ball in hand. And none of the recent top young players like Walsh or Greene have been as damaging.

in their first years, rhys palmer beats daicos in (per game) goals (0.5 to 0.3), inside 50 (3.4 to 2.7), clearances (3.1 to 1.8), clangers (2.8 to 3.5), contested possessions (8.4 to 6.1) and goal assists (0.5 to 0.3).

Daicos leads in disposals (23.1 to 26.6) and rebound 50s (1.9 to 3.9).

so no, white daicos is very good, he's hardly that far out of the box.

 

[IluvHarvey]

Brad Hardie won a Brownlow

 

[Neale4brownlow]

Answer: Yes.

 

[gouki88]

in their first years, rhys palmer beats daicos in (per game) goals (0.5 to 0.3), inside 50 (3.4 to 2.7), clearances (3.1 to 1.8), clangers (2.8 to 3.5), contested possessions (8.4 to 6.1) and goal assists (0.5 to 0.3).

Daicos leads in disposals (23.1 to 26.6) and rebound 50s (1.9 to 3.9).

so no, white daicos is very good, he's hardly that far out of the box.

I'm just going from memory here given they didn't record the stats back then (as far as I can see), but I would reckon Daicos is ahead in terms of score involvements, metres gained and intercepts. All indicative of valuable disposal.

Palmer was also not contributing to wins, which is obviously not an indicator of individual value, but nonetheless I think it's important to distinguish the value added to a 5 win side vs the value added to a 12+ win side.

 

[Chief Ten Beers]

Lol. "I've seen his highlights and I'm assuming that's ever time he touches the ball"

Perhaps, but you can't put a stat on class and skill. Which essentially Judd is saying about ND and also now even now Cooney.

But I suppose a random BF poster that can pick out stats has more weight than those two Brownlow medalists.

Fwiw, no I dont think he is the best of all tiem but find it amusing the lengths posters go to diminish what ND has done so far.

 

[loki04]

Grant or Judd, for now and on balance Judd, forget the numbers, he put the ball into space and was an amazing user of the ball,
Hogan beating Rance in a marking contest was nice but no. Daicos still has 5 games and a finals series, so just maybe... Will say that Daicos could end up being in the top 5 father/sons though, lets see.

Top 5 father sons - MFC bias showing:

Gary Ablett snr and Gary Ablett jnr
Ron Barassi Sr and Ron Barassi Jr
Tim Watson and Jobe Watson
David Cloke and Travis Cloke
John Kennedy jnr and Josh Kennedy

Judd was a very average kick of the ball in the field of play. Many kicks over fwd heads or at their feet.
He even in an interview stated it was an area he was working on in his 3rd or 4th season.

 

[theyellowsash]

Perhaps, but you can't put a stat on class and skill. Which essentially Judd is saying about ND and also now even now Cooney.

But I suppose a random BF poster that can pick out stats has more weight than those two Brownlow medalists.

Fwiw, no I dont think he is the best of all tiem but find it amusing the lengths posters go to diminish what ND has done so far.

im not diminishing it, i already said he's very good. i just dont think he's that far out of the box, and showing that hes not definitively 'more damaging' than previous similar players

 

[theyellowsash]

I'm just going from memory here given they didn't record the stats back then (as far as I can see), but I would reckon Daicos is ahead in terms of score involvements, metres gained and intercepts. All indicative of valuable disposal.

Palmer was also not contributing to wins, which is obviously not an indicator of individual value, but nonetheless I think it's important to distinguish the value added to a 5 win side vs the value added to a 12+ win side.

so you're just going from memory of palmer, and claiming daicos is more damaging despite the recorded stats that shows palmer contributed to more goals and other important stats despite fewer disposals.

you do realise how silly that sounds, right? its like the climate change denier who claims its a hoax by looking out the weather at his window.

as for 'not contributing to wins', its not palmers fault the rest of his team wasnt as good. im pretty sure kicking goals contributes to winning games, of which palmer contributed more (let alone other important stats like clearances).

 

[Runk]

So he's better than Nathan Buckley?

 

[tenderwarrior]

Daicos may or may not be the best 1st year player of all time, but he might have the highest ceiling of all in contention.

 

[gouki88]

so you're just going from memory of palmer, and claiming daicos is more damaging despite the recorded stats that shows palmer contributed to more goals and other important stats despite fewer disposals.

you do realise how silly that sounds, right? its like the climate change denier who claims its a hoax by looking out the weather at his window.

as for 'not contributing to wins', its not palmers fault the rest of his team wasnt as good. im pretty sure kicking goals contributes to winning games, of which palmer contributed more (let alone other important stats like clearances).

How else is one supposed to go by it when there is no statistical comparison to be made? I wonder why a forward flanker would kick more goals than a back flanker Even then, Palmer never kicked multiple goals in a game (Daicos has played ~3 games with time spent up forward and already has).He's also averaged 6.9 intercept possessions over the 8 game winning streak, which is top 10% of the competition level elite.

That is one of the dumbest false equivalences I've ever read, haha. Nice try with that one though.

 

[bungalow_bill]

Wait until you see Will Ashcrofts first season next year.

Yep Will's first season will be God like.

Rising star is a foregone conclusion

 

[gouki88]

Yep Will's first season will be God like.

Rising star is a foregone conclusion

Genuine q - will he slot right into full-time midfield play at Brisbane? I have paid next to no attention to the non-KPP prospects of this draft.

 

[iameviljez]

John Colman 12 goals on debut and 100 for the season in the winning grand final team.
Daicos not even in the conversation.

Not just that, he did it in a 30 year period where nobody else kicked a century.

 

[gouki88]

Not just that, he did it in a 30 year period where nobody else kicked a century.

This is a complete aside, but this point is what bothers me about the comments we see about how "we'll never see another centurion season again". We went from getting them frequently from the likes of Coventry, Pratt and Todd in the 30s, to none besides Coleman for decades, to a boatload in the 70s-90s, to none for 15 years and none looking likely soon.

Very interesting fluctuations.

 

[Dewyyyyy]

Daicos may or may not be the best 1st year player of all time, but he might have the highest ceiling of all in contention.

That’s completely and purely subjective.

 

[Dewyyyyy]

Genuine q - will he slot right into full-time midfield play at Brisbane? I have paid next to no attention to the non-KPP prospects of this draft.

Yes. He did super well in their VFL side too this year. I compare him to someone like Brayshaw but with immediate impact and more like what Andy is now as the inside outside mid workhorse. Some have also said Sam Walsh.

 

[gouki88]

Yes. He did super well in their VFL side too this year. I compare him to someone like Brayshaw but with immediate impact and more like what Andy is now as the inside outside mid workhorse. Some have also said Sam Walsh.

Ta. I've seen some of the stats pop up here but it's hard to know without actually watching.

That'll be a nice pairing with Neale.

 

[Dewyyyyy]

Ta. I've seen some of the stats pop up here but it's hard to know without actually watching.

That'll be a nice pairing with Neale.

Yeah he’s very good. What’s even more freakish is the fact he’s still in a battle with Wardlaw for the number one talent imo, who’s very much like JHF but likely plays more midfield early and is more ready made.

It seems a good draft.

 

[augie]

He does play an easy role. Last 2 weeks he has played it very well, but that is against 2 of the 3 worst teams. One of them the worst team in many years.

Averages more touches against the top 4 than the rest.

 

[theyellowsash]

How else is one supposed to go by it when there is no statistical comparison to be made?

You're ignoring the statistical comparison i posted, that's why.

 

[DopeMaster]

so you're just going from memory of palmer, and claiming daicos is more damaging despite the recorded stats that shows palmer contributed to more goals and other important stats despite fewer disposals.

you do realise how silly that sounds, right? its like the climate change denier who claims its a hoax by looking out the weather at his window.

as for 'not contributing to wins', its not palmers fault the rest of his team wasnt as good. im pretty sure kicking goals contributes to winning games, of which palmer contributed more (let alone other important stats like clearances).

Ironic post. Someone is in denial, and its not the person you responded to...

 

[HeathySure]

Yep Will's first season will be God like.

Rising star is a foregone conclusion

I read on the weekend that he hasnt nominated as a father and son yet because he likes living in Melbourne. Is he a moral to go to Brisbane?