Is this Freo's best ever list?

[FreoRicci]

I think we're forgetting how good we were in 1997 like when we smashed the Bombers. The team that day was:

B: Chisholm O'Reilly Parker
HB: Black Carroll McGovern
C: Dhurrkay Allan Toia
HF: Callaghan Bandy Leach
F: Leach Hunter Abraham
R: Burton Mitchell Wills
I/C: White Harding Kickett Clement

But in all serious, our 2003-2009 team was fairly strong and makes you wonder if a more accomplised coach could have done something with us.

Pav was at the peak of his powers in that period. Mid 20s. McPharlin as forward under Connolly/Harvey always pissed me off. MJ was played there too. Never understood that, to this day. Wasted chance that. 2005-2008 was really open too.

We’ve never had a great forward line for a long stretch. Pav and Longmuir with Farmer was alright. But couldn’t get on the park enough. Medhurst was moved on too soon. Murphy was touted as the next thing, then was Adam Campbell. Never really got there. Alas that’s the past. Now though, 2019 is about the best forward line as a member tbh. Top line A grader in Hogan combined with Tabs. Matera kicking goals and McCarthy getting there. Add in Walters for substance and Switter for pressure. About as exciting as I can remember.
In 2013- it was Pav, Mayne, Ballas, Clarke. Workmanlike but we were always one more tall away. Clarke couldn’t mark nor compete. Thoroughly believe if we had got a fit Kepler Bradley, would’ve been a lot different. This forward line this season, not only Can we defend 2012-2016 style but also dominate the scoreboard. 2013 we limited the opportunities so much that we barely even kicked more points. Ugly but effective.

One sly dig at Duffield. He was owned by Gunston in 201 GF. And soft too. Great ball user though. Luke Ryan would’ve made a huge scrap of it. He’s not easily beaten. One gripe is that McPhee left 2012 too soon. He was definitely well missed in 2013.

The midfield is the let down this season then 2013. Stephen hill injured, Blakely an unknown, Cerra is playing half back, Brayshaw is barely even where he will be. A 34 year old Mundy is our second best mid.
That’s the one pitfall whereas it was our significant strength in 2013. Fyfe, Mundy, Barlow, Suban, Hill, Mzungu. Everyone was elite in their areas. Suban and Mzungu underrated in that they were competitive never give in types. Don’t have that now. Conca maybe, but that’s it.

 

[theGav56]

I think we're forgetting how good we were in 1997 like when we smashed the Bombers. The team that day was:

B: Chisholm O'Reilly Parker
HB: Black Carroll McGovern
C: Dhurrkay Allan Toia
HF: Callaghan Bandy Leach
F: Leach Hunter Abraham
R: Burton Mitchell Wills
I/C: White Harding Kickett Clement

But in all serious, our 2003-2009 team was fairly strong and makes you wonder if a more accomplised coach could have done something with us.

So lucky to have had Leach.

 

[gaskin]

Better list... debatable. More even list? Yes. Our best aren't as good but our worst aren't as bad.

This is the correct answer.

 

[PapaJ]

In the words of Reverend Lovejoy; "yes" with an "if." Long answer, "no" with a "but."
Yes, IF it continues on this trajectory: We seem to want to be more focused, with more intent on spreading the load. 2012-2015 Pav, McPharlin, Johnno, Mundy, S.Hill, Duffield, Sandilands, Barlow and potentially AA Ballantyne and 2013 Ibbotson could all arguably be walk-up starters in our current team.

Ross seems to have identified the big weaknesses that saw us fall short, so here's my IF's*
IF#1 Lack of fwd support: We don't have a "PAV" like player anymore. One could suggest that Hogan could become that, but it's not necessary anymore. With our goalkicking potency this season, it's obvious we identified we can't be focused on one player, despite him being in the top 10 players ever to play AFL (this is not an argument, just a fact and you will never change my mind).
IF#2 No more reliance on stoppages: We've clearly deviated from that gameplan, despite what some people may believe. We now don't block the way for Fyfe/S.Hill. We now seem to get ourselves in a winning position through the duration of the game, and not rely on stoppages and mauls to transfer the play.
IF#3 Less negating players: Let me be clear, I loved Dawson/Crowley/Suban etc. Crowley, Dawson were all lockdown/role players and were brilliant at the roles they were assigned, however, it meant Fyfe/Mundy/Hill had to work harder to create the results. I probably love Suban more than most, but we seem to have transitioned from having more than 1 or 2 negating players. Hamling/Pearce can both play a role outside their spoils. Conca can also distribute the ball as well as block, Tucker/Banfield can tag but don't, Ross trusts our mids to break even.
If#4: The spread is more even: Our bottom 6 won't be predominantly foot soldiers. Suban, Mzungu, DeBoer, C.Peierce, Mayne (brilliant 2013/14, 2015 became mainly a tackler with fewer goals). I think we've tried to lessen the top 6 to the bottom 6, hopefully, it's a successful model.

So short answer....No, BUT; we could be.

*I'm completely aware I'm talking out of my arse.

QFT ... plus I love the Rev. Lovejoy quote.

As a couple have said, my first thought when I read the thread title went to the 03-08 teams ... I'm not even sure the current one is as good as those. As a complete organisation, I think we're better; much better coach, facilities, systems etc., but the list between 05-08 underperformed IMHO.

Then you've got the more recent 2012-15 team which represents our most successful period. FreoRicci has got it spot on, the current team might be better in certain areas, but as a unit, that midfield was fierce machine with all the parts working as they should, where as the current one is working, but its a bit makeshift. It's not bedded down and anywhere near as reliable.

 

[Schauermann]

Well, not sure. Looking not bad, but our midfield ist pretty thin atm. A few youngster need to step up quickly. So much talk about rebuild, but Fyfe and Walters peaking now, not in a few years. Really a balance act where alot has to go right...

 

[freo84]

On potential it could be... maybe

It's the most balanced that I can remember. Depth is quite good and each line has talent.

Can we revisit this question at the end of the season?

 

[Farrand]

Pav was at the peak of his powers in that period. Mid 20s. McPharlin as forward under Connolly/Harvey always pissed me off. MJ was played there too. Never understood that, to this day. Wasted chance that. 2005-2008 was really open too.

Yep. Realistically we should have made the grannie in 2006 and been in contention 2005, 2007 and 2008. 2006 especially we were awesome and playing cohesive football in the second part of the season but as soon as we got to the finals all that consistenty fell away and bar the Melbourne win we were done heavily. Didn't have much of a forward line but the spread of goal kickers was a massive positive at the time.

 

[Farrand]

So lucky to have had Leach.

He'll always have kicking the goal after the siren against the Lions.

 

[more_of_bito]

Only way for this list is to be a best, is to better the 2013 GF losing side.

Win a GF and will be a better list.

 

[Fat Nyfe]

Possibly the most balanced list.

We have quality KPDs - Pearce, Hamling
Quality half backs - Ryan, Wilson
Inside mids - Fyfe, Blakely, Mundy
Outside - Hill(s), Langdon
Smalls - Walters, Matera, Ballas
KPFs - Hogan, Tabs, McCarthy
Rucks - Lobb, Darcy

As well as good youth who have shown they can step into those roles with Brayshaw, Cerra, Cox, Switta.
The role players/depth/bottom 6 who fill out the rest of the team are also better as someone mentioned.

To improve we go after some skilled mids both inside and outside. That’s probably where our depth is weakest. Tucker is doing his bit but I’m not sold on him becoming the A grader we’re looking for. I think we make this a focus at both the draft and trade period (specifically targeting Kelly and Coniglio)

 

[Ysaye]

Pav was at the peak of his powers in that period. Mid 20s. McPharlin as forward under Connolly/Harvey always pissed me off. MJ was played there too. Never understood that, to this day. Wasted chance that. 2005-2008 was really open too.

We’ve never had a great forward line for a long stretch. Pav and Longmuir with Farmer was alright. But couldn’t get on the park enough. Medhurst was moved on too soon. Murphy was touted as the next thing, then was Adam Campbell. Never really got there. Alas that’s the past. Now though, 2019 is about the best forward line as a member tbh. Top line A grader in Hogan combined with Tabs. Matera kicking goals and McCarthy getting there. Add in Walters for substance and Switter for pressure. About as exciting as I can remember.
In 2013- it was Pav, Mayne, Ballas, Clarke. Workmanlike but we were always one more tall away. Clarke couldn’t mark nor compete. Thoroughly believe if we had got a fit Kepler Bradley, would’ve been a lot different. This forward line this season, not only Can we defend 2012-2016 style but also dominate the scoreboard. 2013 we limited the opportunities so much that we barely even kicked more points. Ugly but effective.

One sly dig at Duffield. He was owned by Gunston in 201 GF. And soft too. Great ball user though. Luke Ryan would’ve made a huge scrap of it. He’s not easily beaten. One gripe is that McPhee left 2012 too soon. He was definitely well missed in 2013.

The midfield is the let down this season then 2013. Stephen hill injured, Blakely an unknown, Cerra is playing half back, Brayshaw is barely even where he will be. A 34 year old Mundy is our second best mid.
That’s the one pitfall whereas it was our significant strength in 2013. Fyfe, Mundy, Barlow, Suban, Hill, Mzungu. Everyone was elite in their areas. Suban and Mzungu underrated in that they were competitive never give in types. Don’t have that now. Conca maybe, but that’s it.

You forgot Crowley - it is a massive help when you can limit their most damaging midfielder to half of what they normally get but also have in that same package the weaponry to bob up for a couple of goals here and there to rub salt into the wounds.

 

[Deanismyhero]

Better list... debatable. More even list? Yes. Our best aren't as good but our worst aren't as bad.

This is it. Definitely think the individual players in this team have more upside.

 

[Mr Fonebone]

If we can add Coniglio or Kelly and get another good kpd as backup then .
Yes

 

[fnerd]

I think we're forgetting how good we were in 1997 like when we smashed the Bombers. The team that day was:

B: Chisholm O'Reilly Parker
HB: Black Carroll McGovern
C: Dhurrkay Allan Toia
HF: Callaghan Bandy Leach
F: Leach Hunter Abraham
R: Burton Mitchell Wills
I/C: White Harding Kickett Clement

But in all serious, our 2003-2009 team was fairly strong and makes you wonder if a more accomplised coach could have done something with us.

Oh to see that name on our list again now

 

[fnerd]

If we can add Coniglio or Kelly and get another good kpd as backup then .
Yes

Yeah pretty much.
I’d add to that maybe another very quick small fwd(bolten or ahchee?) as well.
The cogs decision is the deal breaker. For 1 he’s twice the player Kelly is , would come free (most likely) meaning we can still take in all likelihood a draft pick 8-12, grab another young kpb/ruck with our second(around p25) list Liam Henry,then use the following years 2nd for a bolten or ahchee .
List complete-
Premiership here we come!!

 

[PapaJ]

Yeah pretty much.
I’d add to that maybe another very quick small fwd(bolten or ahchee?) as well.
The cogs decision is the deal breaker. For 1 he’s twice the player Kelly is , would come free (most likely) meaning we can still take in all likelihood a draft pick 8-12, grab another young kpb/ruck with our second(around p25) list Liam Henry,then use the following years 2nd for a bolten or ahchee .
List complete-
Premiership here we come!!

Free in terms of picks is what is what I assume you mean, but there will be a cost. He'll put a massive hole in the salary cap of wherever he ends up signing.

But yes, we're that sort of quality mid away from having the package in that area.

 

[theGav56]

I'm not sure that he comes pick free either. GWS have the dollars to match the bid and force a trade.

I also think the massive salary we would need to front in order to get him will have salary repercussions for us over time. Have a look at the future costs for Sydney with Buddy and the Bulldogs with Boyd.

 

[fnerd]

I'm not sure that he comes pick free either. GWS have the dollars to match the bid and force a trade.

I also think the massive salary we would need to front in order to get him will have salary repercussions for us over time. Have a look at the future costs for Sydney with Buddy and the Bulldogs with Boyd.

Yeah I did say , most likely (only Dangerfield so far has been matched tho) but yes it’s a still real possibility , especially if gws finish high up this year (fair chance) so the compo pick wouldnt exactly be much.
That said the trade would in all likelihood still be unders(see Dangerfield trade again)

Hear what saying bout buddy and boyds but there very much at the extreme end and as much as cogs will command I can’t see it getting quite near those deals-certainly not in length of contract.
Finally loading up for a flag tilt is all about timing and it’s not exactly every year a player of the caliber of Coniglio comes up , much less then from WA.

It’s a moot point regardless-If cogs somehow decides on us we ll be doing the deal ,end of.

 

[theGav56]

I don't want to create the impression I would be unhappy if we somehow landed Coniglio, and I do have faith in our list management. Will be interesting to see what players end up in the market.

Re Dangerfield, technically he wasn't matched, and was just a trade. Funny system.

 

[Freomaniac]

I think we're forgetting how good we were in 1997 like when we smashed the Bombers. The team that day was:

B: Chisholm O'Reilly Parker
HB: Black Carroll McGovern
C: Dhurrkay Allan Toia
HF: Callaghan Bandy Leach
F: Leach Hunter Abraham
R: Burton Mitchell Wills
I/C: White Harding Kickett Clement

But in all serious, our 2003-2009 team was fairly strong and makes you wonder if a more accomplised coach could have done something with us.

I have posted this many times.....

We under achieved in that Chris Connolly era of 2002-07.

Should of made finals every year from 2003-07. we were capable enough as well but didnt play our best consistently in that period

 

[Joao]

The shame of OP comparing Hogan to Pav.

Hogan should be compared to Anthony or Gumbleton.