Is political correctness stifling debate?

(Log in to remove this ad.)

yebiga

Anglo Guilt - suck it up
Aug 1, 2008
10,621
11,188
Mens Gallery
AFL Club
Western Bulldogs
It has always been mind boggling to me how PC is propagated and defended by what appears otherwise to be sensible people. Having endured 12-13 years of catholic schooling I possess a well tuned radar for hypocrisy and imaginary thinking drenched in emotional garbage dressed up as love.

It’s not what is said - it’s what we don’t say that through out all of human history has always empowered hate.

PC advocates appear to me to have it backwards - they believe that if only the likes of hitler was not permitted to speak hatefully his like would never have achieved power. That is a naivety which only empowers tyranny. Tyrants will always find ways to express their hate - no matter what rules are implemented and then those same rules will only entrench the tyranny.
The truth is that every Hitler is only empowered because criticism was shut down, not permitted or tolerated. Silence is the empowerment of tyranny.

Imposing rules of speech is the very definition of tyranny.

Questioning everything underpins all of our human progress.

PC diminishes life making us timid fearful weak and childlike.
 

sorted

Norm Smith Medallist
Aug 21, 2016
5,715
7,253
AFL Club
Geelong
Questioning everything underpins all of our human progress.

PC diminishes life making us timid fearful weak and childlike.
It's nonsense. In a couple of decades the post modernists have thrown out every value we have accumulated over centuries. Every grand narrative destroyed. To be replaced by concepts of 'social justice'. The idea that people can be marginalised into different degrees of victimhood and that there exists some heightened moral knowledge that comes with being black or female or gay. Then once you assume that moral superiority you can not only claim power by asserting to be 'on the right side of history' but also prevent your opponents from expressing their views.

I believe the end story is that the left will eat itself and we will see the ridiculousness of this subjective, inhuman garbage. Like the current battle between men who want to be known as women, and women who disagree and have been hounded by men who want to be known as women. We also have parents who until yesterday have been trusted to have their children's best interests at heart being overruled by the state for ideological reasons.
 

Noidenous

Premiership Player
Apr 2, 2012
3,662
2,985
Melbourne
AFL Club
St Kilda
Other Teams
Green Bay Packers, Manchester UTD
It's nonsense. In a couple of decades the post modernists have thrown out every value we have accumulated over centuries. Every grand narrative destroyed. To be replaced by concepts of 'social justice'. The idea that people can be marginalised into different degrees of victimhood and that there exists some heightened moral knowledge that comes with being black or female or gay. Then once you assume that moral superiority you can not only claim power by asserting to be 'on the right side of history' but also prevent your opponents from expressing their views.

I believe the end story is that the left will eat itself and we will see the ridiculousness of this subjective, inhuman garbage. Like the current battle between men who want to be known as women, and women who disagree and have been hounded by men who want to be known as women. We also have parents who until yesterday have been trusted to have their children's best interests at heart being overruled by the state for ideological reasons.
The danger is in how much of that nonsense gets shoe-horned into legislation.

When every lawyer in town has been brainwashed with mandatory courses at university.
 

woota

Club Legend
Jun 27, 2015
1,287
953
AFL Club
West Coast
The danger is in how much of that nonsense gets shoe-horned into legislation.

When every lawyer in town has been brainwashed with mandatory courses at university.
People with the SJW mindset are taking over universities. The humanities are becoming SJW training camps. And these are the people who'll be unleashed into the public domain and responsible for creating our legislation in the future. Things aren't looking good.
 

medusala

Hall of Famer
Aug 14, 2004
35,485
6,626
Loftus Road
AFL Club
Hawthorn
David Jones' profit halved because department stores are going the way of the dinosaur, not because women sit on it's board.
Not just department stores it's most of retail. How can they compete with companies that pay no tax, no rates, no super etc etc? Obviously they cant.

Choice is

a) lower prices
b) decimation of retail, large job losses and large chunk of tax base.

At some stage someone is going to come down heavily on amazon, google, uber, ebay etc. It will be like breaking up Standard Oil.

 

(Log in to remove this ad.)

quotemokc

Brownlow Medallist
Jul 19, 2008
13,096
14,360
Perth
AFL Club
Essendon
Other Teams
Atlanta Falcons/Winnipeg Jets
Not just department stores it's most of retail. How can they compete with companies that pay no tax, no rates, no super etc etc? Obviously they cant.

Choice is

a) lower prices
b) decimation of retail, large job losses and large chunk of tax base.

At some stage someone is going to come down heavily on amazon, google, uber, ebay etc. It will be like breaking up Standard Oil.

Reckon we can add Disney to that list
 

medusala

Hall of Famer
Aug 14, 2004
35,485
6,626
Loftus Road
AFL Club
Hawthorn
Reckon we can add Disney to that list
Yeah theres prob a few more. Point is that its becoming a massive issue. Take the David JOnes example, they pay

co tax (well if they make a profit)
rates
salaries which are taxed
super
GST indirectly
etc etc

The tech giants are very good at avoiding most or all of those. The conumdrum is that people like the convenience and lower prices of Amazon etc.

I know its off topic but its the elephant in the room that noone (well maybe ex the French) want to address.
 

quotemokc

Brownlow Medallist
Jul 19, 2008
13,096
14,360
Perth
AFL Club
Essendon
Other Teams
Atlanta Falcons/Winnipeg Jets
Yeah theres prob a few more. Point is that its becoming a massive issue. Take the David JOnes example, they pay

co tax (well if they make a profit)
rates
salaries which are taxed
super
GST indirectly
etc etc

The tech giants are very good at avoiding most or all of those. The conumdrum is that people like the convenience and lower prices of Amazon etc.

I know its off topic but its the elephant in the room that noone (well maybe ex the French) want to address.
Consumers can be their own worst enemy.

Ever complained about how your new fridge or oven doesn't last 15 years like the one you grew up with?

Maybe if you were willing to spend more for a quality product instead of always looking for a bargain you might get a better product.

But yes, it is off topic.
 

medusala

Hall of Famer
Aug 14, 2004
35,485
6,626
Loftus Road
AFL Club
Hawthorn
Ever complained about how your new fridge or oven doesn't last 15 years like the one you grew up with?
Grievance culture and pc are bedfellows.

Personal responsibility is an archaic notion these days.


Maybe if you were willing to spend more for a quality product instead of always looking for a bargain you might get a better product.
A chap on UK tv did a short series on chickens ie how they were reared. He was arguing the PC position that everyone should buy free range (ie reared outdoors chickens). All well and good until he met some working class consumers.

"Why would I pay £10 for an organic chook when I can get 2 frozen ones for £4 at iceland".
 

CheapCharlie

Premiership Player
Jun 12, 2015
4,919
5,196
AFL Club
Sydney
Not just department stores it's most of retail. How can they compete with companies that pay no tax, no rates, no super etc etc? Obviously they cant.

Choice is

a) lower prices
b) decimation of retail, large job losses and large chunk of tax base.

At some stage someone is going to come down heavily on amazon, google, uber, ebay etc. It will be like breaking up Standard Oil.

They operate with an unfair advantage
 

sorted

Norm Smith Medallist
Aug 21, 2016
5,715
7,253
AFL Club
Geelong
The Conversation is now named ironically.

At The Conversation Australia we’ve recently vowed to improve our climate change coverage, and part of that means moderating comments with a similar degree of rigour.​
Once upon a time, we might have viewed climate sceptics as merely frustrating. We relied on other commenters and authors to rebut sceptics and deniers, which often lead to endless back and forth.​
But it’s 2019, and now we know better. Climate change deniers, and those shamelessly peddling pseudoscience and misinformation, are perpetuating ideas that will ultimately destroy the planet. As a publisher, giving them a voice on our site contributes to a stalled public discourse.​
That’s why the editorial team in Australia is implementing a zero-tolerance approach to moderating climate change deniers, and sceptics. Not only will we be removing their comments, we’ll be locking their accounts.


 

JackOutback

Brownlow Medallist
Sep 15, 2011
18,885
23,549
AFL Club
West Coast
It’s over the top but climate changer deniers are basically ruining any attempt at rational ‘conversation’. Should anti-vaxxers and flat earthers get equal time at the table?
 

Noidenous

Premiership Player
Apr 2, 2012
3,662
2,985
Melbourne
AFL Club
St Kilda
Other Teams
Green Bay Packers, Manchester UTD
It’s over the top but climate changer deniers are basically ruining any attempt at rational ‘conversation’. Should anti-vaxxers and flat earthers get equal time at the table?
Anyone who can point out where climate change sensationalists have clearly doctored the data to suit their narrative should be allowed to speak.

Climate change is not the absolutist disaster that AOC and Al Gore would have everyone believe.

That's akin to declaring that anyone siding with the grievance studies hoaxers should be silenced. Vegans run around spouting the same brand of nonsense that intersectional feminists do. Should we silence anyone who questions their data?
 

Deadpool

Senior List
Jun 3, 2015
266
272
AFL Club
Gold Coast
Yes, yes and yes.



This isn't it, though. In the 1990s it was OK (well, more accurately no one spoke up about it) to call Nicky Winmar or Chris Lewis a boong or an abo. Now it is not. That isn't political correctness, it's progress.

These days we are outraged about ******* everything. See the yellow peril thread. Easter eggs are sold without 'Easter' marketing. Schools don't celebrate Christmas for fear of offending someone. I was a kid in the 1990s. If you didn't celebrate Christmas or Easter then you didn't celebrate them. The onus wasn't on everyone else to abandon cultural traditions for fear of someone's feelings getting hurt.

If you criticise anyone that isn't a white, straight, middle class male for anything then someone, somewhere will get on their soapbox and drag race, sex, gender, sexuality, religion etc. into it. It's tiresome and absolutely stifles debate.
Too true. I saw a kid use the term "Abo" and was aut0omatically shocked. Until I found out she was indigenous and just used that term to express who she was. Good on her. She didn't feel constrained by the media and by political correctness.

Whats worse is that two wrongs seem to make a right to the left. Its okay to abuse white people and to celebrate their demise. Why? Because white people, history, slavery etc. Its okay to abuse men. Why? Because men, history, mysgony etc. Its okay to sexually harass straight guys and protest straight parades. Why? Because straight people, history homophobia.

It gets to the point where it is just white noise. However I did have some young Muslim women in the library the other day whisper and point at me (while they were having a discussion about racism in Australia ironically) and whisper and call me a "school shooter". My crime? Doing some research plus I perked up once when I heard them start seething about white men.

My privilege allows me to complain to the Middle Eastern security guys (there are two) and being told to shut up and leave them alone (despite not ever saying a word to them).
 

Deadpool

Senior List
Jun 3, 2015
266
272
AFL Club
Gold Coast
Anyone who can point out where climate change sensationalists have clearly doctored the data to suit their narrative should be allowed to speak.

Climate change is not the absolutist disaster that AOC and Al Gore would have everyone believe.

That's akin to declaring that anyone siding with the grievance studies hoaxers should be silenced. Vegans run around spouting the same brand of nonsense that intersectional feminists do. Should we silence anyone who questions their data?
No, but what is worse is denying that climate change exists.

Lets just agree that it does and move to adapt out economies for everyone's sake before it get 0out of hand.
 

Noidenous

Premiership Player
Apr 2, 2012
3,662
2,985
Melbourne
AFL Club
St Kilda
Other Teams
Green Bay Packers, Manchester UTD
No, but what is worse is denying that climate change exists.

Lets just agree that it does and move to adapt out economies for everyone's sake before it get 0out of hand.
I think you'll find that bottling/containing a massive quantity of the planet's water that would otherwise be in smaller deposits on land, and now can't evaporate into the atmosphere, has much more of an effect than carbon emission.

Not to mention the changes to the water table created by mass-sewerage as the world urbanises.
 

Top Bottom