Opinion Is the game dead?

catscollector

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Yet the Richmond side of today would beat and physically bully the Geelong sides of the 90s
Yep, that is usually what happens when 3 decades have transpired and human beings get taller and stronger.

Snr would still s**t on Rance though. Rance just ain't the best one-on-one defender going around and unfortunately for Richmond's sake, you would need that against an explosive footballer of his caliber.
 

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Captain_Bender

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Yep, that is usually what happens when 3 decades have transpired and human beings get taller and stronger.

Snr would still s**t on Rance though. Rance just ain't the best one-on-one defender going around and unfortunately for Richmond's sake, you would need that against an explosive footballer of his caliber.
Rance has toweled up Hawkins multiple times who is bigger and stronger than Ablett who wouldn't even have the fitness to be at Rance's level
 

catscollector

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Rance has toweled up Hawkins multiple times who is bigger and stronger than Ablett who wouldn't even have the fitness to be at Rance's level
Don't get me wrong, Hawkins is a very good footballer but he's one-dimensional. No left side to constantly worry the opposition and once the ball hits the deck, he's relatively out of the contest and needs the smalls around him to chip in.
Snr would have moved around and with a lightning first step, and no holding the man/jumper, he would have a field day against Rance if the midfield supply was solid.

Rance on Brownless would be a great battle.
Scarlett would have kept Snr to Silvagni-like stats as he's a much better one-on-one defender than Rance ever was.
 

Vassp

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I can’t think of any defender today who would physically bully Ablett Snr, a solid 97kg player with a very physical side to his game. And not sure someone would bring up Hawkins in responsive to Ablett’s explosiveness.
Both Rance and Ablett are physically very strong no doubt, it would be an interesting battle. but defenders these days can’t pull and grab forwards like they used to, Silvani played to the rules back then which afforded him much more options in how to stop a forward, most defenders in this day and age don’t have that luxury.
 

Monkey King

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Both Rance and Ablett are physically very strong no doubt, it would be an interesting battle. but defenders these can’t pull and grab forwards like they used to, Silvani plaid to the rules back then which afforded him much more option in how to stop a forward, most defenders in this day and age don’t have that luxury.
That’s not exactly what used to happen, but you’re right, it’s a different game. Today defenders still gets to put some physical touch on, but not nearly as much, and instead might expect a chop out or block from a teammate, a bit of pressure on the incoming kick and less space to control. I think the one-on-one physical style with more space to exploit better suits Ablett, and the team defence style controlling space does Rance.
 

Vassp

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That’s not exactly what used to happen, but you’re right, it’s a different game. Today defenders still gets to put some physical touch on, but not nearly as much, and instead might expect a chop out or block from a teammate, a bit of pressure on the incoming kick and less space to control. I think the one-on-one physical style with more space to exploit better suits Ablett, and the team defence style controlling space does Rance.
I think what Rance does is harder, his roll is a total defence.21st century style.
 

Seeds

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It's not dead, it is just being run by morons. The game is so easy to fix and it doesn't need a competition committee.

1. Get rid of prior opp - all the congestion, stoppage and low scoring problems have evolved from this crap rule about 20 years ago. Why should a player have a god given right to just hatch it because he got to the ball first?

2. Get rid of ruck nominations - it wastes time and creates additional numbers around the ball. Umps should just throw it up immediately there is a ball up.

3. Reduce rotations down to 10 per qtr. Tired legs will promote more positional play.

4. Last possession out of bounds is a free to the opposition. Make the rule black and white. It will promote corridor footy and less throw ins will reduce stoppages and congestion.

Constant ball movement is the key. Remove all obstacles that allow coaches to block the game up and slow it down.

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1. Will just result in no one grabbing the ball in a pack. It will look embarrassing.

The other fixes are minor and wont change much.

One rule change will fix everything. No marks from a kick unless it goes 25 metres. Will stop teams from going backwards to switch play. Will stop the boring chip chip kicking game. Will lead to teams using hand ball more to break lines and to kick the ball long and direct down the guts to packs. It will bring the speccy back.
 

Monkey King

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I think what Rance does is harder, his roll is a total defence.21st century style.
And yet I’d say it would put him at a fair disadvantage against a player with Ablett Snr’s attributes should he be forced into what you regard the easier role. All I know is when I played footy I generally found it easier going when my teammates could assist in closing space and intercepting than being left one-out in space.
 

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Bunk Moreland

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I think what Rance does is harder, his roll is a total defence.21st century style.
Interesting the other night when Chris Scott and Worsfold were on 360. Both played in the 90s and coach now, Scott said he though defenders have it easier individually now as they work as a unit and aren’t left one-out.

But physically it’s a lot harder as they have to run so much more.

Scott said in the 90s he actually lined up as a forward one day (playing on Worsfold) and they just stood 20 metres out from goal all day. That doesn’t happen any more.
 

NetworkNerd

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Went to the Hawthorn v Collingwood and also Carlton v Melbourne games on the weekend gone by.

Within both those games you had both sides of this argument. Terrible skills for 3/4 of the game then a big comeback and an amazing last quarter from both sides.

More games like that every week and the game wont be anywhere near dead for a long time. That being said the days of going to the football to see a full forward kick a bag of 7-10 goals appear to be behind us.
 

iluvparis

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More games like that every week and the game wont be anywhere near dead for a long time. That being said the days of going to the football to see a full forward kick a bag of 7-10 goals appear to be behind us.
how is this a positive? You may as well just start the game at 3/4 time then - people will get sick of watching 3/4s of inept garbage just to have an 'exciting' finish
 

catscollector

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how is this a positive? You may as well just start the game at 3/4 time then - people will get sick of watching 3/4s of inept garbage just to have an 'exciting' finish
Why do teams with superior defensive structures (whom have drafted such a way) have to be brought back to the pack by the AFL with rule changes just so we get closer, even games?
I'm very bewildered why this current AFL hierarchy have decided to implement such rules when the game has been just fine over 100 years previously.

I truly wish another league is launched. Not like the VFL/WAFL/SANFL but one which takes us back to the old days. Bumps, speccies and less off field media hypocrisy.
A bunch of millionaires could only do such a thing.
Over in America, rap artists create their own tournaments how they want and when they want.

Perhaps Sam Newman and a clan of his friends could look at it if they dislike the current game as much as they say they do.
 

FlowersByIrene

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I've been forced to only watch my own team this season (and keep track of other games where I can) and I still consider the games my team is in to be as intense and enjoyable as ever, but can't really comment on how enjoyable other games are to watch because I honestly haven't watched a whole lot this season.
 

ShadeyP

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Seems to be more love for the 16 a side game now than we've seen in the many previous discussions re the state of the game/congestion footy. We already know it works, the VFA played 16-a-side from 1959 until 1992, so it doesn't need to be trialled, just implemented, like the 6-6-6 was this year.
5-6-5 - frees up the congestion forward for setups and creates more space overall . Needs to happen .
6 players on the bench and cut it to 60 rotations .
 

josephine666

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Why do teams with superior defensive structures (whom have drafted such a way) have to be brought back to the pack by the AFL with rule changes just so we get closer, even games?
I'm very bewildered why this current AFL hierarchy have decided to implement such rules when the game has been just fine over 100 years previously.

I truly wish another league is launched. Not like the VFL/WAFL/SANFL but one which takes us back to the old days. Bumps, speccies and less off field media hypocrisy.
A bunch of millionaires could only do such a thing.
Over in America, rap artists create their own tournaments how they want and when they want.

Perhaps Sam Newman and a clan of his friends could look at it if they dislike the current game as much as they say they do.
I'd donate
 

Sedat!

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Prior opportunity existed before the mid-00s. Are you saying there were never ballups for a player being tackled in the 90s?
It was policed much differently, and I don't recall a rule ever being called 'prior opp'. Basically if there was an instantaneous possession and tackle involving 2 players the umpire would ball it up right away. The concept of waiting an extra 3-4 seconds for prior opp only succeeds in getting more players within a 10m radius of the ball - cue repeat stoppages and added congestion.
 

Sedat!

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1. Will just result in no one grabbing the ball in a pack. It will look embarrassing.
There would rarely be a pack - that's the problem right there. I hate packs and I hate tackles inside packs - the only tackles I love are run-down tackles chasing from behind.
 

Franko Armani

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Ok, I can tell you why the game is currently as f’ed as it is, but you must listen and consider what I say..

It’s not the coaching that has f’ed the game. The rules do not need to be changed. The game can evolve of it’s own volition.

1. The players are too fit nowadays which is actually detrimental to the beauty of the game we once enjoyed, say up until the late 90’s - mid 00’s.

Players have become full time/ultra professional since say the mid 90’s onwards. Access to the players from the club & coaches increases to levels that we would never have imagined say in the 80’s (often considered the glory period of the game).

Every facet of a players conditioning is assessed, studied and optimised for maximum endurance performance out on the field and in turn this has lead to the extremely high number of interchanges that we have seen this decade.

Players cover the ground and can run both ways like they were never able to in the past because of the above factors and this is the key reason the game is played out as it is currently. The fact that players are such athletes actually impedes the style of the game that most people would like to watch. Players can’t get space on the ground for genuine 1 on 1 contests like in the past because of the above.

Further to this

2. Clubs recruit athletes nowadays not footballers. You would be lucky to just be a smart, tough footballer with high level skills and be recruited and succeed ala Luke Hodge or J. Selwood. Clubs just pick a prototype that they can get to run, repeat sprint, only need to get to contests (don’t worry about taking contested marks or speccys),every club has the same prototypes out there. Guys that mostly are picked for height/endurance/tank not guys that have instinctively held a footy in their arms since the age of 4 or 5 rather the robots that we have running around out there now who are plucked in their late teens by recruiters because they fit the prototype not because they are actually even competent at kicking or hand balling a football. Of course this is also a major contributing factor to the detriment of the game as a spectacle.

Imagine if each side put out 18 highly skilled footballers each week - wouldn’t that be great to watch? Well it ******* was in the 80’s and 90’s as I remember! There are a lot of prototypes playing senior AFL footy that are crab footballers that would never have been given a game 20- 30 years ago. We have 4-5 playing in our senior side as we speak - they are not in the team for their footballing skills as that is a secondary matter for an AFL coach in 2019.

By becoming Uber professional highly developed Athletes with ultra analysed on field performance and tactics to counter any changes in game development/rules, this is what we are left with. Some people prefer the game like it is currently, no doubt. But many are bemoaning the state of the game, even the controlling body itself. However, bringing in new rules and changing the structure or format of the game will never improve the outcome of the spectacle in the way we wish it to. I do believe reducing interchange to as low as Bartlett spruiked a few years ago (maybe 20 per team a game) will change the style of the game due to fatigue though the skills would be even worse than they are right now with the current “breed” of “footballer” we have created.

The only way we’ll ever see the game in the beautiful style we once witnessed and envision now is to drastically reduce the level of professionalism. Yes, it sounds stupid but... if players were only able to train 2-3 times a week and have their time at the club capped to something like 10-15 hours a week along with recruiting actual skilled footy players (would be a necessity with limited time at the club being unable to maintain elite athletic programs) and reduced interchange then just imagine what the game might look like?

Mega rant over.
In short - recruit real footy players over pure athletes. Limit time at club.
Back in the golden days of Aussie Rules each team fielded 18 gun footballers who’d use their skill, grit and determination to beat the opposing 18 gun footballers - nothing more, nothing less.
 

dergert

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I love where the game is at now, except for the stupid HTB and taking possesion from the ruck umpire intrepretations.

Screw the naysayers.
 

Kwality

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Don't get me wrong, Hawkins is a very good footballer but he's one-dimensional. No left side to constantly worry the opposition and once the ball hits the deck, he's relatively out of the contest and needs the smalls around him to chip in.
Snr would have moved around and with a lightning first step, and no holding the man/jumper, he would have a field day against Rance if the midfield supply was solid.

Rance on Brownless would be a great battle.
Scarlett would have kept Snr to Silvagni-like stats as he's a much better one-on-one defender than Rance ever was.
Ash McIntosh says hi.
 

Shane Heard

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I’ve always been a fan of needing to have at least 3 on 3 inside the arcs at all times. I don’t see what is wrong with enforcing that rule. As well as retaining the standard 6-6-6 for centre bounces.
Obviously you’ve never had kids and experienced the ridiculous sight of players running up to a line and stopping because the ball is a meter away in the no go zone?

We can’t have zones in general play in our game. Fine for just before the bounce, but once it’s on you have to allow players the absolute freedom of wandering whenever they want.

It’s the fundamental essence of Australian Rules Football.

Total freedom to move around.

I just can’t understand why you would suggest such a ridiculous thing.

You’re not the first obviously. But it boggles the mind every time I see it written.

No offence of course...
 
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